Gained a Lot of Club Speed in a Couple of Days With the Same Effort. Try This Out!

[p1n9183]

As always I'm after swing speed. My current course speed is around 106 mph, 153 ball, 2200 spin / 14° launch, with an average of 250 carry  (0.5 index). I play against plus index guys that hit it from 270 to 300 carry so I'm a little bit in disadvantage. I own a Skytrak and recently a PRGR to practice and finetune my numbers.  

I´ve heard Bryson said that when he wanted more speed it want's the idea to swing harder but to have a longer backswing. I've already tried in the last 15 months to have more shoulder turn, and even lift my left heel for more turn, but it always felt disconnected, even losing sight of the ball ending up in nothing good only to get 2..3 more miles per hour on some swings. Also tried to lift my hands really high in the top but generally translated in poor loading of the hands, and very inconsistent increase in speed. Also tried a LOT more stuff you see on youtube everyday but nothing helped my case.

Last Sunday night I was messing around with a short driver (I have low ceiling) and the PRGR (no ball). Normal speed for that session was around 106. I don't remember why but I tried to lift as high as I could my left elbow on the backswing, keeping the left arm almost straight. Right from the first attempt the PRGR jumped to 110.. 111.. and after more swings it settle in 112 (with a couple 113 in there). 113 was my top speed with that club ever but swinging out of my shoes, but this time I was just swinging my on course swing. Of course I tried to swing my previous swing and again it went back to 106. Tested 5 swings with each and the average were 106 vs 112 as spected. I was amazed. 

Next day I setted up my "net" and did the exact same test but this time with a foam ball. This time the results were 100.3 vs 106.7. Not totally sure about the gains yet I picked up real balls and a 7 iron and the club speed jumped from 88 to 94 and the ball speed went from 112 to 120. I was convinced. 

But hey.. wait. There is more!! I assumed the gains were because I felt that having the elbow more up, gave me more distance from the hands to the ball to accelerate and create more speed but this time feeling comfortable about the position and not having that much turn to the right. It was like I could start to apply force to the handle right from the top taking advantage of the high hands, thing I wasn't able to feel in other attempts so have high hands at the top.

On Tuesday I asked myself.. what if I manage to lift the elbow even higher? could it translate to more speed? would it be comfortable? well, tried a couple of things without success until I tried to lift my left heel but this time only having in mind lifting the elbow as high as it felt comfortable. Eureka! felt fast as hell. 
I was bear foot, set the PRGR and swung a 7 iron. Tested 5 swings with the normal swing, 5 with the Sunday swing and 5 with the new discovery. After that made 5 with each again to have 10 swings with each. Results were more than I would dream... 81.0 vs 87.2 vs 93.5 !! That's 12 mph in gains! for a 7 iron is an improvement of 20-25 yards!

Of course I want to hit the driver longer, irons longer is just a bonus, so I couldn't stop there and put my shoes on and set the math to have a firm turf and swung the club with each swing a couple of times to see the numbers. I was already tired so I didn't attempt to do the full test like I did with the 7 iron. 
The results were not that great but still really good. 105 vs 109 vs 113. 8 mph gains is still a lot of speed that can translate to 25 more yards with driver (carry) without swinging harder. 
I would try to make time today in the afternoon to set the net an hit a couple drives with foam balls and irons with real balls with all the swings to compare more numbers. The real deal is on Friday that I will be able to hit the course with the PRGR later in the afternoon.

As for reference and to compare to your own swing, on the top of my backswing my left elbow is between my chin and my left shoulder in height. With the Sunday swing it went up between my mouth and nose height and after lifting the left heel it went up to my forehead.   

      
    

[p1n9183]

Quick update.. 

Set the math, "net", shoes warm up and started with 7 iron. Test result with the 3 swings for ball speed: 111 118 116! It was imposible to hit the ball in the middle of the face while lifting the left heel, the up and down move make me afraid of hitting the ground so I mishit a lot of shots and even swung a little softer. I don't think It worth the time to get used to the movement for shots from the deck. Just moving the elbow higher gave me between 10-15 yards with each iron so is more than enough. I would be using normal elbow for short to mid irons for control and high elbow for longer irons to gain spin and height, again more distance is a bonus.

Now the Driver: 98.5 vs 103.5 vs 105. With the ball away from the ground, I always drive with very high tees, I wasn't afraid to go at it normally. Lifting the left heel was a little bit less confortable than the other 2 swings but it has more potential since is a huge change from my normal swing and it still was faster. I think that with practice I can gain a few more miles to get a swing that is around 8..9 miles faster than my normal drive to use in wide holes or Par 5´s. Tomorrow will be testing on the course with my Driver so there will be more accurate results.        

[GolfLug]

A video or it didn't happen. 😉

[klineka]

17 hours ago, p1n9183 said:

As for reference and to compare to your own swing, on the top of my backswing my left elbow is between my chin and my left shoulder in height. With the Sunday swing it went up between my mouth and nose height and after lifting the left heel it went up to my forehead.       

Just because it results in more speed doesn't necessarily mean it's a good thing for ball-striking/swing mechanics.

I think there's a reason that far more PGA Tour players have their lead arm on a similar angle as their shoulder plane rather than lead arm significantly steeper as you described.

Not saying it can't work, but it's likely not optimal or what most coaches would recommend, especially for mid/high handicap golfers who already struggle with quality of strike. 

You can probably get away with it some because you're already a highly skilled golfer.

 

Personally, the lead arm significantly steeper than my shoulder plane is one of the exact things I am working towards eliminating/reducing in my golf swing. 

[ChetlovesMer]

I'd like to see either photos or videos of the difference. As we know feel isn't real. 

17 hours ago, p1n9183 said:

I tried to lift as high as I could my left elbow on the backswing, keeping the left arm almost straight.

This "feel" to you may be completely different to me. 

It sounds like you are trying to gain "width". But again, a picture would be worth a thousand words and a video might be worth a million. 👍😁👍

[p1n9183]

2 hours ago, GolfLug said:

A video or it didn't happen. 😉

25 minutes ago, ChetlovesMer said:

As we know feel isn't real. 

Totally agree with you both. This afternoon I will record a couple swings with irons and Driver at the course with the corresponding PRGR readings. 

 

 

[p1n9183]

Numbers are in and I have to say that my swing is awfull haha. Now I understand why the other day a guy told me that there was other players that also played well like me but their swing was uglier... 
The results were promising but not as good as I wanted. Have to say that I felt tired with pain in the back and not fast at all, maybe a little burn of how many swing I swung this last 6 days. But it doesn't matter. The important thing was to test the new swing against the older one. 

With irons the gains were almost none, about 2..3 miles of club speed more but a little worst smash factor on normal shots. But for longer irons with tail wing, as I spected, launch was higher and the shalower AoA improved ball striking ganing about 5 yards and higher landing angle.  Didn't take the time to record it, really didn't matter that much. Wanted to spend more time with the driver.  

With Driver I hit 17 shots with each swing, the normal and the one lifting the left heel (3 different holes / winds). Here they are, the normal swing and the new one. Can't beleive how much I hover the club. 

Normal: 

New: 

Now to the numbers, gained 5 miles of club speed and almost 9 in ball speed. Spin remained low but it launched a little higher and with less curvature so really glad about that. Dispersion was the same, maybe a little narrower but that could be a little biased.  

Type	Club	Ball	Smash
New	110.8	159.6	1.44
Normal	105.8	150.9	1.43
Diff	5	8.7	0.01

Feel free to make fun of my swing or throw me a tip to make it not tha ugly or at least faster!

Edited February 24 by p1n9183

[iacas]

I don't understand why the clubhead is two feet away from the ball at address.

[GolfLug]

That's a nice, dynamic swing. Not ugly at all. As Erik pointed out the club head distance from the ball is unique though.

[Carl3]

17 hours ago, GolfLug said:

As Erik pointed out the club head distance from the ball is unique though.

Moe Normanesque in that regard. 🤣

[p1n9183]

On 2/23/2024 at 11:20 PM, iacas said:

I don't understand why the clubhead is two feet away from the ball at address.

It just feel comfortable, active. When I don't hover I feel really tight, I don't like to bend forward at address, I like to be tall.
Irons is the same thing but is impossible to do this, so I'm forced to touch the ground with the club before starting the backswing. If I don't I start chunking and thinning shots. 

Played 18 on Sunday, really windy day (18 mph, with gusts of 30) . 11 Drivers, 4 against the wind, 3 with the wind and 4 crosswinds. 
Average was 292 with half of the balls ending in decent height rough so I guess 300 would be a better average. Dispersion was as good or even better as my previous Driver but was 20 yards further in average. 

Something I would like your opinions on is on a test I made the prior day at the club´s math/net with my gamer (Driver).
I was testing the old vs the new swing and the results were pretty consistent with this chart.

On 2/23/2024 at 10:15 PM, p1n9183 said:

Type	Club	Ball	Smash
New	110.8	159.6	1.44
Normal	105.8	150.9	1.43
Diff	5	8.7	0.01

So I tested a new move, I tried to apply force to the handle of the club to make my wrist hinge quickly on the backswing and without lifting the heel or raising the elbow I smashed normally the ball like in my previous driver. Club speed jumped to 115 and stayed around 114 and 116. Tested the other swings and the club went down to 106 and 111 as normal. The odd thing was that at 115 club ball stayed around 160 giving me all smash factors below 1.4 knowing that I was hitting it solid. 
After 10 swings the PRGR battery died so I was left with the doubt. Could it be the batteries? was I swinging fast but not over the ball? really have no idea. I recharged the batteries now, so I will test this new idea further when I can.

[iacas]

1 hour ago, p1n9183 said:

It just feel comfortable, active. When I don't hover I feel really tight, I don't like to bend forward at address, I like to be tall.
Irons is the same thing but is impossible to do this, so I'm forced to touch the ground with the club before starting the backswing. If I don't I start chunking and thinning shots.

You probably mis-hit driver more often, too. You can hover a driver… less than two feet from the ball.

[p1n9183]

After a couple months working with my irons, I'm back with the speed quest.

On 2/26/2024 at 12:30 PM, p1n9183 said:

So I tested a new move, I tried to apply force to the handle of the club to make my wrist hinge quickly on the backswing and without lifting the heel or raising the elbow I smashed normally the ball like in my previous driver. Club speed jumped to 115 and stayed around 114 and 116.

This move finally didn't stick. It wasn't neither accurate or comfortable to do on the course so I left it behind. One new move that do stick was to feel like throwing the club to the target at impact. It gave me 2 more miles and higher launch when I was able to swing free and kept the previous swing to more tight holes. Normal stayed at 106 and throwing the club at 108 on tournament. 

Yesterday I messed around with foam balls and the PRGR and found a "new" way to create speed. The idea was to use the drill that make you start the swing from P8, but with a twist. The idea is to start from address but with the club hovering the ball high like I do in the video, hinge quickly my wrists to the left to move the club to P8 (the arms also move a bit to the left). Then go back from P8 quickly to the ball unhinging an rehinging to the right, and to the top of the backswing as normal and from there normal swing  to hit the ball. Is like my movement is more fluent and my wrists hinge a lot more at the top and I gain a lot of speed when I hit the ball without any more effort.  

I tested 8 swing with my normal swing, and 8 with this new way. In both cases I tried to replicate the speed and control I made when I'm on the course and I wanted to hit the fairway, I did this with a 2000 Driver gripping it down to play it like 42.75" (gamer is 45.75") to avoid hitting the ceiling. Despite feeling the new way had a little less face control, the increase in club speed was promising (even to much to be true).

Normal	P8
100	110
101	110
99	110
100	111
102	109
101	110
101	110
96	108
100.0	109.8

 If my gamer Driver is around 106 with the normal swing, I should be swinging at around 116 that is a lot more than I could dream off. Before engaging in this new idea, no matter how ugly or different it seams for normal golf... I want to ask.. is this legal for tournament golf?  
 

[StuM]

48 minutes ago, p1n9183 said:

After a couple months working with my irons, I'm back with the speed quest.

This move finally didn't stick. It wasn't neither accurate or comfortable to do on the course so I left it behind. One new move that do stick was to feel like throwing the club to the target at impact. It gave me 2 more miles and higher launch when I was able to swing free and kept the previous swing to more tight holes. Normal stayed at 106 and throwing the club at 108 on tournament. 

Yesterday I messed around with foam balls and the PRGR and found a "new" way to create speed. The idea was to use the drill that make you start the swing from P8, but with a twist. The idea is to start from address but with the club hovering the ball high like I do in the video, hinge quickly my wrists to the left to move the club to P8 (the arms also move a bit to the left). Then go back from P8 quickly to the ball unhinging an rehinging to the right, and to the top of the backswing as normal and from there normal swing  to hit the ball. Is like my movement is more fluent and my wrists hinge a lot more at the top and I gain a lot of speed when I hit the ball without any more effort.  

I tested 8 swing with my normal swing, and 8 with this new way. In both cases I tried to replicate the speed and control I made when I'm on the course and I wanted to hit the fairway, I did this with a 2000 Driver gripping it down to play it like 42.75" (gamer is 45.75") to avoid hitting the ceiling. Despite feeling the new way had a little less face control, the increase in club speed was promising (even to much to be true).

Normal	P8
100	110
101	110
99	110
100	111
102	109
101	110
101	110
96	108
100.0	109.8

 If my gamer Driver is around 106 with the normal swing, I should be swinging at around 116 that is a lot more than I could dream off. Before engaging in this new idea, no matter how ugly or different it seams for normal golf... I want to ask.. is this legal for tournament golf?  
 

Why would you think "How" you swing the club may not be legal for tournament golf?  Rule 10.1 discusses Making a Stroke.  The prohibitions are against Anchoring and straddling the line of play.  I do not see anything about how or when you hinge/unhinge your wrists.

Your HCP is much lower than mine (Very much lower) so take my advice with a grain of salt but I think the issue I would focus on is consistency & repeatability and look at  tried & true methods to increase speed instead of attempting to invent something new.

[billchao]

@p1n9183 I know you’re a much better golfer than I am, but have you considered trying to improve your speed/distance by improving your swing mechanics or through regular speed training?

Have you exhausted all of the proven methods before going down this rabbit hole of finding a magic move to increase speed?

[p1n9183]

On 4/10/2024 at 11:54 AM, StuM said:

I do not see anything about how or when you hinge/unhinge your wrists.

Is more about starting the swing having the club left of the ball (for a right-handed player). I never saw it, even on long drive competitions. For me is easy given how much high I hover the club. I think it would be impossible for players than hover at ball height and even more for not hovering players. 

On 4/10/2024 at 11:54 AM, StuM said:

focus on is consistency & repeatability

I do have that on my normal swing. I'm looking for an extra gear for open holes. 

On 4/10/2024 at 11:54 AM, StuM said:

look at  tried & true methods to increase speed

21 hours ago, billchao said:

but have you considered trying to improve your speed/distance by improving your swing mechanics

Of course I did that, and because of that I'm no longer a "short" hitter, I'm more average in the Am competitions I play.  

On 4/10/2024 at 11:54 AM, StuM said:

instead of attempting to invent something new.

I love to go down the rabbit holes. Sometimes they lead to something good, sometimes it doesn't. Trial and error. 

 

21 hours ago, billchao said:

through regular speed training

I worked on that but left it behind because of backpain. 

21 hours ago, billchao said:

Have you exhausted all of the proven methods before going down this rabbit hole of finding a magic move to increase speed?

Is impossible to try them all, but I tryed as much as I could and I'm sure I will keep looking for them until I reach my goal. 

Is one of the fun parts about golf for me, the pursue of distance, accuracy, etc. 

Yesterday I tested the same movement with a 6 iron an real balls with skytrak. Gained 10 miles of ball speed (around 15 yards carry) but I was missing all to the right and is wasn't comfortable at all. Having to hit the ball with a small face close to the ground was really uncomfortable and not accurate. Nevertheless the extra speed was there and that was the main goal of the test. 
Tomorrow I will be able to go out to the course and do a prober test with driver and PRGR. 

[p1n9183]

On 2/26/2024 at 1:44 PM, iacas said:

You probably mis-hit driver more often, too.

Even on a perfect center hit I was receiving at most 1.48 smash factor. 10 days ago on the warming up for a round my Driver made a weird sound, I checked the bottom and it was cracked. Don't know for how long it was cracked but at least this time the crack was easy visible. Maybe it was already cracked before but with a more subtle crack?.. don't know. I'm waiting for TaylorMade to approve the warranty and send me a new head. I was using the Stealth Plus, I will take the opportunity and upgrade it to the Qi10 LS paying the difference. 
On Sunday with my old Titleist 915 and softer balls I was reaching 1.5, even 1.51 on center hits.

On 4/11/2024 at 12:26 PM, p1n9183 said:

Tomorrow I will be able to go out to the course and do a prober test with driver and PRGR. 

Test didn't went well. Only gained 2..3 miles, not worth pursuing. Figured out that with a ball and with a target, my path was way to in to out with this new idea, so in order to move the club in the correct path I needed to slow down to redirect the club on the downswing or aim more to the right, close the face a play a big hook.. not possible. I already play a big draw with Driver, more curvature is unplayable.

Yesterday at home, with no ball messed around with a more neutral path, even swinging a little out to in. It felt a lot more in sync with the body. With a big in to out path it feels like my hands are working right, away from the body, when the body is working to rotate to the left. With the path to the left is was easier to apply force thru the hitting zone. 

As always tested 10 swings with my current swing (A), and 10 with this little out to in path(B). 
The difference was huge, like 12 miles faster with swing (B). I knew something wasn't right. The fact was that the PRGR was aligned more in line with the (B) path so it of course was giving higher speeds.
I proceeded to align it with the (A) path and tested again 5 more swings each. Again (B) was faster but only by 5 miles.
(Made a tiny experiment moving the PRGR to a more extreme in to out path and the swings register 25/30% slower for both swings, so it wasn't reading properly at that angle)
Finally I moved the PRGR in the middle of both paths, and this time (B) won by 9 miles.

Off course, this was without a ball and a target so.. I will be hitting the range tomorrow to see the real difference.