Do You Putt from Off the Green With Flagstick In or Out?

[Hardspoon]

8 minutes ago, CCC said:

There is no absolute (yes/no) option to this question.

There is for me. I leave it in every time, since I see no reason to put myself at a disadvantage voluntarily.

If people are really employing a decision-making process to this (taking into account distance, break, etc), they are WAY overthinking it.

[iacas]

2 minutes ago, Hardspoon said:

If people are really employing a decision-making process to this (taking into account distance, break, etc), they are WAY overthinking it.

Yup.

[saevel25]

13 minutes ago, CCC said:

Rather, it should be a question of 'What percentage of time do you pull the flag stick when putting from off of the green'?

Maybe 1% at most. I might say that I get one pin out of 100 that doesn't sit right in the cup, that I think it would actually be a hinderance. Besides that, it stays in. 

 

[CCC]

47 minutes ago, iacas said:

Unless the flagstick is leaning so much that the ball won't fit, or it's loose and being blown around a lot, I always leave it in.

Is it against the rules of golf to adjust the flag stick properly, so that it stands upright into the cup - before you make your putt, from off of the green?

BTW - Caddies or anyone else who would leave the flag stick in a crooked fashion...??? They would belong in the golf category of those who do not fix their ball marks on the green.

iacas, you seem to make a big deal about the crooked flag stick. Is this a problem on the Pro Tour? The Pro Golfer protocol should always be about 'Protecting The Field'.

[saevel25]

51 minutes ago, CCC said:

Is it against the rules of golf to adjust the flag stick properly, so that it stands upright into the cup - before you make your putt, from off of the green?

No

Sometimes the flagstick will not have been put back properly.  

53 minutes ago, CCC said:

BTW - Caddies or anyone else who would leave the flag stick in a crooked fashion...??? They would belong in the golf category of those who do not fix their ball marks on the green.

Accidents happen man, deal. 

54 minutes ago, CCC said:

iacas, you seem to make a big deal about the crooked flag stick. Is this a problem on the Pro Tour? The Pro Golfer protocol should always be about 'Protecting The Field'.

It's not a big deal. It's just literally the only scenario where you might take the flagstick out. That is if the flagstick can't be put upright or the flagstick is leaning towards you. 

This situation is very very slim. I don't think I had one instance last year were the flagstick was leaning to the point I would have it taken it out. 

I would say the flagsticks don't lean on the PGA Tour. The holes are cut near perfectly and the equipment used on the tour is top notch. 

 

[p1n9183]

Let's say i hit 100 putts from outside the green 15 feet away from the flag. From that distance let say an amateur will make 10%. Let say he hit in line 20 putts but 5 felt short, 10 with good speed (the ones that sink )  and 5 6 feet past the hole. 

So from 100 putts only 5 hit the flag living as a tap in vs a 6 feet putt. 0.5 stroke gained X 5 balls = 2.5.

Thats 2.5 stroke gained over 100 shots. So an average of 0.025 each stroke. 

To me 0.03 it'isnt and advantage but i can't deny that there's a minimun advantage. 

Thats from 15 feet, closer to the hole the chance of hitting the flag it's bigger so the advantage it's a little higher but from beyond 15 feet it's smaller. 

 

[iacas]

3 hours ago, p1n9183 said:

Thats from 15 feet, closer to the hole the chance of hitting the flag it's bigger so the advantage it's a little higher but from beyond 15 feet it's smaller.

It's still an advantage. And good players plan to be around the flagstick or hole more often than not.

From 15' a decent to good player should be looking to make about 20%, which means they're going to be near the hole more often than that.

10 hours ago, CCC said:

Is it against the rules of golf to adjust the flag stick properly, so that it stands upright into the cup - before you make your putt, from off of the green?

No.

10 hours ago, CCC said:

BTW - Caddies or anyone else who would leave the flag stick in a crooked fashion...??? They would belong in the golf category of those who do not fix their ball marks on the green.

Sometimes the bottom of the cup or the bottom end of the flagstick is worn, and the flagstick won't stand straight up, but will lean at an angle.

10 hours ago, CCC said:

iacas, you seem to make a big deal about the crooked flag stick. Is this a problem on the Pro Tour? The Pro Golfer protocol should always be about 'Protecting The Field'.

I'm not making any deal out of it - I'm simply saying that's the one time I'd take the flagstick out, and even then - if the chip or putt was to a slick downhill part of the green, I might still be willing to keep it in because it would slow my ball down. Plus, if it's downhill, the flagstick is probably leaning away from me… which is actually slightly more helpful than not leaning at all.

[jsgolfer]

On 2/3/2017 at 8:11 AM, DaveP043 said:

I think most of us have much clearer memories of getting "screwed" by the flagstick being in, as compared to the times we get lucky by hitting a flagstick and ending up close.  It certainly happens occasionally that we DO get screwed, but those instances are pretty rare.  

I think Dave hit it on the sweet spot, we are far more likely to remember the one time it screwed us then many times it helped us.  

 

[Golfingdad]

20 hours ago, CCC said:

Well, I'm watching the WM Phoenix Open and I've seen four putts from off of the green.

Spieth and Rahm both putted from off of the green on the 3rd hole. Both of them pulled the flag stick before the stroke. Saw Spieth putt from off the green again, later on. Again, the flag stick was pulled. Saw a quick blip of a guy on 16 putt from off of the green. No flag stick and he sunk it for a birdie.

That's 4 for 4  - putts off of the green with the flag stick pulled. That's 100%!

Go figure.

Some pros plumb-bob too.

[iacas]

I just watched Spieth chip from just off the green (a "makeable" chip, plus it finished eight inches short and pretty much dead on-line) and leave the flagstick in.

They don't always get it "right" but they don't always get it "wrong" either.

[CCC]

Did Spieth chip or putt from off of the green?

And did he "plumb-bob" his line? :)

[iacas]

19 minutes ago, CCC said:

Did Spieth chip or putt from off of the green?

The ball rolled the last six feet plus to the hole. Lots of players smartly left the pin in.

[CCC]

You did say he "chipped" from off the green. This topic is about putting from off of the green.

Yes, if I was chipping from off of the green, I would leave the flag stick in, just like everyone does. Well, most of the time.

Unless, I really thought that I might have a chance to ......   :)

 

[iacas]

19 minutes ago, CCC said:

You did say he "chipped" from off the green. This topic is about putting from off of the green.

Yes, if I was chipping from off of the green, I would leave the flag stick in, just like everyone does. Well, most of the time.

Unless, I really thought that I might have a chance to ......   :)

The ball is rolling at the end of either.

[David in FL]

13 hours ago, CCC said:

You did say he "chipped" from off the green. This topic is about putting from off of the green.

Yes, if I was chipping from off of the green, I would leave the flag stick in, just like everyone does. Well, most of the time.

Unless, I really thought that I might have a chance to ......   :)

 

Why do you differentiate simply because of the club you used to make the shot?  In either case...

13 hours ago, iacas said:

The ball is rolling at the end of either.

...^^^ this ^^^

[iacas]

 

[CCC]

10 hours ago, David in FL said:

Why do you differentiate simply because of the club you used to make the shot?

Different strokes for different for different folks.

 

[iacas]

Just now, CCC said:

Different strokes for different for different folks.

That doesn't say anything here.

Both balls are rolling at the end.