Tiger Woods Master Catch-All Discussion

[k-troop]

5 minutes ago, Phil McGleno said:

He took 17 months off.-He seems to have followed their orders.

That is between him and the companies.-Does not matter to you one bit.

So you are pissed on behalf of one of the Tour's most asshole bag carriers?-A jerk who was paid handsomely for carrying a bag around?

Sounds like you are trying to justify your dislike of Tiger too.-By being upset on behalf of TaylorMade or companies you do not know anything about and a huge jerk who was paid well?

Why?-What is it to you?

I would prefer that he be honest but who cares what he does or does not SAY. What matters is what he does or does not DO.

Find an athlete that has never lied about an injury and I will show you a miracle - an athlete that has never been injured. Athletes-Especially those at the top of the game - lie about injuries all the time.

Dude, re-freaking-lax.  I'm not bagging on Tiger at all.  Take a few deep breaths while reading.

[Phil McGleno]

1 minute ago, k-troop said:

Dude, re-freaking-lax.  I'm not bagging on Tiger at all.  Take a few deep breaths while reading.

I am calm here-You are the one taking offense on behalf of Steve Williams and speculating on possible fraud in his contracts.-Going a bit too far and I am just pointing it out.

[k-troop]

Just now, iacas said:

True dat. If you're blaming Tiger for not being forthcoming with his injuries, you'd be hard-pressed to find a top golfer you can like let alone an athlete in another sport.

That's not what I'm saying at all.  I'm not blaming Tiger.  I'm just saying:

1.  I don't trust what Steinberg says, and

2.  I think Tiger would help himself to be honest in general about his physical state.  I don't know if he is or not (because I'm not his doctor), but his track record isn't good, and this sounds like more of the same.

 

And @Phil McGleno you can't argue in one post that Tiger doesn't down-play his injuries, and then in the next two posts attack people who get mad because Tiger is perfectly justified in down-playing his injuries.

Just now, Phil McGleno said:

I am calm here-You are the one taking offense on behalf of Steve Williams and speculating on possible fraud in his contracts.-Going a bit too far and I am just pointing it out.

And I said right there in the post that I don't know if he's doing those things or not.  Those are just reasons that Tiger would be well served to be honest with folks.  And the post you quoted contains the disclaimer that Steve later turned out to be a massive douche-hole.

So, like I said, take a breath and read what I actually wrote.

[Phil McGleno]

1 minute ago, k-troop said:

And @Phil McGleno you can't argue in one post that Tiger doesn't down-play his injuries, and then in the next two posts attack people who get mad because Tiger is perfectly justified in down-playing his injuries.

I did not. I said he did not lie about injuries 1997-2008 when skydog said he did in his prime. Skydog has always hated Tiger.

He has lied lately yes, but so does every top athlete.

Two separate things troop.

I also do not care if he lied about them then or now.-His performance on the course mattered not whether his finger hurt or his knee injury was worse than he said it was until he told us later it was worse.

[Yukari]

Time to face the facts.  Unless it truly is 100% back spasm issue, TW's career is over.  He needs to face the reality.

I was hoping for at least a few more years of watching TW compete, but I seriously doubt that's going to happen.

[k-troop]

3 minutes ago, Phil McGleno said:

I did not. I said he did not lie about injuries 1997-2008 when skydog said he did in his prime.

So since you want to be so precise in framing your attacks, then you are dead wrong.  Because in June 2008 he deliberately misled the golf world about the extent of his knee injury.

Spoiler

And then he won the US Open on that injured leg, and went from being great to being an immortal god-like legend of the game.

 

[skydog]

2 minutes ago, iacas said:

True dat. If you're blaming Tiger for not being forthcoming with his injuries, you'd be hard-pressed to find a top golfer you can like let alone an athlete in another sport.

It's the volume and degree of the miscommunication from Tiger's camp that has worn on me over the past couple of years. Yes, of course all athletes downplay injuries and yes it's not fair because no other athlete is under the same microscope as Tiger, but when the communications get to the point of insulting our intelligence by being so far off base, that's when it perturbs me.

Rafa Nadal admitted the other week that he's basically in constant pain but he's going to try to play as long as he can. I think Tiger would be better served to say something like this instead of claiming to be healthy while it looks like he's having a hard time even walking.

[Phil McGleno]

1 minute ago, Yukari said:

Time to face the facts.  Unless it truly is 100% back spasm issue, TW's career is over.  He needs to face the reality.

I was hoping for at least a few more years of watching TW compete, but I seriously doubt that's going to happen.

I was hoping for one last gasp-And I am giving him through Augusta-But I think he is done now too. Hang with his kids, design courses, and run some tournaments dude.

He is the best ever. No shame in going out now.

[skydog]

4 minutes ago, Phil McGleno said:

Skydog has always hated Tiger.

 

Dude what is with this complex you have about me. Not even close to true.

[Phil McGleno]

Just now, k-troop said:

So since you want to be so precise in framing your attacks, then you are dead wrong.  Because in June 2008 he deliberately misled the golf world about the extent of his knee injury.

Yeah the injury was WORSE than it was. So why does that piss you off? It is not like he had a minor boo boo that he blew up into some big deal to make his win look more impressive. It was the opposite. He downplayed it and you are pissed because of that?

1997-2008 he downplayed ONE injury and it was downplayed. Man what a sleazebag.

Just now, skydog said:

It's the volume and degree of the miscommunication from Tiger's camp that has worn on me over the past couple of years.

Really just the past two years? You have hated Tiger as long as there has been a Tiger.

Just now, skydog said:

Rafa Nadal admitted the other week that he's basically in constant pain but he's going to try to play as long as he can. I think Tiger would be better served to say something like this instead of claiming to be healthy while it looks like he's having a hard time even walking.

He did not say he is healthy he said he is constantly struggling to do this. That it takes hours to loosen up to prepare to play for the day. You are hearing what you want to hear. He has said he does not care if his swing looks good so long as it protects his back. It is not like the guy is saying he is 100% and can swing normally like he used to.

2 minutes ago, skydog said:

Dude what is with this complex you have about me. Not even close to true.

Goes back way way way way longer than two years.

[iacas]

Step away for a few minutes to grab some cereal and come back to this…

Take a beat, people. Go contribute something positive to the world. Tiger sure as hell ain't right now.

[DeadMan]

 

Boy, if that's true, I don't even know what to say.

[David in FL]

36 minutes ago, DaveP043 said:

Would it be fair to suggest that the last dozen or so posts, about the history and accuracy of the public comments by Tiger and his management concerning his health, are a bit ?

In a thread titled "Tiger Woods Master Catch-All Discussion"?

I don't see how.  All Tiger, all the time!  

[iacas]

3 minutes ago, David in FL said:

In a thread titled "Tiger Woods Master Catch-All Discussion"?

I don't see how.  All Tiger, all the time!  

You missed my post right after that…

[DaveP043]

3 minutes ago, David in FL said:

In a thread titled "Tiger Woods Master Catch-All Discussion"?

I don't see how.  All Tiger, all the time!  

At the time, it was all in 

It seemed to me that discussion of the nearly 20 year record of public statements by Tiger and his team about Tiger's health, and the effect of those statements on his image in the minds of the posters, was well beyond the scope of predictions for 2017.  That's why that part of the string was moved here, where it does belong.  You'll see that mentioned in post #1600, just below mine a bit.

[David in FL]

2 minutes ago, DaveP043 said:

At the time, it was all in 

It seemed to me that discussion of the nearly 20 year record of public statements by Tiger and his team about Tiger's health, and the effect of those statements on his image in the minds of the posters, was well beyond the scope of predictions for 2017.  That's why that part of the string was moved here, where it does belong.  You'll see that mentioned in post #1600, just below mine a bit.

Well that explains it!  

[skydog]

1 hour ago, Phil McGleno said:

Goes back way way way way longer than two years.

Since I joined this forum 3+ years ago I said that I thought Tiger's career was done because of his nerve issues. You and many others at the time labeled me a hater and somehow still to this day you believe that instead of maybe thinking that I was just making an objective (and unfortunately-probably accurate) prediction about his future. It was never what I wanted to see happen, just what I thought to be the case from what I know about the back and nerve damage.

Fans are allowed to be critical of the athletes we watch without being called haters....I have always been more of a Phil fan than Tiger fan but there are plenty of things Phil does/has done that pizz me off, and I'll be the first to call him out on it.  Personality wise I never cared much for Tiger in his prime but I still am hoping my prediction about his future is wrong and he has some life left to his game.

Edited February 3, 2017 by skydog

[mvmac]

In terms of Tiger taking his injuries seriously I think he showed that by taking 15 months off. If what @DeadMan posted is true (find it hard to believe) then yeah that's probably not the best course of action. I don't think Tiger is as smart as he's perceived to be.

With the "lying" bit, maybe I'm cynical but I expect there to be some "spin" when he or Steinberg are talking about his health. I also think they don't actually know how his back is because it can probably feel fine one minute and sore the next. There is no reliable "data" for them to go by, especially when he's just hanging out at home. I'm pretty sure though that he's not entering tournaments with the plan to WD after one round. Tiger won't know how healthy or unhealthy his back is until he tests it out in tournament conditions, that's what he's doing and it puts him in a vulnerable position (media wise).