Tiger Woods Master Catch-All Discussion

[Valleygolfer]

I decided I would start this thread because it seems like we have to be talking about this on a regular basis so I figured why not pool them to one spot.

As someone who works with back injuries, the speculation, method of treatments and over analyzing makes me laugh a bit.

In my professional opinion, I am surprised that Tiger is playing this weekend if his spasms were debilitating enough. Also just because he has a team of people working on him, doesn't mean that he would heal faster. Sometimes you have to leave it alone and do minimalistic treatments to let it recover.

He did carry himself last week like he was having problems. The golf channel and having EVERYONE put their 2 cents in on back injuries is irritating.

[Hammer 4]

I'm kind of surprised that he's playing this week too. Having had back problems for oh, about 50 yrs.when ever my back acted up, it usually took more than a few days for my back to be back to normal, what ever that is.

I see him pulling out of the tourney again. IMHO Tiger needs to take some time off, and tend to healing his back up. Back problems are no laughing matter, and in my experience time is the best way to heal up, with some medical help of course.

I wish him all the best, as it would be such a waste to see his talent unused.

[dennyjones]

I'll be surprised if this doesn't become the biggest thread on the forum.   He's always hurt and somebody is always talking about it.

[imsys0042]

I"m going to paraphrase VanSickle from SI on this one.   "We don't know since Tiger and company are so tight lipped".

[Valleygolfer]

I have to watch his play tonight. If I was him and if I was still trying to make a swing change I would try to find one that that keeps him healthy...

[ChrisP]

I've had lower back problems and they are painful beyond belief. And it's not something that goes away overnight or over a week's time. I'm wondering if he has a herniated disc because that's something that really therapy can't heal and it stays with you for a long time.

[Spitfisher]

I'm not surprised at all he is playing- I guess I developed a pessimistic doubt of no matter what he says there is a chance of it being Bull sh*t.  As we all know Rory a year ago walked off after playing poorly, said he had too much pain due to tooth infection, Rory later admitted this was not the case. Rory is not Tiger but given Tigers history, and Rory's action. Without any early indication of back pain visably, he shoots five over for 9, then proceeds to miss his next 4 birdie putts, with still no indication of pain even while handing hi card over, even while speaking with officials. I know what that looks like to me, looks like he had no chance of even a top ten, hey Lindsey warm up the car will you?..

He later releases a tweet he had the same back pain as at the Barclays, at the Barclays he was down on all 4s, wincing on every shot, dropping his club after swings-we saw none of that, instead we saw him quit at the Honda 2014.

so no I am not surprised he is playing, not at all.

[iacas]

  Spitfisher said:

I'm not surprised at all he is playing- I guess I developed a pessimistic doubt of no matter what he says there is a chance of it being Bull sh*t.  As we all know Rory a year ago walked off after playing poorly, said he had too much pain due to tooth infection, Rory later admitted this was not the case. Rory is not Tiger but given Tigers history, and Rory's action. Without any early indication of back pain visably, he shoots five over for 9, then proceeds to miss his next 4 birdie putts, with still no indication of pain even while handing hi card over, even while speaking with officials. I know what that looks like to me, looks like he had no chance of even a top ten, hey Lindsey warm up the car will you?.

The bold is simply not true.

[Spitfisher]

  iacas said:

The bold is simply not true.

I didn't see it and and it fooled the commentators in the tower and the ones following him. here is a clip, seems to walking fine and acting fine...

[iacas]

  Spitfisher said:

I didn't see it and and it fooled the commentators in the tower and the ones following him.

There were several reports of his exaggerated stretching routines that were very much out of the ordinary for him. Several said he was in clear discomfort even before he teed off on his first hole.

[Spitfisher]

  iacas said:

There were several reports of his exaggerated stretching routines that were very much out of the ordinary for him. Several said he was in clear discomfort even before he teed off on his first hole.

Hear say and ineuendo. None of these so called witnesses or casual fans were quoted or ever said anything on camera. Is it possible maybe, Jimenz stretches on the range on the range too.  Even his playing partner did not say he saw anything.

I am confident all players do some stretching, there was nothing reported the day after on the morning drive indication any pain he was experiencing and they covered the story like JFK just got shot.

[iacas]

  Spitfisher said:

Hear say and ineuendo.

One of them was the Twitter account that follows Tiger around just about every round he plays around the world.

https://twitter.com/GCTigerTracker/status/440175705113264128

Tiger takes ample time to stretch out the back on 1 tee. Iron down the pipe to start things off.

— GC Tiger Tracker (@GCTigerTracker) March 2, 2014

https://twitter.com/GCTigerTracker/status/440203638485831680

Tiger rubs his lower back a bit after sending tee shot at 9 toward gallery on the right. Settles right next to a tree. He is thrilled.

— GC Tiger Tracker (@GCTigerTracker) March 2, 2014

https://twitter.com/GCTigerTracker/status/440211447419637760

Tiger has been stretching his back from the start today. Not saying that's the reason for his poor play, but, yes, it might be the reason.

— GC Tiger Tracker (@GCTigerTracker) March 2, 2014

https://twitter.com/GCTigerTracker/status/440214681710387200

Fair point, although the stretching preceded the bad play today. RT @brettl8n don't see him "stretch the back" when he shoots 65.

— GC Tiger Tracker (@GCTigerTracker) March 2, 2014

https://twitter.com/GCTigerTracker/status/440225891998654464

Official reason for the W/D is a back injury. Definitely seemed to be bothering him from the get-go today.

— GC Tiger Tracker (@GCTigerTracker) March 2, 2014

---

Two others were people I know.

So no, not hearsay.

[Phil McGleno]

@Spitfisher just got burned.

[teamroper60]

  Spitfisher said:

Hear say and ineuendo. None of these so called witnesses or casual fans were quoted or ever said anything on camera.

Tim Rosaforte has been talking about it on the golf channel all week.   He said it was obvious to him that Tiger was in discomfort.

[JP golf]

A little perspective on "quitting or not finishing a tournament"  - Does Tiger face a different set of expectations and standards?

I just want to point out a quick something for all those that say Tiger quits all the time when he's behind and that he's done... (please keep in mind that from the start of a tournament to the finish of a tournament - all 4 days-  Tiger has completed a higher percentage of full tournaments (all 4 days, making the cut, not WD) that he has started than almost any golfer of reputable status.

Tiger's missed about 10 cuts since turning pro (compare to 70+ for Jack and Phil each, which is still good) and has had 7 WD's (6 since turning pro) from PGA tour events.  Tiger completes (& makes the cut without withdrawing) 94.5% of every PGA tournament he enters - The numbers are something like 289 Tournaments since 96'.  He has only failed to make the cut or has withdrawn from only 16 of those.  That's impressive!

I pulled these from www.pgatour.com career stats from the players profiles...

Career WD:
7 - Tiger Woods (6 since turning pro)
7 - Jack Nicklaus
23 - Arnold Palmer
17 - Lee Travino
20 - Johnny Miller
29 - Mark Calcavecchia
19 - Sam Snead
14 - Gary McCord
19 - Lanny Watkins
15 - Mark O' Meara
11 - Fuzzy Zoeller
10 - Greg Norman
10 - David Duval
9 - Ben Crenshaw
12 - Curtis Strange
8 - Fred Couples
9 - Davis Love III
4 - Phil Mickelson

[Spitfisher]

This shows your data in a slightly different light, regardless of tweets and opinion. I Still feel he withdrew ( quit) at very least by the convenience of a spasmatic back or none at all. That's my opinion and others. Let's look at the percentage of withdrawals by 20 notable players as garnered from Golf Digest. I've ranked them from best to worst. 1. Billy Haas: 0 withdrawn in 246 tournaments - % = 0.00 2. Tom Watson: 1 out of 612 = 0.16% 3. Steward Cink: 1 out of 465 = 0.21% 4. Adam Scott: 1 out of 218 = 0.46% 5. Steve Stricker: 2 out of 430 = 0.47% 6. Ernie Els: 2 out of 366 = .0.55% 7. Matt Kuchar: 2 out of 306 = 0.65% 8. Zach Johnson: 2 out of 269 = 0.74% 9. Phil Mickelson: 4 out of 492 = 0.81% 10. Fred Couples: 6 out of 607 = 0.99% 11. Jack Nicklaus: 7 out of 595 (6 came after the age of 38) = 1.17% 12. Davis Love: 9 out of 687 = 1.31% 13. VJ Singh: 7 out of 529 = 1.32% 14. Nick Faldo: 4 out of 302 = 1.32% 15. Rory McIlroy: 1 out of 73 = 1.37% 16. Tiger Woods: 6 out of 297 = 2.02% Woods isn't even close.

[MS256]

It's hard to find any two of exactly "the same" injury so nobody really ever knows exactly what somebody else is feeling with any injury.

Almost any athlete in almost any sport would be more likely to come out of a game with an injury when the game is no longer winnable. As long as a win is possible it may be worth it to fight through the injury, but once it's 40 to 7 in the fourth quarter it's stupid to stay out there with an injury and only make it worse.

In team sports the coach usually takes over and gets his best player out of there but in an individual sport the player has to be the one to say it's time to call it a day.

[RightEdge]

  ChrisP said:

I've had lower back problems and they are painful beyond belief. And it's not something that goes away overnight or over a week's time. I'm wondering if he has a herniated disc because that's something that really therapy can't heal and it stays with you for a long time.

I know EXACTLY what Tiger is dealing with because I have the same thing. Some back issues can cause spasms and believe me buddy when you get a spasm you lose stability in your legs.  Sometimes I can't even stand up much less take a swing at a golf ball.  You absolutely cannot turn and ANY shot you hit IS NOT going to go straight.  At that point all you can do is pretty much swing your arms, flip your hands and pray for some miracle result.