Jason AllDay - Penalty Strokes for Slow Play?

[bmartin461]

Recent article about slow play on the PGA.  

http://www.sbnation.com/golf/2016/3/29/11321418/billy-horschel-players-penalized-for-slow-play-jason-day-wgc-dell-match-play-2016?ref=yfp

I understand routine is part of what makes these guys so good, but I also agree it's a bit out of control.

If you think about youth wanting to emulate their idols, this could get bad on the local courses and tournaments.  

What are your thoughts?  Should the slow play penalties be increase/enforced more often?

 

[vangator]

until they start slapping these players with penalties, they won't change

 

[SavvySwede]

19 minutes ago, bmartin461 said:

Recent article about slow play on the PGA.  

http://www.sbnation.com/golf/2016/3/29/11321418/billy-horschel-players-penalized-for-slow-play-jason-day-wgc-dell-match-play-2016?ref=yfp

I understand routine is part of what makes these guys so good, but I also agree it's a bit out of control.

If you think about youth wanting to emulate their idols, this could get bad on the local courses and tournaments.  

What are your thoughts?  Should the slow play penalties be increase/enforced more often?

 

Definitely stroke penalties. I don't care if it's the final round on Sunday, no group on the PGA Tour should be taking more than 4:10 to play a round.

[Valleygolfer]

I really had no idea except that the round was about 4 holes behind Rory and Bello's. I think rules should be enforced, if they are going to penalize for ball movement and other situations, this is pretty cut and dry. Time is a definite measurable item.

[newtogolf]

If some of the guys I play golf with closed their eyes to visualize their shots like Day does, they'd fall asleep.  

If you maintain pace with the group in front of you I don't care what pre-shot routine or visualization you do but when you fall two holes back, you need to speed things up.  

Give them one warning and put them on the clock, penalize them one stroke for each violation.  They need to target the offenders in the group not the whole group as it's not fair that one guy uses up 70% of their allotted time.  

[bmartin461]

4 minutes ago, newtogolf said:

Give them one warning and put them on the clock, penalize them one stroke for each violation.  

Can someone who knows explain what "putting them on the clock" means in a golf tournament?  I have seen it happen, but I don't understand how it's determined/enforced.

Thanks!

[Valleygolfer]

15 minutes ago, newtogolf said:

  They need to target the offenders in the group not the whole group as it's not fair that one guy uses up 70% of their allotted time.  

This should be an obvious protocol.

[Ernest Jones]

Hey, Mark Crossfield can't spell. Who knew!

[boogielicious]

48 minutes ago, bmartin461 said:

Can someone who knows explain what "putting them on the clock" means in a golf tournament?  I have seen it happen, but I don't understand how it's determined/enforced.

Thanks!

The officials for the tournament have an estimated time to play each hole. If a group is being where they should be, then a rules official will start timing them per hole. This is where they would determine if they get penalized.

Day takes way too long to putt. He, along with many other players, also wait until the other player hits before taking with his caddy about club selection, wind, aim point etc. He should have done that while the other guy was getting ready. That's where the real time loss is.

[Ernest Jones]

On a more serious note, Jason Day's pre-shot shoulder waggle is annoying.

Interesting, my posts didn't merge.

[boogielicious]

Just now, Ernest Jones said:

O a more serious note, Jason Day's pre-shot shoulder waggle is annoying.

Interesting, my posts didn't merge.

I posted in between. 

[Ernest Jones]

Just now, boogielicious said:

I posted in between. 

Oh, well stop doing that!

[jgreen85]

PGA Tour doesn't have enough money/volunteers to have every player on the clock at all times? Every sport - except baseball and it's a big topic for them - has a shot clock/game clock; golfers should have one as well. This is really is a joke at this point. What's the hold up from implementing this?

oh yea, Chess has a freaking play clock. Think of all the variables chess players have to consider, but golfers can't get put on a clock GTFOH!!

Finally, I hope I do see players' performance suffer as a result. It's a skill to be able to play well and play fast, and a skill I think golf should reward.

Edited March 29, 2016 by jgreen85

[Big Lex]

The "All" Nickname is funny.

But I don't think he's that slow, by tour standards anyway. That said.....I hate how long they take. I hate how the TV sort of glorifies it by listening in on the conversation between player and caddie....and then the announcers fawn all over the players and the caddies over the conversation, blah blah blah.

It's a catch-22. The shots are worth a lot of money. There is a lot on the line. To a point, taking more time is probably always going to help the player....having essentially unlimited time to feel ready is a huge advantage. They don't get to do this in other sports where there is a clock. So how can you discourage a behavior that is rewarded with better play and more money?

I don't like the idea of fining the player....this penalty hurts the average or struggling player much more than the uber-rich top 20 player. Stroke penalties are essentially the same thing as a fine.

So I don't think there is a lot you can do about it. We are stuck with it. Unless they want to use technology and create a true shot clock, which I wouldn't be opposed to seeing in professional tournaments. But that would be a b!tch to develop and get right.

 

[jgreen85]

4 minutes ago, Big Lex said:

So I don't think there is a lot you can do about it. We are stuck with it. Unless they want to use technology and create a true shot clock, which I wouldn't be opposed to seeing in professional tournaments. But that would be a b!tch to develop and get right.

 

nonsense. this could EASILY be developed and implemented. Have a volunteer follow each player and click a stop watch when he/she approaches his/her ball. Boom! 1950s technology gets this done. every 10 seconds over costs you a stroke.

These guys are out there for WINS. Strokes will get their attention immediately.

Edited March 29, 2016 by jgreen85

[DeadMan]

I noted this in the tournament thread. Yeah, it was pretty awful. I don't really care about slow play for professional golfers, except that amateurs emulate their routines. I know that having Day's long routine will not help me on the course one bit. But a lot of people think it would help, and it's not helped when announcers talk about visualization and how important it is for Day.

I do wish the PGA Tour would do something about it. Slow play is a scourge on our game. And I can't think of many PGA Tour players who are legitimately fast players. Rickie is only one that really comes to mind. Tiger hates slow play, but then takes 3 minutes reading and lining up his putts. I've read that Jack was pretty slow, too.

One thing in Day's defense is that he might have been slower than usual in the match play as for gamesmanship. He's pretty slow normally, so that might not be part of the reason, but it's something to mention.

[No Mulligans]

Imagine a stroke penalty being the difference for the player between first and second place.  A more than $500,000 situational penalty.  That would be pretty extreme.

[Big Lex]

I think it's hard to do (some disagree  ) but a shot clock would be perfect. I think every player should get one or two "timeouts" as well, so that they can spend a bit more time occasionally in the round if they think they need it.

The problem with the current pace of play thing is that it's relative and one person can screw it up for an entire group. If every player has the same clock, then it's fair. They can learn to plan and execute a shot in a minute or whatever the appropriate standard is.