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USGA/R&A Changes to the Equipment Standards?


iacas

Acceptable Amount of Yardage Decrease from USGA/R&A Equipment Change?   

59 members have voted

  1. 1. Percentage Loss in Distance

    • 0%
      38
    • -2%
      2
    • -5%
      7
    • -10%
      3
    • -15%
      3
    • -20% or More
      3
    • They should increase smash factor!
      3


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"If implemented, the changes would impact golf balls and, at least on the tour level, severely roll back how drivers perform. In one instance, the majority of golf balls now on tour and in stores would immediately be rendered non-conforming for going too far. In a second area, the drivers being played on tour would have faces less lively than the earliest titanium drivers. And in terms of forgiveness elite players could be using clubs less forgiving than the irons they currently play. It would signal the most distinct and drastic kind of bifurcation of the rules between elite male players and average golfers in the history of the game."

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Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
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Also distance is only a "problem" in the MEN"S PRO GAME. But if it bleeds over into golf stores, it affects the amateur game. The game is growing. Time to smash it down. Bifurcate the equipment rules and don't have it affect the amateur game. Because if it drifts into the golf stores, I wonder how much "illegal" equipment will be on the golf course over the coming years? It will be a **** show. Way to go.

Edited by DrvFrShow

Julia

:callaway:  :cobra:    :seemore:  :bushnell:  :clicgear:  :adidas:  :footjoy:

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Driver: Callaway Big Bertha w/ Fubuki Z50 R 44.5"
FW: Cobra BiO CELL 14.5 degree; 
Hybrids: Cobra BiO CELL 22.5 degree Project X R-flex
Irons: Cobra BiO CELL 5 - GW Project X R-Flex
Wedges: Cobra BiO CELL SW, Fly-Z LW, 64* Callaway PM Grind.
Putter: 48" Odyssey Dart

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With the new article showing the USGA/R&A is looking into drastic roll back of yardage. I was wondering what people would think would be an acceptable rollback yardage. I put the options as percentage loss in yardage because the change in smash factor would be more of a percentage loss of your distance. They can't manufacture 15 yard loss for everyone. 

Seriously, how much loss in yardage would you be OK with or do you think they should increase smash factor 😉

Matt Dougherty, P.E.
 fasdfa dfdsaf 

What's in My Bag
Driver; :pxg: 0311 Gen 5,  3-Wood: 
:titleist: 917h3 ,  Hybrid:  :titleist: 915 2-Hybrid,  Irons: Sub 70 TAIII Fordged
Wedges: :edel: (52, 56, 60),  Putter: :edel:,  Ball: :snell: MTB,  Shoe: :true_linkswear:,  Rangfinder: :leupold:
Bag: :ping:

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I voted zero.   I think anything other than stopping things now would be  a big adjustment to make just because professionals can optimize their swing so much.   

—Adam

 

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None. What will they try to do next, tell the Pros they can’t workout? No more GEARS, Flightscope, Trackman, videoing your swing? Distance is not the problem they think it is. This week, remarkably, the US Open should have a winning score of around par. Why? Because they can set up the course to be hard for even players that can driver 320.

Scott

Titleist, Edel, Scotty Cameron Putter, Snell - AimPoint - Evolvr - MirrorVision

My Swing Thread

boogielicious - Adjective describing the perfect surf wave

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If I lose any distance with my driver, I'm not sure I'll ever reach the green (and I don't just mean in regulation).  I'm kidding.  A little bit.

How many people are hitting the ball too far?  I'm not.

I know we don't have SG data from the Hogan/Sneed/Nelson era, but I'd bet distance was a huge factor then, too.  Harvey Penick once said he knew his future wasn't as a touring professional because of the driving skills of the top players then, not because they were that much better with their putters or wedges. 

-- Michael | My swing! 

"You think you're Jim Furyk. That's why your phone is never charged." - message from my mother

Driver:  Titleist 915D2.  4-wood:  Titleist 917F2.  Titleist TS2 19 degree hybrid.  Another hybrid in here too.  Irons 5-U, Ping G400.  Wedges negotiable (currently 54 degree Cleveland, 58 degree Titleist) Edel putter. 

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2 hours ago, imsys0042 said:

I voted zero.  

As of this moment, everyone has voted zero.

Guess what?!  While all of this is happening (speculative) I can see the LIV Tour removing some of the constraints.  I haven't watched it yet, but guess where I might be headed.

(Please feel free to send this post to the USGA and R&A for their perusal)

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Zero. In a day where the political winds are howling against "rich white men" in every other corner of society, golf seems content to let a tiny group of elitists at the top of the golf world make rules that punish over 99.9% of golfers. And this is all so that.....top level pros won't embarass The Old Course? 

It all seems so unnecessary and unfortunate for me. 

JP Bouffard

"I cut a little driver in there." -- Jim Murray

Driver: Titleist 915 D3, ACCRA Shaft 9.5*.
3W: Callaway XR,
3,4 Hybrid: Taylor Made RBZ Rescue Tour, Oban shaft.
Irons: 5-GW: Mizuno JPX800, Aerotech Steelfiber 95 shafts, S flex.
Wedges: Titleist Vokey SM5 56 degree, M grind
Putter: Edel Custom Pixel Insert 

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Set a limit but don't roll anything back.   I agree with @boogielicious , you can setup a course to negate distance.  But you can also have a lot of fun with birdie fests, and people going crazy low by bombing the ball.

—Adam

 

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I put -20%. Ball flies too far, incentivizes boring golf, and forces courses to get too long or put boring obstacles like super high rough. 

Bifurcate the rules, let amateurs play the old ball, make the pros play the new, rolled back ball. Or, hell, make everyone play the rolled back ball. We’ll adjust to the new reality.

Edited by jbishop15

Hunter Bishop

"i was an aspirant once of becoming a flamenco guitarist, but i had an accident with my fingers"

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Titleist TSI3 | TaylorMade Sim 2 Max 3 Wood | 5 Wood | Edel 3-PW | 52° | 60° | Blade Putter

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2 minutes ago, jbishop15 said:

Bifurcate the rules, let amateurs play the old ball, make the pros play the new, rolled back ball. Or, hell, make everyone play the rolled back ball. We’ll adjust to the new reality.

Did you just manage to talk yourself into and then out of bifurcation all in a matter of three sentences? LOL 

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Driver: :callaway: Rogue Max ST LS
Woods:  :cobra: Darkspeed LS 3Wood/3Hybrid
Irons: :tmade: P770 (4-PW)
Wedges: :callaway: MD3 50   MD5 54 58 degree  
Putter: :odyssey:  White Hot RX #1
Ball: :tmade: TP5x

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2 minutes ago, klineka said:

Did you just manage to talk yourself into and then out of bifurcation all in a matter of three sentences? LOL 

No, I wouldn’t say that. I just don’t mind if they rolled back the ball for all skill levels. Courses and players would adjust

Hunter Bishop

"i was an aspirant once of becoming a flamenco guitarist, but i had an accident with my fingers"

My Bag

Titleist TSI3 | TaylorMade Sim 2 Max 3 Wood | 5 Wood | Edel 3-PW | 52° | 60° | Blade Putter

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1 minute ago, jbishop15 said:

No, I wouldn’t say that. I just don’t mind if they rolled back the ball for all skill levels. Courses and players would adjust

Gotcha. I was kinda kidding around anyway. 

I do agree with you though, given the choices of bifurcation or roll back for everyone I would definitely choose roll back for everyone. I've always enjoyed comparing some of my shots and yardages to the pros who are playing some of the same (or similar) equipment.

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Driver: :callaway: Rogue Max ST LS
Woods:  :cobra: Darkspeed LS 3Wood/3Hybrid
Irons: :tmade: P770 (4-PW)
Wedges: :callaway: MD3 50   MD5 54 58 degree  
Putter: :odyssey:  White Hot RX #1
Ball: :tmade: TP5x

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I voted "zero". If it bleeds into the golf stores, is TaylorMade going to advertise their new driver "10 yds. less than last year's model!" I don't think they'll want to do that. And they're even mentioning irons? Leave my future set of Launcher XL Halos alone!

If they feel there is a "distance problem" I have the solution - Range Balls. Wilson Premium Range Balls go about 10% less than a premium golf ball. I'm not talking about those Titleist or TaylorMade "practice balls." I'm saying real range balls. I can see it now, "Wilson Premium Range Balls - the Official Game Ball of the US Open." 🤣 And if this is still too much distance they make reduced flight range balls.

I have 3 perfectly serviceable drivers and I don't intend to replace them anytime soon. I can order a senior flex shaft when the time comes. I just wonder if the USGA telling me to stock up on SuperSofts before they change the rules? I could buy 10 dz. today and in combo with current inventory, those would last me a few years. This is kind of like the State Legislature's "magazine ban" where they grandfather the older magazines so you rush out and buy extras of your standards before the law goes into effect. I'm 70 yrs. old. I'm retired. I don't play golf for a living. I play golf for a recreational activity that gets me out in the sunshine during the summer, and I have fun. I'm not hitting the ball longer every year. I'm suffering the age related distance loss. I don't think I will be buying anything that will hit the ball shorter. 

There's another issue at the other end. I say on the women's end there isn't enough distance. This whole reduction talk bleeding into the amateur game ends up with "you mean women play golf?" tone deafness. The drive for the average female golfer is only 150 yds. The average par 4 from the forward tees is 290 yds. on most courses. So 290 - 150 = 140. That requires a perfect 3W. I know from observation that the 140 yd. 3W off the deck is a pipe dream for most women. It's more like 100 yds. because lack of loft is a killer at slow swing speeds. So it's three shots onto the green, and two putts for bogey, assuming no mishits, which there are... which is why the average handicap for women is 27.5. Imagine reducing performance by 10% at this end. If anything higher COR drivers are needed here. Or courses will need to perform expensive reconfiguration their tee boxes. Not just the "men's tee boxes" although this will probably be it at most courses, they need to make the forward tees shorter. And to think they're 5600 yds. at my home course - fine if you can hit a 200 yd. drive.

Julia

:callaway:  :cobra:    :seemore:  :bushnell:  :clicgear:  :adidas:  :footjoy:

Spoiler

Driver: Callaway Big Bertha w/ Fubuki Z50 R 44.5"
FW: Cobra BiO CELL 14.5 degree; 
Hybrids: Cobra BiO CELL 22.5 degree Project X R-flex
Irons: Cobra BiO CELL 5 - GW Project X R-Flex
Wedges: Cobra BiO CELL SW, Fly-Z LW, 64* Callaway PM Grind.
Putter: 48" Odyssey Dart

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41 minutes ago, jbishop15 said:

I put -20%. Ball flies too far, incentivizes boring golf, and forces courses to get too long or put boring obstacles like super high rough. 

But chicks did the long ball! 😛

20% is a huge drop off. Going from 300 to 240 yards! 

 

Edited by saevel25

Matt Dougherty, P.E.
 fasdfa dfdsaf 

What's in My Bag
Driver; :pxg: 0311 Gen 5,  3-Wood: 
:titleist: 917h3 ,  Hybrid:  :titleist: 915 2-Hybrid,  Irons: Sub 70 TAIII Fordged
Wedges: :edel: (52, 56, 60),  Putter: :edel:,  Ball: :snell: MTB,  Shoe: :true_linkswear:,  Rangfinder: :leupold:
Bag: :ping:

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20 minutes ago, saevel25 said:

But chicks did the long ball! 😛

20% is a huge drop off. Going from 300 to 240 yards! 

 

chicks do be enjoying the long ball 😜

20% is a lot, but it'll force courses to change and stop being these over-long, boring monsters. Plus, 300+ is only impressive in context. 240 would be just as impressive if the ball only allowed you to hit that far. 

 

Hunter Bishop

"i was an aspirant once of becoming a flamenco guitarist, but i had an accident with my fingers"

My Bag

Titleist TSI3 | TaylorMade Sim 2 Max 3 Wood | 5 Wood | Edel 3-PW | 52° | 60° | Blade Putter

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And then there's been talk about the dogleg problem where elite players have cut doglegs over adjacent holes to drive the greens. On my home course that's impossible due to the 100+ foot tall pines, but.... just for places where it is possible, here's a solution. You can send me the $750K in consulting fees. 

Dogleg Problem.jpg

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Julia

:callaway:  :cobra:    :seemore:  :bushnell:  :clicgear:  :adidas:  :footjoy:

Spoiler

Driver: Callaway Big Bertha w/ Fubuki Z50 R 44.5"
FW: Cobra BiO CELL 14.5 degree; 
Hybrids: Cobra BiO CELL 22.5 degree Project X R-flex
Irons: Cobra BiO CELL 5 - GW Project X R-Flex
Wedges: Cobra BiO CELL SW, Fly-Z LW, 64* Callaway PM Grind.
Putter: 48" Odyssey Dart

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Bifurcate.  Fine.  Shorten distances for the touring pros.  Increase distances for the amateurs.  Balls that go further but still stop on the green like a "dropped cat".  More trampoline effect on the drivers.  I'm sure every OEM has R&D ready to go on their irons... let them take those secrets out of the vault.

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