2016 Masters Toonamint Discussion Thread

[natureboy]

9 hours ago, saevel25 said:

He had 286 strokes, He had 112 putts for the week. So that leaves him 174 non putting. He had 29 short game shots. That leaves him with 145 full shots and a handful of punch outs. 

So 1-3% would be 1.5 to 4 shots ending right on the whole week. Sorry, he had that many in the final round alone. Lets say he had 4 shots per round that ended up with that miss right he was fighting. That would mean he had a 11% chance of that swing showing up when he tried to hit a fade. Maybe more-so since he was struggling with that miss the previous two holes.

I think your first picture was off on the ball landing location. If he was aiming for the center of the green it was about a 17 yard error right. Would have been fine on distance if he hadn't pushed it as much. If he had the same degree error on a drive it would have been ~ 35 yards offline or ~ 24 yards offline on a 200 yard approach. I didn't see errors that large with a 10% frequency, but haven't looked at all his shots on the tracker.

Given how close he actually ended up being to the straight line to the pin, I think he may have been aiming for a conservative target closer to center of the green, but the loss of ball speed plus the added angle with the flare killed him on the needed carry. A straight push on the same line would have been dry IMO. So in his own words of 'one bad swing' isn't necessarily that far off, but I agree there were others that had he hit better (the subsequent drop on 12 or the pitch to 18 on Saturday) would have preserved a more comforting cushion of shots.

If he was aiming about where this camera was positioned then his target was likely halfway between center of green and the pin and may have been too aggressive a target given his odd 'flare' miss. If his target was about midway between center green and the pin the same error in degrees on a 290 drive would be about 16 yards, which I did see pretty frequently throughout his rounds.

Spieth's shot on 12 just after the first bounce) line from the tee through where it hit would put it ~ on the far right of the green (relative to the tee) if it had carried pin-high.

 

Excellent past article on the challenge of the 12th: http://www.golfdigest.com/story/augusta-12th-hole-guy-yocom

Edited April 11, 2016 by natureboy

[skydog]

Just to clarify, DW is fully a deserving champion and a good player. I just think golf is on the precipice of having another great era with Rory, Day, and Spieth winning a lot and whether you like it or not, outside of the UK, this Masters will be remembered for Spieth's meltdown and very few will remember who won it.

As an anecdote, I was helping a buddy move yesterday and he had four movers at his house. Not trying to stereotype but they looked like the four last guys in the world who would care about the Masters (one of them had a full gold grill in his mouth)- all four of them were talking about how excited they were to match the final round because of Spieth and Rory (three of them were Spieth fans and one for Rory). No golf doesn't 'need' these general sports fans, but IMO it's pretty cool when the whole sports world cares about golf (like it did with Tiger), and when guys like DW win, it doesn't help that cause. Just my $0.02.

That aside, Spieth will be back. Will be reasonably surprised if he doesn't win a major this year.

[nevets88]

Most betting houses had DW (Dee Dub - I like that) around 50/1 before The Masters started, so not a complete unknown to LV.

Post round interview w/DW.

http://www.masters.com/en_US/watch/2016-04-10/32139_0410_1.html

Adam Sarson: The 42 minutes that cost Jordan Spieth the Masters

https://adamsarson.com/2016/04/11/the-42-minutes-that-cost-jordan-spieth-the-masters/

TV: CBS falters on several fronts at Masters

Quote

For the better part of four days, CBS’ cameras lingered excessively on Jordan Spieth, to the exclusion of the vast majority of the field.

Think of all the players who got little or no airtime: J.B. Holmes, Matthew Fitzpatrick, Justin Rose, Daniel Berger and Brandt Snedeker all finished T-10 or better but were all but frozen out by CBS. I could go on, but you get my drift.

Meanwhile, CBS’ cameras followed Spieth as he walked around the course and agonized over every shot. We saw recurring Spieth highlights packages. And this being Augusta National, we saw long beauty shots of the course and incessant leaderboards.

Here’s something odd: Sky Sports and the BBC use Protracer and 3-D graphics in their Masters coverage for U.K. viewers. Why is the coverage overseas more sophisticated than what we see in the U.S.?

Late on Sunday, after the outcome had been decided, Nantz said, “There’s an old saying in golf, ‘beware the joyous father.’ ”

Now, I had never heard that saying, so I Googled it and found one reference. An April 6 story about Willett in The Telegraph, a British newspaper, included this passage: “There is an old saying in golf, ‘beware the joyous father. . .’ ” That’s the only reference I found to that oddly obscure “old saying.”

http://golfweek.com/2016/04/10/2016-masters-cbs-falters-tv-dottie-pepper/

[natureboy]

42 minutes ago, newtogolf said:

Great interview by Jordan thanks @natureboy for posting it.  He has a great head on his shoulders and was composed even after a major loss which is how a professional should act.  If he wins the next Major, the pain of this one will hurt a bit less.

I was even kind of surprised he was doing so well this year, because I expected a let-down after an historic year and his long game seemed a bit off from 2015 and 2013. He's clearly got a good system for peaking at the right time.

Edited April 11, 2016 by natureboy

[Marty2019]

I thought the TV coverage, after Spieth's disaster on the 12 hole, was like a funeral service.  

 

 

[saevel25]

16 minutes ago, natureboy said:

I think your first picture was off on the ball landing location. If he was aiming for the center of the green it was about a 17 yard error right. Would have been fine on distance if he hadn't pushed it as much. If he had the same degree error on a drive it would have been ~ 35 yards offline or ~ 24 yards offline on a 200 yard approach. I didn't see errors that large with a 10% frequency, but haven't looked at all his shots on the tracker.

Ok, I was off by about 1-2 yards 

The ball landed down the blue arrow. The black spot on the ground is the shadow from the ball that is located in the top right area of the red circle.

[natureboy]

24 minutes ago, saevel25 said:

Ok, I was off by about 1-2 yards 

The ball landed down the blue arrow. The black spot on the ground is the shadow from the ball that is located in the top right area of the red circle.

Yeah, I was trying to edit my post to say 'slightly off'. Here's one where the ball is visible. So if he was going at the TV tower / splitting the back bunkers like in the discussion with Greller then his degree of error was still about what I had in my original example. About a 15-16 yard lateral error on a 152 yard carry or a 28 yard error on a 290 drive.

 

17.5% of the field put it in the water off the tee on Sunday.

Edited April 11, 2016 by natureboy

[Acropo]

15 hours ago, b101 said:

Nope, I'm pretty happy with Willett. Hasn't hit many loose shots over the week, has played some tight golf and putted seriously well.

He was runner-up in the Race to Dubai (European Tour) last year, as well; only Rory beat him. He's a pretty handy player.

[Acropo]

15 hours ago, skydog said:

I didn't want to see Spieth run away with it but relative no name winners are not good for the game at this point IMO. Yes, yes, to die hard golf fans he's not a no name, but to 99% of folks he is.

You mean: to 99% of folks in America, I think?

DW has won in S Africa, the Middle East and contended all over the world. He's already got five Ws on the European Tour. He finished runner up in the order of merit (Race to Dubai) last year, second only to a certain R McIlroy. He is already pretty well-known; but I think it is fair to say he has been underestimated.

[Nosevi]

50 minutes ago, skydog said:

....... outside of the UK, this Masters will be remembered for Spieth's meltdown and very few will remember who won it.

Do you mean "inside the US....." rather than "outside the UK......." ? The European Tour plays all over the world and DW has won on several continents. I may be biased as DW is from my neck of the woods (50 miles from where I'm sitting) but are you sure your views aren't just a tad 'insular' ? I heard of Danny Willett an awfully long time before I heard of a guy called Jordan Spieth.

You're right that Spieth will bounce back though. I like his chances for one of the other Majors this year.

[skydog]

1 minute ago, Nosevi said:

Do you mean "inside the US....." rather than "outside the UK......." ? The European Tour plays all over the world and DW has won on several continents. I may be biased as DW is from my neck of the woods (50 miles from where I'm sitting) but are you sure your views aren't just a tad 'insular' ? I heard of Danny Willett an awfully long time before I heard of a guy called Jordan Spieth.

You're right that Spieth will bounce back though. I like his chances for one of the other Majors this year.

The opinion I voiced is the same as most every person on TGC and ESPN expressed last night. Is that just from an American perspective? Perhaps. Just as yours is coming from the UK perspective. It would have been the same, however, if Rory or Day (non Americans) had blown it and DW won. The narrative would have been the same; i.e. it's not because Spieth is American but that he (and Rory and Day) are who the worldwide golf media are championing to carry golf in the post Tiger era.

[nevets88]

A very English Masters celebration.

 

[Nosevi]

5 minutes ago, skydog said:

The opinion I voiced is the same as most every person on TGC and ESPN expressed last night. Is that just from an American perspective? Perhaps. Just as yours is coming from the UK perspective. It would have been the same, however, if Rory or Day (non Americans) had blown it and DW won. The narrative would have been the same; i.e. it's not because Spieth is American but that he (and Rory and Day) are who the worldwide golf media are championing to carry golf in the post Tiger era.

That's fair, I am from the UK, but I meant that the view expressed by the US media is because Willett isn't well known in the US, not because Spieth is from there. 

[ppine]

Winning a major golf tournament is the greatest mental challenge in sports. Augusta National is so difficult that it sometimes seems evil. Some great players got so demoralized playing it that they disappeared like Phil and Adam Scott.  It is ironic that the course in April is about as perfect looking as any track in the world.

Jordan played 4 really solid rounds except for 3 holes on Sunday coming in.  It cost him the title, but there is no reason to feel sorry for him.  He showed great mental toughness in his interview and helping Willet put on the jacket.  Jordan deserves a lot of respect and is a great human for being so young.  It dawned on me that two Brits were in contention at the end.  The Masters is like a war of attrition.  Only the mentally strong are left and the Brits have all of that stoic toughness.  Even Hideki who seemed to be strong mentally, caved at the end.  This tournament is transcendent sport at its best.  It pushes human mental endurance into some category where few dare to tread.

Edited April 11, 2016 by ppine

[pumaAttack]

I was watching the replay of Jordan on #12 from the Amen Corner feed.  They showed him after the tee ball and he looked so rattled.  Twirling his club, fidgeting, pacing, etc.

I didn't see his caddie talk to him at all and wonder if he could have settled him down.  Seemed odd that he basically was an island after that when most of the  time they work together.  

[bogdan101]

I don't understand all this brouhaha about Willett being a relatively unknown player. Having the 12th ranked guy in the world (above B. Snedeker, Z. Johnson, P. Mickelson) win the Masters is hardly a surprise. If you haven't heard of him, you don't follow golf much.

Playing the whole tournament without a double and the final round bogey-free is nothing short of astounding, especially given the playing conditions this week-end.

 

 

[colin007]

wait.....the british feed had Protracer????????  WTF Murica????

[pumaAttack]

2 hours ago, skydog said:

Just to clarify, DW is fully a deserving champion and a good player. I just think golf is on the precipice of having another great era with Rory, Day, and Spieth winning a lot and whether you like it or not, outside of the UK, this Masters will be remembered for Spieth's meltdown and very few will remember who won it.

As an anecdote, I was helping a buddy move yesterday and he had four movers at his house. Not trying to stereotype but they looked like the four last guys in the world who would care about the Masters (one of them had a full gold grill in his mouth)- all four of them were talking about how excited they were to match the final round because of Spieth and Rory (three of them were Spieth fans and one for Rory). No golf doesn't 'need' these general sports fans, but IMO it's pretty cool when the whole sports world cares about golf (like it did with Tiger), and when guys like DW win, it doesn't help that cause. Just my $0.02.

That aside, Spieth will be back. Will be reasonably surprised if he doesn't win a major this year.

I would counter that sentiment with this:

More people are talking about golf today than last year.  People love watching drama and Jordan's collapse was gut wrenching.  It will add interest to the sport, especially if he wins the US Open.