Justin Thomas Curses and in 2021 Uses Homophobic Slurs

[StuM]

2 minutes ago, mclaren4life said:

For the folks that say it can hurt the ability to grow the game, why do you think that would happen? Honestly i don’t see it hurting the growth. There are other things that I think hurt it more. 

I believe it hurts the ability to grow the game if a parent, any parent, stops their child from watching the PGA due to the "Dirty Words" or if they are hesitant to take them to a course or a practice range for fear of hearing the words. I know many will not care and I know the kids will hear the words somewhere but it does not need to be in golf.  We need young players and anything that inhibits them from coming into the sport hurts the sport, even if just one person.  

Yelling a curse word does not help any player I have seen play better.  Not cursing is not going to cause them to play worse.  Not cursing is not going to hurt anyone.

Again, I am not expecting perfection and absolute sterile language with no personality.  I understand an occasional "Heat of battle/Emotion" occurrence.  I am just saying do not make it a habit and show some consideration for what may offend others.

 

[mclaren4life]

2 minutes ago, StuM said:

I believe it hurts the ability to grow the game if a parent, any parent, stops their child from watching the PGA due to the "Dirty Words" or if they are hesitant to take them to a course or a practice range for fear of hearing the words. I know many will not care and I know the kids will hear the words somewhere but it does not need to be in golf.  We need young players and anything that inhibits them from coming into the sport hurts the sport, even if just one person.  

Yelling a curse word does not help any player I have seen play better.  Not cursing is not going to cause them to play worse.  Not cursing is not going to hurt anyone.

Again, I am not expecting perfection and absolute sterile language with no personality.  I understand an occasional "Heat of battle/Emotion" occurrence.  I am just saying do not make it a habit and show some consideration for what may offend others.

 

Well if bad language deterred parents no “sporting” area is safe. Golf isn’t any different than any sport. No video game consoles would be sold. All movies would be G rated. I think the perceived issue with bad language is over blown. For your statement than you have never seen anybody play better after cursing, what kind of metric are you using to measure that? Or is that just something to say like defense wins championships that isn’t backed up by actual data? 

[No Mulligans]

I think it's a problem when I do it.  At least for me it's not very effective as a release, it just puts me more on edge which is bad for my game.  It's also a little bit uncomfortable for others to be around an emotional outburst.  It's not so much the F word for me, after all it's just a word, it's the emotional outburst, not fun to be around, not fun to watch... unless you get joy from others pain.

Edited August 13, 2020 by No Mulligans

[mclaren4life]

6 minutes ago, No Mulligans said:

I think it's a problem when I do it.  At least for me it's not very effective as a release, it just puts me more on edge which is bad for my game.  It's also a little bit uncomfortable for others to be around an emotional outburst.  It's not so much the F word for me, after all it's just a word, it's the emotional outburst, not fun to be around, not fun to watch... unless you get joy from others pain.

So just say I smash one into the woods on the first tee box and I yell out rocky road ice cream. Is that an issue? 

[David in FL]

No problem

[gbogey]

5 hours ago, TN94z said:

I voted no. I would be hypocritical if I voted yes.

Unfortunately I totally agree although I wish I couldn't.

The problem is boom mikes - not everything is meant to be heard. There should be some private time - I blame the networks for not being on guard.

[Patch]

It's not a problem for me to hear cuss words. I use them also. 

Movies are full of cuss words. Why not TV?

[StuM]

59 minutes ago, mclaren4life said:

Well if bad language deterred parents no “sporting” area is safe. Golf isn’t any different than any sport. No video game consoles would be sold. All movies would be G rated. I think the perceived issue with bad language is over blown. For your statement than you have never seen anybody play better after cursing, what kind of metric are you using to measure that? Or is that just something to say like defense wins championships that isn’t backed up by actual data? 

I can't point to any evidence since I doubt there has ever been a study of how well a player plays after cursing.  From my personal experience I cannot see where I ever golfed better after letting one slip.  Usually the opposite occurs and my frustration begins to take over my emotions. Taking a deep breath, settling down, then moving on has better success for me.

Again, I think some are taking me to mean "Never Ever utter a curse word".  That is not what I am saying and was clear in my initial post when I referenced "Frequency".  My concern would be with using it over and over, not an occasional emotional burst.  I am not looking for golf to be some sterile environment like in the movie Pleasentville, just do not think it is good to have the F-bomb dropped repeatedly.

This is a little off topic but there was a guy in our league that would frequently throw his clubs....and I mean 40 yard tosses.  It occurred in virtually every round.  Some where along the line he was talked to and is much for fun to golf with today.  It is OK to show emotion, but I do not feel you should let emotions take control of you. 

There have been only 2 things I have been saying since the beginning:

1) Do not be excessive.

2) Be considerate of others

[phillyk]

Just now, StuM said:

I can't point to any evidence since I doubt there has ever been a study of how well a player plays after cursing.  From my personal experience I cannot see where I ever golfed better after letting one slip.  Usually the opposite occurs and my frustration begins to take over my emotions. Taking a deep breath, settling down, then moving on has better success for me.

Frustration may make you play bad, saying a "curse" word likely does nothing.  It's an example of frustration, not frustration itself.  Saying a "curse" word can be a positive emotion too.

[StuM]

1 minute ago, phillyk said:

Frustration may make you play bad, saying a "curse" word likely does nothing.  It's an example of frustration, not frustration itself.  Saying a "curse" word can be a positive emotion too.

We all deal with frustration differently but I would argue that if someone is repeatedly dropping the F-bomb in frustration then it may not be helping them or their frustration would be gone and they would no longer feel the need to say it.  Again I am trying to stress the frequency in which it occurs factors into my view.  I am not expecting players to show no emotion nor am I suggested they say "Fudge" instead.  (I don't think my dad every realized we knew what he really meant when he said that).  I am not suggesting our children need to be isolated from things.  One of my two points I have repeated is my opinion that too much is the problem.  

 

[iacas]

4 hours ago, StuM said:

I think the issue needs to be taken into context and frequency.

Justin Thomas is the world's best player and is competing at the highest level. He's a fully grown adult male. There's your context.

4 hours ago, StuM said:

I disliked when Keegon Bradly was constantly shown spitting on the course however he was made aware of it, he apologized and I no longer see that occurring.

Oh brother. Not the spitting take(s) again…

4 hours ago, StuM said:

A player that lets out an infrequent curse word is one thing but if it is happening every tournament they need to learn control and show professionalism.

I don't agree that swearing ≠ unprofessional within the context of a high-level sporting event.

4 hours ago, StuM said:

"Slim_Pivot" commented that he may get frustrated at work but does not curse in meetings or with patients.

He isn't playing a high-level sporting event.

I'll be honest: there are some students with whom I'll swear a little, and some with whom I don't. It's never out of frustration, but sometimes I'll be like "man you hit that one like shit!" (often sarcastically when they've finally done as I've asked and are staring in awe at their shot). The actual cursing isn't "unprofessional" (nor is it "professional") — it's just a word. Like you said, you have to consider the context, and the person in that case wouldn't down-grade me for saying that.

I don't down-grade JT for saying it, either. In fact, I think a bit more highly of him. I like seeing who people are, I don't like robots. I'm not offended by someone saying "f***."

Swearing ≠ "unprofessional" in all contexts.

4 hours ago, StuM said:

We are hoping to grow the game of golf which ideally will bring more young children into the game and I am sure many parents do not want their youngsters hearing this from those that should be role models.

Athletes shouldn't be role models for how they are as people.

They can be role models to show that hard work can pay off (i.e. JT has worked hard at his game for 20+ years, and he's now the top-ranked player in the world), but they're just human beings. They're not inherently better than anyone else at being a person.

I might go so far as to say you're failing as a parent if you think that PGA Tour players should be role models as human beings. Arnie cheated on Winnie, Tour players cheat on their wives all the time. Several do drugs. Many drink excessively, many are assholes, many are selfish, some are even Ian Poulter.

And like someone said, they'll hear 10x worse on the school bus than an adult occasionally saying "f***" on the air of a PGA Tour event.

4 hours ago, StuM said:

NOTE: I also hate watching baseball players spit on camera so I am not applying a double standard.

Let's not bring up the spitting stuff again please.

4 hours ago, Zippo said:

1. Golf is a game of control. Control the club face, backswing, downswing, etc. Cursing shows a lack of control.

Swearing does not show a "lack of control."

4 hours ago, Zippo said:

2. Young people are watching the players and emulating them. Yes, many young people (unfortunately) are all too familiar with the terms and their meanings but I see no need to encourage that behavior by televising adults behaving like children.

Parent your children, then.

Heck, my wife and I actively encouraged our kid to learn to swear. They're gonna do it; may as well do it properly. Done properly, swearing can play an important role. Especially in golf. Better she learn to practice it and get good at it rather than f***ing it all up trying to hide it and never getting to practice it. 🙂

4 hours ago, Zippo said:

3. Even the broadcast announcers apologize for the language used by the players.

That has more to do with the FCC and the wusses out there who are offended than anything else. They don't really care.

4 hours ago, Zippo said:

4. I don't see those words posted here - instead I see euphemisms - f**k, etc. Do we all know what they mean? Yes. But there must be a difference or we'd be writing the words themselves.

The site automatically censors the words. I can remove the filters if I want, but because everyone knows what is still actually being said… who cares? It's like… why have an "Explicit" podcast if you can just bleep out a few words now and then; the adults still know you said "f***ing Jason Day" but the podcast doesn't get limited to a smaller audience.

4 hours ago, Zippo said:

5. To my mind being a professional means acting like a professional and not like some street gang punk. This includes slamming your club into the turf or throwing your club at your bag and caddy.

Cursing ≠ professional.

Nearly every professional athlete curses. Period.

4 hours ago, Zippo said:

]6. It's a game. It's not life and death. No one is shooting at them. They don't have to go squat in a field under a burning sun and pick tomatoes or something for 14 hours a day.

It's not just a game for them. It's their livelihood, and so very nearly is life and death. It's what they've given 10 hours a day for 20+ years of their life to.

4 hours ago, Zippo said:

7. If they need relief from the tension of a missed shot maybe the should try deep breathing or stretching. It must be possible to make a bad shot without cursing and throwing things or the announcers would be apologizing steadily.

Why? Because you said so?

Maybe they should just say "f***!" as loud as they can, and that's the most effective way for them to relieve some stress.

3 hours ago, StuM said:

I believe it hurts the ability to grow the game if a parent, any parent, stops their child from watching the PGA due to the "Dirty Words" or if they are hesitant to take them to a course or a practice range for fear of hearing the words.

If parents are stopping their kids from watching the PGA Tour because of swearing, those are some f***ing sheltered kids, lemme tell you that.

3 hours ago, StuM said:

We need young players and anything that inhibits them from coming into the sport hurts the sport, even if just one person.

No.

Goes way too far.

3 hours ago, StuM said:

Yelling a curse word does not help any player I have seen play better.

Bullshit.

3 hours ago, StuM said:

Again, I am not expecting perfection and absolute sterile language with no personality.  I understand an occasional "Heat of battle/Emotion" occurrence.  I am just saying do not make it a habit and show some consideration for what may offend others.

Also, maybe people can work harder at not being offended by everything?

1 hour ago, StuM said:

I can't point to any evidence since I doubt there has ever been a study of how well a player plays after cursing.

You didn't look very hard.

Cursing can be good for your health — here's when to let that four-letter word slip

---

Go ahead and let that four letter word slip. Here are five scenarios where you should channel your inner sailor.

You're in the wrong here on that one. Hell, even Bobby Jones (about throwing clubs) said something like "Some emotions cannot be endured with the club still in your hands."

1 hour ago, StuM said:

I am not looking for golf to be some sterile environment like in the movie Pleasentville, just do not think it is good to have the F-bomb dropped repeatedly.

Who has said JT drops it "repeatedly"?

1 hour ago, StuM said:

It is OK to show emotion, but I do not feel you should let emotions take control of you.

Again why does swearing mean "your emotions take control of you?"

1 hour ago, StuM said:

There have been only 2 things I have been saying since the beginning:

1) Do not be excessive.

2) Be considerate of others

3) Stop being so offended by f***ing swearing. 🙂

[Bonvivant]

2 minutes ago, iacas said:

some are even Ian Poulter.

Now this is quality content.

[StuM]

@iacasI promise I will never mention that "S" word again.

[iacas]

9 minutes ago, StuM said:

@iacasI promise I will never mention that "S" word again.

Shank?

Aside: I've never understood why people won't say that word. It's just a word, just like "f***" is just a word. In the UK, "wanker" is perceived as worse than it is in the U.S. I think. They're all just words.

You might think I went after you a bit, but please know it's all just academic. I'm not going after you, but more just using what you say as a launching point to get to express my opinion on the topic. I'm going after the ideas you might have expressed, but not after you.

[Birish21]

8 hours ago, TN94z said:

I voted no. I would be hypocritical if I voted yes.

Why?  Are you a professional golfer with thousands of people watching you each week 😛

I could care less about what grown men do though, it is a little rough if the young kids want to watch golf and are getting hit with f-bombs, but ehh life.

Edited August 13, 2020 by Birish21

[On_the_Fringe]

It’s anti-golf, but it’s also unfortunately a sign of the times. It will continue to happen and even be applauded. It reminds me a bit of the somewhat recent stipulation under Rule 4.1 that allows a player to keep using and/or repair any club damaged during a round, EVEN IF it was damaged in anger. Again, a sign of the times. It’s anti-golf to give such an option to a player who chooses to abuse a club, just as it is anti-golf to use that kind of language on the course. Please save the “they swore back in the day, too; they just weren’t mic’d” takes. I’m sure they did, but Nicklaus and others spoke against it more frequently than it is opposed today. I understand that it’s a tolerated part of the game today, but I don’t have to like it.

[Carl3]

It is just a "word", LOL. You know that certain people are not allowed to say certain words.

[StuM]

16 minutes ago, iacas said:

You might think I went after you a bit, but please know it's all just academic. I'm not going after you, but more just using what you say as a launching point to get to express my opinion on the topic. I'm going after the ideas you might have expressed, but not after you.

I'm good, no worry.

FYI...."Shank" as well as "Slice" are really ugly words but unfortunately I have not yet eliminated them, I use them more often than the F-bomb, but on occasion they provoke an F-Bomb.