Jump to content
IGNORED

Change the Dang Picture!


mvmac
Note: This thread is 1974 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Recommended Posts

  • Moderator

It's really great that the Member Swings forum has become such a popular place on The Sand Trap. We feel that the level of knowledge and advice shared really sets us apart from other golf social media sites. It's a lot of fun to see someone post how they're hitting it better or that they had a great round after receiving advice on the forum. If you haven't done so, check it out and start your own thread. And if you do, this is a MUST read thread

Ok now to the point of the reason I'm starting this thread. When changing a certain part of your swing, it's best to rehearse it slowly as @iacas points out in the The Five "S"s of Great Practice thread . We like to call it "changing the picture". Meaning when you look at your swing on video, change what you're seeing with your priority piece. Quickie example: some players get the club head too low and inside on the takeaway causing the shaft to be too shallow on the backswing and then it steepens on the downswing. So they need to feel something to change the way the club loads in the backswing so it can shallow on the downswing. What they feel isn't important to this thread (we have a bunch of feels we share), what is important is how they go about practicing it.

The mistake golfers can fall into is practicing at full speed. The changes with the followup video, if any, are usually minor. The problem is you can't really make changes just feeling something different at full speed. Changing a piece of your swing is basically changing a motor pattern, almost like if I asked you to change the way you walk, you would have to slow down and be aware of how your body is moving. Same with the golf swing.

Here's a few swings of mine from a couple days ago. I tend to have the head "drift" a little too far forward from the top of the backswing as I transition. So in this video I'm visualizing that someone has a stick against the left side of my head. I'm also doing these swings somewhere in the 20-40% speed range. I've slowed it down enough that I'm aware and in control of how my body is working to produce the picture I want. I'm "proving" to myself that I can do it, even if it is really, really slow. The point is, I'm changing the picture, it looks different than my "normal" swing and if I can do it at 40% speed, I'll eventually be able to do at full speed. Or at least come close ;-)

This is exactly how Justin Rose ingrained the swing upgrades he got from Sean Foley. First ten swings of the day were super slow swings, from address to finish, being aware and in control the entire tim e. It's also how Charles Howell III practices. Rehearsing the motion at slower speeds will also help you "catch" yourself when you do go back to full speed swings. The old flaw will rear it's head and you'll be able to feel it.

So, when submitting a follow up swing, whether it's on this site, to your instructor, for your own viewing:

- Change the picture, don't waste your time trying to make changes at full speed.

- Perform the motion at slower speeds. You don't necessarily have to make the entire swing slow, focus on the portion you are trying to improve. If you have to swing at 10% speed to make the change, then swing at 10%.

- Ask yourself, "If this different than the original swing I posted?"

- Don't be concerned with what the ball does at first.

- Don't worry about it looking "silly", this is how you get better. Would you rather continue to hit bad golf shots or spend 10 minutes a day "feeling weird" but making measurable improvements?

- You can (and should) do this at home, in front of a mirror, heck, film yourself at home. You don't have to do this on the range. Although I would suggest you do some practice like this on the range.

  • Upvote 4

Mike McLoughlin

Check out my friends on Evolvr!
Follow The Sand Trap on Twitter!  and on Facebook
Golf Terminology -  Analyzr  -  My FacebookTwitter and Instagram 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

  • Moderator

Thanks for posting @mvmac .  It takes a lot of discipline to practice slower.  I have promised myself that I will do it this way this year.  I just went on a four day golf trip and I asked my Evolvr instructor Stephan, @sk golf , this very question.  I have been practicing my priority piece at slow motion, but I wondered what I should do when playing.  Stephan basically told me to warm up with slow motion to start at the range, but stop thinking about it during the round and just use the slow motion part as part of my pre-shot if needed. This worked well.

I know I have a long way to go, but I am seeing improvement.

Scott

Titleist, Edel, Scotty Cameron Putter, Snell - AimPoint - Evolvr - MirrorVision

My Swing Thread

boogielicious - Adjective describing the perfect surf wave

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Really nice post Mike! Lately I've been doing "sandwiches" where the first rep is slow enough to change the picture 100% of the time (perhaps even over doing it) the second rep is faster and really at the edge of my ability so the picture only changes about 50% of the time, and the 3rd rep is slow enough that the picture changes 100% of the time...
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Can all changes be made at slow speed? For example, my latest thing to work on is my setup (foot angles, knees, back angle), with the goal of being better at key #1. Is there a way I can work on that change in slow, other than setting up and doing the full swing slowly? I figure slowly setting up probably isn't the effect we're talking about.

-- Michael | My swing! 

"You think you're Jim Furyk. That's why your phone is never charged." - message from my mother

Driver:  Titleist 915D2.  4-wood:  Titleist 917F2.  Titleist TS2 19 degree hybrid.  Another hybrid in here too.  Irons 5-U, Ping G400.  Wedges negotiable (currently 54 degree Cleveland, 58 degree Titleist) Edel putter. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

  • Administrator

Can all changes be made at slow speed? For example, my latest thing to work on is my setup (foot angles, knees, back angle), with the goal of being better at key #1. Is there a way I can work on that change in slow, other than setting up and doing the full swing slowly? I figure slowly setting up probably isn't the effect we're talking about.

Setup isn't a dynamic thing. By the very nature it isn't something you do "quickly."

I ask people how much athletic skill it takes to set up properly. They correctly answer "none." I remind them that setting up properly is often simply a matter of remembering to do it. Nothing more.

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 & "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 :edel: :true_linkswear:

Check Out: New Topics | TST Blog | Golf Terms | Instructional Content | Analyzr | LSW | Instructional Droplets

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Can all changes be made at slow speed? For example, my latest thing to work on is my setup (foot angles, knees, back angle), with the goal of being better at key #1. Is there a way I can work on that change in slow, other than setting up and doing the full swing slowly? I figure slowly setting up probably isn't the effect we're talking about.

No, the slow part is mainly for dynamic aspects of your swing. For set-up I would suggest just working with a mirror and make sure you can consistently set-up they way you want/need to. Set-up is something I need to work on a bit as well, ball more forward, slight push of the hips to preset my axis tilt a bit and making sure my head stay a tad behind the ball. I plan on setting up a mirror and possibly even marking or taping some lines on it to help me monitor the changes until it feels natural i.e.: practice it until I can't get it wrong.

Yours in earnest, Jason.
Call me Ernest, or EJ or Ernie.

PSA - "If you find yourself in a hole, STOP DIGGING!"

My Whackin' Sticks: :cleveland: 330cc 2003 Launcher 10.5*  :tmade: RBZ HL 3w  :nickent: 3DX DC 3H, 3DX RC 4H  :callaway: X-22 5-AW  :nike:SV tour 56* SW :mizuno: MP-T11 60* LW :bridgestone: customized TD-03 putter :tmade:Penta TP3   :aimpoint:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Thanks for posting Mike. I've started doing this at the range more and practicing my priority pieces a lot slower. I saw it somewhere in the forum (can't remember who posted it) but he said that "if you can't do it slow, then you can't do it fast" or something to that extent.

Best Regards,
Ryan

In the :ogio: bag:
:nike: VR-S Covert Tour Driver 10.5 :nike: VR-S Covert Tour 3W :titleist: 712U 21*
:nike: VR Pro Blades 4-PW :vokey: Vokeys 52*, 56* & 60* :scotty_cameron: Studio Select Newport 2
:leupold:
:true_linkswear: 

Link to comment
Share on other sites


Setup isn't a dynamic thing. By the very nature it isn't something you do "quickly." I ask people how much athletic skill it takes to set up properly. They correctly answer "none." I remind them that setting up properly is often simply a matter of remembering to do it. Nothing more.

This makes sense. Next time I have a dynamic move to change - and I'm sure I will - I'll be sure to practice slower. Thanks!

-- Michael | My swing! 

"You think you're Jim Furyk. That's why your phone is never charged." - message from my mother

Driver:  Titleist 915D2.  4-wood:  Titleist 917F2.  Titleist TS2 19 degree hybrid.  Another hybrid in here too.  Irons 5-U, Ping G400.  Wedges negotiable (currently 54 degree Cleveland, 58 degree Titleist) Edel putter. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Quote:

Change the picture, don't waste your time trying to make changes at full speed.

- Perform the motion at slower speeds. You don't necessarily have to make the entire swing slow, focus on the portion you are trying to improve. If you have to swing at 10% speed to make the change, then swing at 10%.

- Ask yourself, "If this different than the original swing I posted?"

- Don't be concerned with what the ball does at first.

- Don't worry about it looking "silly", this is how you get better. Would you rather continue to hit bad golf shots or spend 10 minutes a day "feeling weird" but making measurable improvements?

- You can (and should) do this at home, in front of a mirror, heck, film yourself at home. You don't have to do this on the range. Although I would suggest you do some practice like this on the range.

I really like this and have never really consistently practice this way, but it really makes sense to me. Thanks for the reminder!

Kurt

Link to comment
Share on other sites


I did this on the range today. Just practicing banking the right foot over and over again, super duper slow. This is such an easy thing to forget.

Hunter Bishop

"i was an aspirant once of becoming a flamenco guitarist, but i had an accident with my fingers"

My Bag

Titleist TSI3 | TaylorMade Sim 2 Max 3 Wood | 5 Wood | Edel 3-PW | 52° | 60° | Blade Putter

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

I wish I had the willpower to do this more. Do try, but if there are balls in the tray I always end up bashing away again at full speed looking for the golden ticket feel.

Truly stupid monkey.

Stretch.

"In the process of trial and error, our failed attempts are meant to destroy arrogance and provoke humility." -- Master Jin Kwon

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

I have never practiced that way. Tend to do everything full speed. I am going to do this with what you advised for me in my swing. It makes perfect sense. I work in Physical Therapy and often have to teach people how to mobilize out of beds/chairs, climb steps, and exercise. I always make them do it correctly in a slow manner. I never think to do that with my golf swing. Thanks.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


I wish I had the willpower to do this more. Do try, but if there are balls in the tray I always end up bashing away again at full speed looking for the golden ticket feel.

Truly stupid monkey.

The siren song of bashing one WAY out there!

  • Thumbs Up 1

Yours in earnest, Jason.
Call me Ernest, or EJ or Ernie.

PSA - "If you find yourself in a hole, STOP DIGGING!"

My Whackin' Sticks: :cleveland: 330cc 2003 Launcher 10.5*  :tmade: RBZ HL 3w  :nickent: 3DX DC 3H, 3DX RC 4H  :callaway: X-22 5-AW  :nike:SV tour 56* SW :mizuno: MP-T11 60* LW :bridgestone: customized TD-03 putter :tmade:Penta TP3   :aimpoint:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

May sound dumb, but what I did was starting out I made sure that my full swing had to start, and end no sooner than with a count of 1001, 1002, 1003...slower is even better to get the correct feel and sequence, at least for me. If I can do it, any one can.. ;-)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

  • Moderator

I work in Physical Therapy and often have to teach people how to mobilize out of beds/chairs, climb steps, and exercise. I always make them do it correctly in a slow manner. I never think to do that with my golf swing. Thanks.

Great feedback, thanks

Mike McLoughlin

Check out my friends on Evolvr!
Follow The Sand Trap on Twitter!  and on Facebook
Golf Terminology -  Analyzr  -  My FacebookTwitter and Instagram 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Finally have trained myself to automatically flare both feet versus having to remind myself, took about 3 weeks to get it.

Rich C.

Driver Titleist 915 D3  9.5*
3 Wood TM RBZ stage 2 tour  14.5*
2 Hybrid Cobra baffler 17*
4Hybrid Adams 23*
Irons Adams CB2's 5-GW
Wedges 54* and 58* Titleist vokey
Putter Scotty Cameron square back 2014
Ball Srixon Zstar optic yellow
bushnell V2 slope edition

Link to comment
Share on other sites


Note: This thread is 1974 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


  • Want to join this community?

    We'd love to have you!

    Sign Up
  • TST Partners

    TourStriker PlaneMate
    Golfer's Journal
    ShotScope
    The Stack System
    FitForGolf
    FlightScope Mevo
    Direct: Mevo, Mevo+, and Pro Package.

    Coupon Codes (save 10-20%): "IACAS" for Mevo/Stack/FitForGolf, "IACASPLUS" for Mevo+/Pro Package, and "THESANDTRAP" for ShotScope. 15% off TourStriker (no code).
  • Posts

    • Day 187 (05 Nov 24) -  Got in some time with the 4&5 hybrids in the backyard - hitting hard foam balls.  Rehearsing preshot routine, focusing on tempo, by reenacting some of the shorter par 4s at my regular course - hybrid off the tee, hybrid approaches. 
    • Day 36 - 2024-11-05 Went downtown for a little over three hours. 90 minutes of that was doing other stuff, but I got a little practice in. Some messing with GSPro (v3 is now out) and the settings, some chipping, some little stuff. Not a ton of full swing stuff, and what I did there was mostly backswing stuff.
    • Great point - my experience from the 2004 Oakland Hills Ryder Cup. I got 4 tickets for Friday, had some buddies go with me and we saw shots on about 4 holes. You really have to decide who you want to see, then try to jump ahead to see them somewhere on the back 9. If you got into the grandstands then you'd likely have a good view only of that green/tee box.  Sidenote: I knew a guy who was a member at Birmingham CC, and he was a marshal on the 18th hole and he was out there all day, both morning and afternoon groups. And he had 1 group play the hole in the morning and another in the afternoon. Huge corporate tents around the 18 green, along with some grandstands. And you get to see maybe 6 or 7 shots counting the approach and putts.  Learned my lesson, I have no issue in going to another Ryder Cup, especially at the prices they want for 2025. I think it was $40 for a practice round (went to one of those as well) and maybe $75 for Friday/Saturday, $100 for Sunday. And it was "limited" to 20,000 tickets/day, which is still very crowded to follow 4 pairings around the course.
    • Of course he can score in the low 70's in a really short course driving it that short. But the course rating is going to be in the 60's so is not like he can call himself a scratch player. 
    • Wordle 1,235 4/6 ⬜⬜⬜⬜🟨 🟨⬜🟨⬜🟩 🟩⬜🟨🟩🟩 🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Welcome to TST! Signing up is free, and you'll see fewer ads and can talk with fellow golf enthusiasts! By using TST, you agree to our Terms of Use, our Privacy Policy, and our Guidelines.

The popup will be closed in 10 seconds...