Official US Open Thread

[jamo]

You are missing the point. Tiger lacks the grace or charisma to give a decent interview whether he wins, loses or draws.

So what exactly do you want him to do? Phil already has the "it's all good, even though I lost it on sunday again" thing covered.

Twirls not necessary, thanks. Saying something of substance rather than just trotting out clichés in a weary and contemptuous manner would be good, though.

Weary is a good word. He was weary after just playing a 5 hour round of golf on one of the hardest courses in the world and losing the US Open by 3 shots. I'd be weary too.

Recreational: exactly how old are you, and how many post-round interviews with Jack have you seen? I think now that Jack is a nearly-completely-out-of-action 'legend' of the game, we tend to romanticize his career a little. My recollection, I've heard people say Jack was pretty competitive, ornary bastard in his day. On the flip, though, IMHO, I see Phil's Romper-Room/Crayola/Disneyworld bs nice-guy post-round interviews as fake. No way you practice like these guys do, endure 6-7 hours per day at the hardest course in the world, deal with media expectations, only to fall 3 or 4 strokes shy (out of 280+ strokes), and trot off and go, "welp, ya know, Mark, it was just tough, but I'm happy for Graeme." Bullshit. If that's who you truly are, then fine, but that sounds 'made for TV' if you ask me, and moreover, I don't see that as 'better' than a guy who comes off and says, "you know what, I'm really angry and disappointed at my play." To me, there's an element of genuiness there. Just because he doesn't manage - in the 15 second sound-byte - to congratulate the winner, doesn't mean he doesn't feel or think that. Sins of commission are one thing, but for the love of Zeus, now we're piling Tiger with sins of OMISSION as well

+1

Lastly, for the record, there is NO WAY he said 'we made 3 mental mistakes.' I heard that chat with Rolfing live, and he absolutely said "I made 3 mental mistakes." If there is one thing I think I can infer about Tiger, is that he is HIGHLY unlikely to ever blame someone else for his performance, and I can't IMAGINE he'd call out Stevie (which is who I would imagine any 'we' would have to refer to) in a public forum.

No, he said we. And in the press conference he gave after he mentioned how Stevie talked him out of what he wanted to do.

[bogeyhitter25]

It would've been good to see Phil win, but face it, we all knew he wasn't going to.

Cheers to Graeme.

[golfro]

So...from this thread, I'm gathering that people want some cookie cutter fluffy comment after each tournament, whether win or lose, everybody just hug eachother and everything is just dandy.

a fluffy soft back cookie cutter doesn't go on to win 14 majors. A relentless, competitive, stubborn, determined, anxious and driven person goes on to win 14 majors. Not everything is happy just dandy. I don't want to hear some bullshit about how great of a day it was. I want to hear their honest feedback on why their game was the way it was. Whether they blame the course, their caddy, or their own self, I don't care, say something with some conviction and let people know what they think. I find that muich more valuable.

[sean_miller]

So...from this thread, I'm gathering that people want some cookie cutter fluffy comment after each tournament, whether win or lose, everybody just hug eachother and everything is just dandy.

He could work on some standard answers - grit his teeth and deliver some cliches. Not too hard.

[Valleygolfer]

I think Tiger should don a mohawk, wear gold jewelry and yell "I pity the foo that talks trash about my game" or "You think Mr. TW cares what you think about his golf"!

Seriously, I was not happy about Tiger's transgressions and he has been burned for them but just because he doesn't make you feel all fuzzy inside in a interview doesn't mean anything. Everybody is complaining that he doesn't do this or that....that is your opinion but not a requirement. He does however have to play good golf. Fact is sports figures are just like the internet not everything you hear is true portrayal of an individual. I am just saying private hate, racism or hurt because his behavior ruined a once hero is getting tiresome with scrutinizing every move. He generally behaves like a jerk but I like seeing amazing shots so I enjoy watching.

[The Recreational Golfer]

Recreational: exactly how old are you, and how many post-round interviews with Jack have you seen? I think now that Jack is a nearly-completely-out-of-action 'legend' of the game, we tend to romanticize his career a little. My recollection, I've heard people say Jack was pretty competitive, ornary bastard in his day.

(Now that I reflect, Rolfing's question was, "Tiger, what will you take home from this week?" -- a perfectly open-ended question essentially letting Woods say whatever he wanted to.)

To answer your question, sonicblue, I am old enough to have followed Nicklaus's entire professional career. There is no romanticizing about the way he conducted himself. If Nicklaus was upset when he lost, and he was, believe me, (Woods did not invent The Competitive Nature), he kept his frustration with losing to himself, conducted himself with grace in the public eye, and gave credit where credit was due. That's how people behaved in public back then. Most still do now. I never saw him act the way Woods did by giving a "poor me" answer to a softball question then abruptly walking away like he was there against his will to begin with -- something I would expect to see in AJGA golf. As for Phil, I have no doubt that losing this Open sticks in his craw as much as losing it does in Tiger's. It's just that Phil is mature enough to give credit to Graeme McDowell for having won the tournament, an admirable act of sportsmanship. A few months ago, Tom Watson said that Woods needs to learn some things about respecting the game. He still does.

[mjtoal]

(Now that I reflect, Rolfing's question was, "Tiger, what will you take home from this week?" -- a perfectly open-ended question essentially letting Woods say whatever he wanted to.)

That is exactly where I am coming from. It is now more common for players to think that you need to show how much you wanted it by being surly and pissed off. Nicklaus is as competitive as Woods, but managed to be a sportsman and gentleman while still wanting to step on the neck of his opponent and crush them into the ground. In fact, it is a testamanet to his ability that he could do so.

[shaun]

... Maybe I'm just a little pissed that this is the 10th non-American to win the US Open in the last 40 years.

You could've said that at the beginning and saved me the trouble of reading the rest of your post.

Anyway, to say that McDowell "won" the US Open by Johnson (or Woods, Mickelson or Els, or anyone else) "losing" it is equally absurd. Leading after three rounds means just that -- you have the lead after three rounds, with a further round to go. It doesn't make any sense to say that someone should have won a tournament shooting 71, 70, 66, 82! A final round in the 80s -- even from an American! -- usually won't win a US Open. It's as simple as that.

[Zeph]

That is exactly where I am coming from. It is now more common for players to think that you need to show how much you wanted it by being surly and pissed off. Nicklaus is as competitive as Woods, but managed to be a sportsman and gentleman while still wanting to step on the neck of his opponent and crush them into the ground. In fact, it is a testamanet to his ability that he could do so.

Jack Nicklaus is not Tiger Woods. Obama is not Kennedy. Why is everyone supposed to act like your favourite player? Of course it is possible to act like the prince of Sweden during interviews, but why should we care what they reply after a round? Golf is not a game of perfect, let the players get surly and upset when they don't achieve what they wanted. Honestly, we have seen Tiger play golf the last 10+ years, is this not something we should accept by now?

[mjtoal]

Jack Nicklaus is not Tiger Woods. Obama is not Kennedy. Why is everyone supposed to act like your favourite player? Of course it is possible to act like the prince of Sweden during interviews, but why should we care what they reply after a round? Golf is not a game of perfect, let the players get surly and upset when they don't achieve what they wanted. Honestly, we have seen Tiger play golf the last 10+ years, is this not something we should accept by now?

Oh gee, thanks, Sherlock. I thought Tiger WAS Jack.

The point is that it is perfectly possible to be a great champion and have some grace. It is also perfectly possible to speak in ordinary language rather than just trot out cliche. You should give it a go too.

[jamo]

I never saw him act the way Woods did by giving a "poor me" answer to a softball question then abruptly walking away like he was there against his will to begin with -- something I would expect to see in AJGA golf.

What about "We made 3 mental errors that cost use the US open" is a "poor me" answer!?! He said why he lost, and that's it? What do you expect from the guy! He's a golfer, not a speech writer or a motivational speaker. And for the last time, when Woods was interviewed McDowell hadn't won yet!!!

What about what he said lacked class, or grace, or respect? Give specific examples! (Except to Stevie, but that's a totally other issue. Tiger was a total ass to Stevie and I feel bad for the caddie)

[The Recreational Golfer]

I'll reply one more time and retire from the discussion. We're starting to beat a dead horse here. If the timing on Woods's interview was before McDowell had won, I will be corrected.

It was, however, his tone, his attitude, that he displayed during the interview, its quick closing, a look that screamed, "And there are no more questions, are there?" and walking away before the camera had turned off, that are all indications of his career-long petulant (before you throw that word back at me, be sure you know what it means) behavior he falls into when things don't go his way. There was also his body language during the round when the putts weren't dropping that was not the way a mature competitor would react, but a spoiled child. We have seen this time and time again. I'm not asking that he toss off a loss like it was nothing, but that he keep his composure, act graciously, like an adult, in public, when he doesn't come out the top dog. Like Tom Watson did last year when he lost the British Open. Is that asking too much?

You can't say, give him a break, he's just a guy who hits golf balls for a living. He is much more than that. Who is more recognizable in the world and who can command more media attention, besides President Obama, or President Bush earlier, than Woods? As the person who is the face of golf for the part of the world for the non-golfing public, he needs to, if jamo's objection be served, become someone who can give a gracious answer on the fly, and as the greatest champion of our era, show us how to behave as well in defeat. It's not hard to do. All that's required is that you grow up.

OK. I'm going to the range and hit balls. See you at next year's Open.

[golfro]

I'll reply one more time and retire from the discussion. We're starting to beat a dead horse here. If the timing on Woods's interview was before McDowell had won, I will be corrected.

lmfao... man if i was under this much scrutiny from some random guy on a forum, i'd give the middle finger to the camera.

"body language" "his tone" "attitude". christ Dr. Phil, give it a rest. The man has emotions, so he doesn't smile as much as Mickelson, he's a human being for christ sakes, he doesn't need to put on a smile to please you.

[iacas]

I'll reply one more time and retire from the discussion. We're starting to beat a dead horse here. If the timing on Woods's interview was before McDowell had won, I will be corrected.

Couldn't disagree more. I don't care what he says in the interview, except that I might find it funny if, for once, he gave a truly honest answer and said "That's an awfully stupid question Roger. I'm gonna get out of here. Let me know next time if you can come up with something decent." Again, at least that would be funny. You're looking at Tiger through the poo-colored glasses you want to look at him through. He's not gracious, but he's won 14 majors. I don't think Tiger can be both, and I very, very, VERY much prefer that he win majors than answer a stupid question by giving some fake answer meant to please people.

[LongballGer]

I'll reply one more time and retire from the discussion. We're starting to beat a dead horse here. If the timing on Woods's interview was before McDowell had won, I will be corrected.

LoL, the guy hits a golf ball for a living. He is Tiger Woods, not Jesus Christ.

It amuses me when people think he owes them anything. His job is not to be a saint or a role model, it´s to crush his opponents and win major champiionships. I´d rather listen to a guy that tells it how he sees it and let´s you know how he feels than some fake dbag running around smiling all day. I´m surprised TW still gives interviews after everyone ripped on him because of his "scandals". Seriously, what the man does in private is nobody´s business and he doesn´t owe the fat slobs that watch him on TV anything.

[zeg]

Am I the only one that was about as choked up as Watson was while walking to the 18th green? If it weren't for the fact I was at my Dad's house with him there I'd probably have been balling my eyes out. That was rough. Tom Watson kicks ass!

I was at PB on Saturday and Sunday. It was awesome to see him and his son walking the course together. On Sunday I was camped right against the ropes between the 15th green and the 16th tee box where most players walked right by. Watson finished out at the far point of the 15th green so he took the route at the far side of the bunker rather than walking right by (bummer), but he was clearly enjoying the opportunity to be out there, even if he barely squeaked into weekend play and put up only average numbers. He hadn't started tearing up at that point, but he just had a different look in his eyes and a different spring in his step---unlike everyone else, I didn't get the sense that he was suffering the grind on Sunday.

Couldn't disagree more. I don't care what he says in the interview, except that I might find it funny if, for once, he gave a truly honest answer and said "That's an awfully stupid question Roger. I'm gonna get out of here. Let me know next time if you can come up with something decent." Again, at least that would be funny. You're looking at Tiger through the poo-colored glasses you want to look at him through. He's not gracious, but he's won 14 majors. I don't think Tiger can be both, and I very, very, VERY much prefer that he win majors than answer a stupid question by giving some fake answer meant to please people.

I agree---I'd rather hear what he actually thinks (in response to worthwhile questions) than treat the interview as a little test to see if he can say all the right things in response to questions that amount to lousy air-time filler. I'm not a fan of some of Tiger's behavior, but I appreciate his no-nonsense demeanor in the interviews. He says what he wants to say and that's it, and I believe he means what he says.

I'd be quite curious to know what was so tough on Sunday. I was there for both Saturday and Sunday and where I was hanging out it may have been a touch cooler and maybe a hair windier on Sunday, but it didn't seem like particularly treacherous weather conditions. I think DJ's meltdown was just that, no further explanation needed, but it seemed like on the other days some solid below-par rounds were posted with regularity, even if most of the field was above par. Very odd.

[PEZGolf]

Personally, I enjoyed the way McDowell handled himself during the round and afterward. He was one cool performer---that downhill par saver he made (I believe it was on #8) was critical. He played #14 intelligently after a drive into trouble---he hit the shots to give himself a bogey and avoid a double or worse. On Fathers Day, it was great to see his Dad there and give him a huge bear hug (was the other fellow his brother?).

At the awards ceremony, he looked up as if to thank God, and hugged the trophy as the precious symbol it is. He talked sympathetically about Dustin during the interviews, and said he is still an excellent player. Sure it is easy to be classy when you win, but he did a fine job, and included the obligatory mention of Guinness for a celebratory brew!

[The Recreational Golfer]

Couldn't disagree more. I don't care what he says in the interview, except that I might find it funny if, for once, he gave a truly honest answer and said "That's an awfully stupid question Roger. I'm gonna get out of here. Let me know next time if you can come up with something decent." Again, at least that would be funny. You're looking at Tiger through the poo-colored glasses you want to look at him through. He's not gracious, but he's won 14 majors. I don't think Tiger can be both, and I very, very, VERY much prefer that he win majors than answer a stupid question by giving some fake answer meant to please people.

Remember, Rolfing's innocuous question was, "Tiger, what will you take home from this week?" I can't see how that's "an awfully stupid question." As for the "poo-colored glasses comment", isn't that a bit out of line for the owner of the forum to say to a member for expressing an opinion you don't agree with? Is that really the tone you want to set for the forum, and the expression of the leadership you want to establish? You locked my Masters thread down for opining that the Masters isn't a major, and now this. Is the rule on this forum, agree with you or else? Even in explaining to another poster my point of view, I have never been personally abusive. Needless to say, I'm quite taken aback by this. Be hard on ideas, easy on people. It will serve you well.

BTW, in the current Golfweek magazine, writer Bradley S. Klein said, "The post-round interview that mark Rolfing had with Tiger Woods showed Tiger at his most petulant and self-absorbed." letters@golfweek.com if you want to disagree with Mr. Klein.