Firm Green Approach Shots

[boogielicious]

Firm as in not even leaving pitch marks. We had a fairly mild winter in MA/NH. I two of my courses, the greens are very firm. On my league course, I am having trouble adjusting. I'm hitting the green with clubs as low as my gap wedge, and the ball is bouncing and rolling out a lot more than usual, sometimes off the green. Others are having the same issue.

How do I change my approach? I tried hitting short but some of the green fringe areas are soft and I end up short siding. I'm bewildered because I've played these courses a lot and my usual strategy isn't working. 

[RH31]

Hard greens and soft fringes are an unusual combination. When the course gets really firm and fast, I try to carry my ball to the front edge of the fattest part of the green. I try to land my ball where it will have the best chance of rolling and still staying on the green or fringe. I'd always rather have a long putt than any chip or pitch. I'm a very good putter and an average chipper/pitcher. That said, sometimes you just aren't going to be able to hold the green with your approach shot. You have to ask yourself where is the best place for me to play my next shot from and make that play.

[boogielicious]

Just now, RH31 said:

Hard greens and soft fringes are an unusual combination. When the course gets really firm and fast, I try to carry my ball to the front edge of the fattest part of the green. I try to land my ball where it will have the best chance of rolling and still staying on the green or fringe. I'd always rather have a long putt than any chip or pitch. I'm a very good putter and an average chipper/pitcher. That said, sometimes you just aren't going to be able to hold the green with your approach shot. You have to ask yourself where is the best place for me to play my next shot from and make that play.

Thanks.

[Rainmaker]

I play at this one course that has really bad, small greens and one of them is completely domed and surrounded by thick, "lost-ball" brush to the right, left and rear.   So many times I hit that green and then rolled off the back - occasionally losing the ball.  Now, when I play it, though . .I'm looking to roll it up there.  Seriously . .4w along the ground from 60 yards, lol.  On that particular, horrible green . .it just works better.  If you do go over it often hangs up in the fringe.  If it's short, no big deal.   The point being - don't force yourself into a "Traditional" play if there is a more creative one that might work better. 

 

[SavvySwede]

Perhaps a higher spinning ball? Or are you already using a Tour type ball?

[Patch]

This is one of problems in golf that keeps me interested in the game. Stuff like this makes the golfer use their imagination to creat different shots. 

Out here, unless I am on one of the high end courses, most of the greens are pretty firm. I am always looking to hit higher shots onto those types of greens. 

If I am close enough, I will go with my flop shot. If I am farther away, I might take an extra club, open the face, and go for the higher than normal shot. I am looking for that drop, and stop landing. 

If I am too far away for a high shot, I might try choking down on my fairway wood, and hit a 1/2-3/4 swing punch shot that will roll up on the green with less forward momentum. 

Now I don't always pull off all these types of shots, but I do practice them evey so often, so that I am sort of ready if I need to use one. 

Of course there are also times that laying up is the smart way to go while looking for that one putt par. 

[boogielicious]

23 hours ago, SavvySwede said:

Perhaps a higher spinning ball? Or are you already using a Tour type ball?

I use the ProV1. On normal greens, I can get up to an 8 iron to bounce and stop. That is what's weird about this. The course started rolling the greens last year. I have trouble even finding pitch marks to fix. 

[SavvySwede]

2 hours ago, boogielicious said:

I use the ProV1. On normal greens, I can get up to an 8 iron to bounce and stop. That is what's weird about this. The course started rolling the greens last year. I have trouble even finding pitch marks to fix. 

Little to no pitch marks is pretty ideal so long as the greens are still holding adequate moisture. There is a special green firmness measuring device the USGA developed to monitor this sort of thing, perhaps your superintendent can get one on loan so they can fine tune how often they can roll/water without the greens becoming overly firm.

[natureboy]

On 5/14/2016 at 7:56 AM, boogielicious said:

Firm as in not even leaving pitch marks. We had a fairly mild winter in MA/NH. I two of my courses, the greens are very firm. On my league course, I am having trouble adjusting. I'm hitting the green with clubs as low as my gap wedge, and the ball is bouncing and rolling out a lot more than usual, sometimes off the green. Others are having the same issue.

Haven't played a round yet myself, but have noticed the practice green is very hard with spotty grass growth. I'm at a similar latitude as you. I don't think we got a lot of the normal 'April showers' and the less robust grass is not holding what moisture is available.

[DrvFrShow]

We had a hot April - actual August weather. The greens on the front side of my home course were running fast and firm after a week of hot weather, but I was still able to get my Callaway SR1s to stop on a dime. Fringes were soft, too. I didn't want to land on the fringe. Then most of the time I was playing from 125 and in so that's a 9 iron or less for me. Just to make sure I made it on the green I wasn't trying to hit max distance shots. I'd club up one and clip a partial wedge.

[Buckeyebowman]

On 5/14/2016 at 9:14 AM, SavvySwede said:

Perhaps a higher spinning ball? Or are you already using a Tour type ball?

You read my mind, Savvy! Get yourself a softer cover, higher spinning ball. One of the last times we were out, my buddy was hitting a ball that sounded off with a resounding "crack", flew great, and would just dance on the greens, which were quite firm! I finally asked him what ball he was hitting. They were Titleist Pro V-1's. Turns out he got a couple dozen for Christmas. BTW, it is understood in his household, that all Christmas and birthday gifts shall come from the golf store! He has it pretty nice!

[Jeremie Boop]

My league course is like this, it's nickname is "Springrock" because the greens get so hard you almost always have to aim to land just short of the green to have any hope of keeping the ball on. I've hit full swing, high spin lob wedge shots into them just to watch them bounce and roll out to the back. Pretty much nobody even bothers trying to land on the greens during the summer/fall. Right now it's possible to hit them and stay on given all the rain we've had, but even now wedge shots still roll out 6-10 feet. Pretty much you just have to aim short of the greens and let the ball release on.

[Buckeyebowman]

15 hours ago, boogielicious said:

I use the ProV1. On normal greens, I can get up to an 8 iron to bounce and stop. That is what's weird about this. The course started rolling the greens last year. I have trouble even finding pitch marks to fix. 

Tried to edit my reply, but was informed that I violated some rule about time or something! I don't like being constricted by time restraints when either typing or thinking!

My thoughts were that either the grooves on your irons were worn out, which I doubted, or that the problem lies with how the greens on the course you're playing were constructed. We had a course like that around here. It's now covered in houses, which is probably for the best. You could hit the highest, fastest spinning short iron approaches to these greens, they'd hit and make a big "BONK" sound, bounce 15-20 feet in the air and wind up off the back of the green! So we started playing a club or two less, to get the job done. I have no answer for "soft fringes" except the green construction idea.

[ZappyAd]

I've encountered this same thing on the course I play.  I played most of my rounds last year in fall/winter and so the greens were soft enough that any kind of approach from 6i up would stick near where it landed.  I had a month or so off around March and started playing again as the course has dried out and it is like a different game!  Anything that lands on the green is just rolling way past the pin.  I've had to adapt to hit it short and play for the roll - even if that means landing it on the fringe / fairway before the green.  Luckily the ground is all pretty consistently hard so you tend to get a good bounce around or in front of the green.

The other factor is that the fairways are rolling more too so in general I have a shorter iron for my approach on every shot.  But like you say the strategies played in winter for each hole are now blown out of the water as you end up in a different place on the fairway with the extra roll with a different approach into the harder green.  I was talking about this to a fellow member last week and we decided the changing conditions mean you effectively get two courses to play on through a year, the downside being that if conditions were the same year round you would probably be able to shoot better scores.

[saevel25]

On 5/14/2016 at 7:56 AM, boogielicious said:

How do I change my approach? I tried hitting short but some of the green fringe areas are soft and I end up short siding. I'm bewildered because I've played these courses a lot and my usual strategy isn't working. 

Hit it higher 

Though I don't struggled with firm greens. A luxury of having a golf swing that produces high ball flight and lots of spin. 

I would suspect it is similar to hitting higher pitches to land them softly. Maybe try to hit a slightly higher ball flight. 

On 5/14/2016 at 8:08 AM, RH31 said:

Hard greens and soft fringes are an unusual combination. When the course gets really firm and fast, 

You'd actually be surprised at how often you see a green where you land it just short and it takes a soft bounce. Greens are built differently than the rest of the course. They tend to drain better. A lot of greens drain to the front. 

 

[boogielicious]

1 hour ago, saevel25 said:

Hit it higher 

Though I don't struggled with firm greens. A luxury of having a golf swing that produces high ball flight and lots of spin. 

I would suspect it is similar to hitting higher pitches to land them softly. Maybe try to hit a slightly higher ball flight. 

You'd actually be surprised at how often you see a green where you land it just short and it takes a soft bounce. Greens are built differently than the rest of the course. They tend to drain better. A lot of greens drain to the front. 

 

How about grammar? 

I do hit it pretty high with my short irons and wedges. I guess I could play it a half ball further forward to get more height. I will try that next time. Thanks.

[iacas]

9 hours ago, Buckeyebowman said:

Tried to edit my reply, but was informed that I violated some rule about time or something! I don't like being constricted by time restraints when either typing or thinking!

Then don't hit submit. Once you do, you have between 9 and 36 minutes to edit your post, depending on your "level" here.

[Buckeyebowman]

14 hours ago, iacas said:

Then don't hit submit. Once you do, you have between 9 and 36 minutes to edit your post, depending on your "level" here.

I was well inside that time limit. After my initial reply was saved, I saw the OP's second post where he said he played Pro V-1's. Thus, my reply was of absolutely no help! So, when the edit didn't work, I just made another reply. I hope he manages to figure it out, because I have no clue.