Gimmes

[dagolfer18]

15 minutes ago, Bonvivant said:

If PoP gets bad enough, the USGA might instate it. It seems that acceptable PoP will be 3.5 hours per 9 by 2030 if trends continue.

I sure hope not...

[iacas]

4 hours ago, Bonvivant said:

What if I want to putt the next one?

Then putt it.

Let's be quick about this, because though you can say you're "playing devil's advocate," it's just common sense, and you are being more argumentative or ignoring common sense than "playing devil's advocate."

4 hours ago, Bonvivant said:

What if I want to putt the next one? If I end up missing it, do I get to take the one after that? Even the USGA says it should always be a gimme from 5 feet on their site, seen here.

https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/handicapping/roh/Content/rules/3 3 When a Hole is Started but Player does not Hole Out.htm#:~:text=The most likely score is,during play of the hole.

No, they don't. That's not what that says. That's a "guideline." It's a guideline for a single instance.

If you have three five footers that you pick up, you're well within the guidelines to say "I'd have probably made two of those." Just like if I have a 35-footer, I'm going to add two shots, but someone like you might add three.

Those are guidelines for a single instance. If you make 51% of your five-footers, and you have ten that you pick up between 4-6 feet in a round, you aren't "likely" to make all of them.

Use some common sense. The point is to accurately estimate your score. You would not reasonably make all of your five footers. The USGA can't give you common sense, so for single instances, they give you a guideline.

4 hours ago, Bonvivant said:

I'm only bring this up because you mentioned that most likely score is a rule, and I think it is a bad one when it comes to anything other than a round being not completable.

It's a handicapping rule. It's not a "bad one." It's "bad" if you apply it without also applying common sense.

4 hours ago, Bonvivant said:

If you look at the bottom example (more than 20 yards), it says 3-4 strokes should be added. Can I just tee off on a par 5 and then pick up and call it a par?

Oy.

4 hours ago, Bonvivant said:

I know that the answer to this is "no" because it has to be a "valid" reason (most likely a 4 ball format or match play). It just irks me that they even have it in there at all, besides unfinished rounds which are easy to calculate based on a players HDCP.

No, you're not supposed to take your "unfinished round" thing. Those are for holes not played or not played under the Rules at all.

If you have a two-footer for birdie, and have a 20-handicap, you don't pick up and say "Oh, that's a bogey" because that's what you'd write down without playing the hole. You write down birdie, because you had played some of the hole so you were able to determine a "most likely" score with reasonably good accuracy.

[Bonvivant]

@iacas, all fair points as always. You know I just like to drum up trouble 🙃

[CarlSpackler]

32 minutes ago, Bonvivant said:

@iacas, all fair points as always. You know I just like to drum up trouble 🙃

Why?

[Bonvivant]

Just now, CarlSpackler said:

Why?

I like discussions and poking. I'm a talker by nature.....and I don't take gimmes lol

[Effington]

On 9/29/2020 at 8:56 PM, gbogey said:

Think about it this way - if you are in a tournament and have to putt everything out, you probably have 50 putts in a foursome between 1-3 feet. If each person takes 20 seconds to look at his putt, practice stroke, putt, pick up your ball, that's 17 minutes. That doesn't include the time to mark a two footer that you would normally pick up but you're not away and you'd rather wait to putt out. May be more like 30 minutes. Putting out really slows things down.

Gotcha, this is what I wasn't seeing.  If I was playing with someone who took 20 seconds to look at his 2 foot putt, marked his ball, etc., I think I'd get frustrated with that.

We don't spend much time with a routine on the green, so it goes quickly.

Edited October 2, 2020 by Effington

[boogielicious]

9 hours ago, Bonvivant said:

I like discussions and poking. I'm a talker by nature.....and I don't take gimmes lol

The Buddy Christ gives you two thumbs up!😜

[darthweasel]

On ‎9‎/‎29‎/‎2020 at 8:34 AM, Bonvivant said:

That's always the problem. Give an inch, take a mile. In our local game, everything must be holed. I suspect that it is for this exact reason. Requiring the ball to be holed makes it simple.

the league I play those tournaments in started "gimmes inside 1'" for a while earlier this year. It went about like you would expect...people not wanting to be "that guy" got...shall we say generous with what constituted 1'. My shoe is 12" long...I saw several "1' putts" given that I could comfortably fit 3-4 shoes in. Drove me nuts. Said something once, the reaction made it clear I would not say anything again. We play for credit on the tournament website that can buy stuff at full price, so it is not a huge deal...but it did make me sad that a "1' to not touch the flag" had such a huge impact. I saw guys miss several putts much shorter than those they were later given,

 

Point being, people often have weird interpretations of distance

[Archie Bunker]

Our greens were punch aerated and sanded the other day. Anything inside of 10 feet is a gimmie today☺️

[StuM]

On 9/29/2020 at 12:21 PM, ChetlovesMer said:

I think I've played with that guy. He goes with that "Well, I didn't really try. I'm sure I would have made it if I'd tried." I told him that nonchalant putts count just as much as chalant putts. 

I've hear of short puts, long putts, fast putts & slow putts but never chalant putts, until now.

[StuM]

On our league our rule is anything Par or better has to be putted for the A-Flight and Bogey or better for the B-Flight since those are the holes that may win skins  Otherwise it is up to your opponent.  Most will not just send it back so you can putt it out if you like, but be prepared to count all of the strokes.  I tend putt most of them since I am trying to get better, and have paid the price on occasion,  but may accept a 3 footer for mercy if having a bad day of it.  I do not give and would not accept 5 footers.

[Sandy Lie]

Our Men’s Club rule is all putts must be holed.  It certainly has helped me in terms of improved putting inside of 3 feet.  What’s funny is when your playing a casual round and someone says “that’s good” usually a foot or less we still have the inclination to putt the ball and we miss!

[graham57]

We play a lot of our golf in Thailand and some of the clubs there have a „gimme circle“ with a radius of around 18“ marked on the greens. This is partly to speed up play, but the (mandatory) caddies there also have the idea that a better score enhances their player‘s pleasure, even if it has not been fully earned. For example, in addition to the one or two clublengths for normal drops, they have the „one clubhouse“ rule, which basically means throwing the ball to get their player back on the fairway! They look at me in bewilderment when I insist on dropping my own ball in accordance with the rules. 

[Double Mocha Man]

I guess taking putts "inside the leather"  went by the wayside when the belly putter was invented.

[Frank F]

On 9/28/2020 at 5:40 PM, Effington said:

Hey guys, I am sure this topic has been discussed at great length, but didn't seem to find a thread specific to my question.

My regular playing partner & I are aligned well that we don't give each other anything.  The ball must go in the hole, unless it's within a couple inches.  Thus, I practice a good amount of short putts.  We don't play for money but there are substantial bragging rights and a lot of trash talk and our families see each other often.

Had a couple other people join us the other day and they were surprised that we had these rules.  They had played for 20+ years and always gave putts within a few feet and were surprised that we played so strict, especially with no money on the line.  They used the "pace of play" line, but I'm not sure playing your 2 feet putts each round contributes to slow play.

Is playing these strict rules uncommon?

As noted, it has led me to practice short putts much more than I otherwise would be.  If I was given all my 2-3 footers, I would spend my practice time elsewhere.

We putt everything out. Anything else isn't golf.

[DaveP043]

11 minutes ago, Frank F said:

We putt everything out. Anything else isn't golf.

Actually, the Rules of Golf allow a number of formats in which holing out the ball isn't always a requirement.  Through an awful lot of the world those formats are much more common for every day play than strict stroke play, Stableford in particular.  Every one of those formats is "golf".

Having said that, the group that I play with most often allow putts to be conceded (for stroke play) when they're within the length of a typical putter grip, which is just about 12 inches.  I think we're all better short putters because we DO get practice with these 18 to 24 inchers.

[CarlSpackler]

14 minutes ago, Frank F said:

We putt everything out. Anything else isn't golf.

I’m ok with a guy taking a 3’ gimme for his 12. 

[Frank F]

2 minutes ago, DaveP043 said:

Actually, the Rules of Golf allow a number of formats in which holing out the ball isn't always a requirement.  Through an awful lot of the world those formats are much more common for every day play than strict stroke play, Stableford in particular.  Every one of those formats is "golf".

Having said that, the group that I play with most often allow putts to be conceded (for stroke play) when they're within the length of a typical putter grip, which is just about 12 inches.  I think we're all better short putters because we DO get practice with this 18 to 24 inchers.

Agree. I've played all of those formats personally.  And let's not forget Rule 21.2 regarding maximum score during stroke play. In match play, I've missed and watched opponents miss 1 footers to win or lose a hole. But why else  would the Superintendent go to all that trouble to actually punch a hole in the greens each day?

I'm not working so hard in stroke play to arrive at the green in regulation just to pick up my ball.

2 minutes ago, CarlSpackler said:

I’m ok with a guy taking a 3’ gimme for his 12. 

On a par 4, he probably should have picked up at 7 or 8 depending upon his handicap index.