Do Bad Boys Hurt The Sport?

[Lihu]

23 minutes ago, 1badbadger said:

I'm talking about the type of person who does things that are morally questionable and possibly illegal, who exhibits reckless or shocking behavior which might make headlines, and is disciplined by the governing body of their sport.  This is not a hard and fast definition BTW.

I would think that these types would likely have a difficulty following the ROG?

[Elmer]

27 minutes ago, Lihu said:

I would think that these types would likely have a difficulty following the ROG?

There are plenty of athletes who follow the rules of their game, but get caught with DWI's, drugs, cheating on spouses etc....
While I have always maintained the a  person who cheats on their wives, taxes and so forth will also cheat at golf; professionals treat their sport as a job.

I think all athletes try to get any advantage they can in the game.

But if were are going to make comparisons about sports "bad boys" they need to be 1:1 comparisons.
Sure Daly and Allenby have done some outragous things off the course, but none of them have ever been Kapernick, Manny Rameriz, Richard Sherman, Dennis Rodman, Ritche Incognito or Pac Man Jones!

[rehmwa]

"Bad Boys"  already busted up here, but I guess if a pro wanted to wear patterned pants, or cargo shorts or even a shirt without a collar, I doubt it would hurt the activity one bit.

Probably help it.

45 minutes ago, Lihu said:

I would think that these types would likely have a difficulty following the ROG?

Here's one that gets me.  "golf" is not some magical reflection of an individuals basic character or morality.  It's a game.  That's it.  The rules are just the arbitrary set of conduct one follows to play the game..  The worst criminal in the world would follow any activity's rules to the tee if he was excited about it, or very good at it.  As would someone exceptionally narcissistic about it.  Of course, so would very honest types for the more obvious reasons.

If don't think it's an either/or propostion - the fact that someone VERY honest in their regular life would 'likely' follow the rules because it's their nature, does NOT mean the converse is true to the same degree, probably not at all even.

 

edit:  Ok, so Elmer beat me to the comment...I'm slow

[Denny Bang Bang]

I've never noticed any "bad boys" on the tour, especially compared to other sports.  So I voted no.

However, I do think if there were ever any "bad boys" on tour, it could certainly impact the sport.  Think about some of the major sponsors of the tour... Big 4 cpa firms, big banks, big financial firms.  They are stuffy, and are not going to want to be associated with anything negative (not that any professional sport, or sponsor, wants to be either, but some are more accepting).

I would be surprised if Phil didn't take a bit of heat from KPMG, when the SEC noted him in an insider trading investigation.  Last thing a CPA firms wants to see about an athlete they sponsor (regardless if he was ignorant to any wrongdoing).

Edited February 14, 2017 by Denny Bang Bang

[sirsteveo55]

Everyone who said John Daily is not a so called "bad boy" is completely wrong. You need to do some more research about his life. Dont get me wrong I love John Daily. He inspires me to not make all the bad decisions he made. Hopefully everyone can learn from him. I know someone said at least he didnt murder someone, thats probably the only thing he has not done.

-Assaulting your wife

-June 2007, being beaten by your wife.

-Throwing 55,000 dollars out your car window

-Passing out drunk at hooters

-Gambling away 50-60 million

How many clubs has he broke and thrown during a tournament, he just threw his putter last week and WD.

John Daly, PGA champion in 1991, has been arrested and charged with third-degree assault. He allegedly threw his wife against a wall during an argument after he had been drinking early Sunday morning.

Daly, 26, was arrested Wednesday, Sgt. Kim Castellano of the Douglas County Sheriff's Dept. said Thursday. In accordance with the county's domestic violence policy, he was taken before a judge and posted $1,000 bond.

According to the arrest affidavit, Daly's wife, Bettye, told sheriff's officers that Daly "just lost it," while drinking at the couple's home.

The incident began when Bettye Daly, 40, asked a guest "if he could control his girlfriend as she was 'hitting on John,' " the affidavit says. Daly threw Bettye Daly up against a wall and was pulling her hair, then "lost his temper and destroyed the house," the document says.

Sheriff's officers found broken glass throughout the home, smashed pictures on the floor, windows broken, a big-screen television pushed over, broken liquor bottles on the floor, two large holes in the basement wall and blood splattered on a wall in the basement.

Daly then allegedly left.

While I slept at home last night, I was the victim of an assault by my wife," Daly said.

According to Daly, he was awakened by his wife attacking him with a steak knife and shouting, "I will kill you."

"While I slept at home last night, I was the victim of an assault by my wife," Daly said.

"My only concern at this point is for the safety of my children and myself, and we are working closely with local authorities and PGA Tour security officials to assure appropriate safeguards."

“I won like $55,000 in the casino and I said (to Sherrie), if you’re going to yell and scream at me about this, I threw it over the bridge going over to Memphis from Arkansas. I threw all the money out the (car) window and said, ‘You know what, if you want that money, you can go find it. But let me tell you something, you don’t have a job. You’re not working. I’m supporting you, I’m paying all the bills.’

At one of the low points of Daly’s alcoholism, he was found passed out drunk at a Hooters in Winston-Salem, N.C. Because he refused to go to the hospital and had no ride home, Daly was forced to spend a night in jail until he sobered up. 

John Daly says he has lost between $50 million and $60 million during 12 years of heavy gambling and that it has become a problem that could "flat-out ruin me" if he doesn’t bring it under control.

[Elmer]

11 hours ago, sirsteveo55 said:

Everyone who said John Daily is not a so called "bad boy" is completely wrong. You need to do some more research about his life. Dont get me wrong I love John Daily. He inspires me to not make all the bad decisions he made. Hopefully everyone can learn from him. I know someone said at least he didnt murder someone, thats probably the only thing he has not done.

-Assaulting your wife

-June 2007, being beaten by your wife.

-Throwing 55,000 dollars out your car window

-Passing out drunk at hooters

-Gambling away 50-60 million

How many clubs has he broke and thrown during a tournament, he just threw his putter last week and WD.

John Daly, PGA champion in 1991, has been arrested and charged with third-degree assault. He allegedly threw his wife against a wall during an argument after he had been drinking early Sunday morning.

Daly, 26, was arrested Wednesday, Sgt. Kim Castellano of the Douglas County Sheriff's Dept. said Thursday. In accordance with the county's domestic violence policy, he was taken before a judge and posted $1,000 bond.

According to the arrest affidavit, Daly's wife, Bettye, told sheriff's officers that Daly "just lost it," while drinking at the couple's home.

The incident began when Bettye Daly, 40, asked a guest "if he could control his girlfriend as she was 'hitting on John,' " the affidavit says. Daly threw Bettye Daly up against a wall and was pulling her hair, then "lost his temper and destroyed the house," the document says.

Sheriff's officers found broken glass throughout the home, smashed pictures on the floor, windows broken, a big-screen television pushed over, broken liquor bottles on the floor, two large holes in the basement wall and blood splattered on a wall in the basement.

Daly then allegedly left.

While I slept at home last night, I was the victim of an assault by my wife," Daly said.

According to Daly, he was awakened by his wife attacking him with a steak knife and shouting, "I will kill you."

"While I slept at home last night, I was the victim of an assault by my wife," Daly said.

"My only concern at this point is for the safety of my children and myself, and we are working closely with local authorities and PGA Tour security officials to assure appropriate safeguards."

“I won like $55,000 in the casino and I said (to Sherrie), if you’re going to yell and scream at me about this, I threw it over the bridge going over to Memphis from Arkansas. I threw all the money out the (car) window and said, ‘You know what, if you want that money, you can go find it. But let me tell you something, you don’t have a job. You’re not working. I’m supporting you, I’m paying all the bills.’

At one of the low points of Daly’s alcoholism, he was found passed out drunk at a Hooters in Winston-Salem, N.C. Because he refused to go to the hospital and had no ride home, Daly was forced to spend a night in jail until he sobered up. 

John Daly says he has lost between $50 million and $60 million during 12 years of heavy gambling and that it has become a problem that could "flat-out ruin me" if he doesn’t bring it under control.

Honestly, Who hasn't passed out at a hooters!

[Lihu]

5 minutes ago, Elmer said:

Honestly, Who hasn't passed out at a hooters!

I was the designated driver, every time.

[1badbadger]

7 hours ago, Elmer said:

Honestly, Who hasn't passed out at a hooters!

Well done Sir!  

[Kalnoky]

8 hours ago, Elmer said:

Honestly, Who hasn't passed out at a hooters!

Best wings ever, no contest. Slides right off the bone.

[Denny Bang Bang]

4 hours ago, Kalnoky said:

Best wings ever, no contest. Slides right off the bone.

Not even close... but that's just coming from a guy from Western NY (where the best wings ever, really come from).   :)

[Buckeyebowman]

On 2/13/2017 at 9:34 AM, Elmer said:

In fact I would argue that many more professional athletes engage in what Tiger did, it just doesn't go public.

I think a true "bad boy" in golf would be someone who behaves like tiger, openly, yet plays like Tiger in his prime!


But I have to agree with @iacas, most golfers are coming from a slightly entitled and economically advantaged background so you will not see alot of Pac-man jones/Johnny Manziel type behavior.
 

Yeah, but Tiger didn't do so openly, he tried like Hell to hide it! Why do you think his yacht was named "Privacy"!

"Hi! I'm Tiger Woods. I ran around on my gorgeous wife and 2 kids with about a dozen different women! Why? Because I'm rich and famous, and I felt 'entitled' to do so"!

Not to jump on Tiger too hard, but I heard some commentary from a guy who is a big golf fan, and has written several books about the subject, one of which contains the word "spoiled". He said that there's a whole lot of running around on Tour, and from some big names that we would all know. Both past and present!

Now, we don't have all the inside dope, so we have to allow for the possibility that some "arrangements" have been made. The wife is happy with the financial stability, the big house, and the platinum, emerald, molybdenum, or whatever card, and is willing to let some things slide. Maybe they have something going on the side as well.

I figure the percentages pretty much mirror the general population. OK, these guys play golf for a living. But, they're still people.

EDIT: And I'd remind you that Johnny Manziel came from money. He's just another spoiled brat!

Edited February 15, 2017 by Buckeyebowman

[sjduffers]

Recently, the Australian Steven Bowditch was arrested in AZ, following the WM Open, for an "extreme DUI" (meaning more than 0.2g/l, where the legal limit is 0.08g/l)... And you may recall the funny business of the Australian Allenby in Hawaii after the Sony Open a few years ago (being mugged while drinking and whatnot...).

What's up with the Aussies? 

It's not affecting the game I don't think but it looks bad just the same...

[CCC]

Do golf's "bad boys" hurt the sport?

Please provide a definition of "bad boys".

 

 

 

[CCC]

On 2/13/2017 at 6:01 AM, 1badbadger said:

 These are the guys who always seem to be surrounded by controversy, drama, and end up making headlines for things that don't have anything to do with their performance in the last game or match they played.

The "Bad guys"

[1badbadger]

On 2/13/2017 at 10:40 AM, 1badbadger said:

 I'd put John up against anyone from any other sport in terms of debauchery and extreme behavior.  

 

 

On 2/13/2017 at 0:31 PM, iacas said:

But… you'd literally be comparing him to guys who have been convicted of murder.

 

On 2/13/2017 at 2:05 PM, 1badbadger said:

Ok, let me make a distinction on this.  A professional athlete who commits murder isn't a bad boy...he's a murderer.  

I'm talking about the type of person who does things that are morally questionable and possibly illegal, who exhibits reckless or shocking behavior which might make headlines, and is disciplined by the governing body of their sport.  This is not a hard and fast definition BTW.

An example of what I do not consider bad boy behavior is the Robert Allenby train wreck in Hawaii.  Yeah, it kind of fits most of the criteria I mentioned, but it was more of a one-off situation, plus it was just stupid.

An example of what I do consider bad boy behavior...in the mid '90s during a particular Tour event, one of the sponsors threw a formal cocktail party at a swanky hotel one night during the week of the tournament. It was just below a "black-tie" event, so you don't have to wear a tux, but you need to dress nice, and it was held in one of the suites.  There were many Tour players and their wives or girlfriends in attendance, including John Daly and his "date".  There was an open bar which John was taking advantage of.  People were milling about and socializing when suddenly people notice John standing in the middle of the room, pants around his ankles, girlfriend's dress pulled up, banging her as if no one else is there.  That's what I consider bad boy behavior, and yes it's a true story.

 

14 hours ago, CCC said:

Do golf's "bad boys" hurt the sport?

Please provide a definition of "bad boys".

 

 

 

This is the loose definition of what I mean when I use the term "bad boy"...

[Elmer]

15 hours ago, Denny Bang Bang said:

Not even close... but that's just coming from a guy from Western NY (where the best wings ever, really come from).   :)

Western NY has excellent wing, no contest.
Just like the best Pizza is found in NYC!!!

14 hours ago, CCC said:

Do golf's "bad boys" hurt the sport?

Please provide a definition of "bad boys".

 

 

 

I would think someone whose off course behavior and to an extent on course behavior, while not illegal could be slightly morally objectionable!
Their behavior and actions may go against or push the boundary of what most in that clicke consider good behavior.

If Happy Gilmore was real and on tour, he would be the bad boy!

[WUTiger]

Golfers are human... humans are imperfect... need I say more?

That said, most golf "bad boy" incidents involve rudeness or insensitivity, not grand violence.

And many "bad boy" incidents end up being overblown attempts by bored sportswriters to generate something for a slow news day.

[mcanadiens]

1 hour ago, Elmer said:

If Happy Gilmore was real and on tour, he would be the bad boy!

Come on. Look at that friggin shirt. No other bad boy golfer comes even close.