What Would a 20.1 (see post #95) Index Shoot at a Local U.S. Open Qualifier Site?

[mcanadiens]

24 minutes ago, MacDutch said:

A true 20 capper uses ESC more then once. No ESC when playing strokeplay. If there is enough pressure and the rough is penalizing and there are a couple of holes where there is no safe way out, a score above 127 is easy made.

Don't most people only refer to ESC in the context of calculating the index? If someone asks me what I shot on a particular hole I don't tell them the ESC number.

[kpaulhus]

21 minutes ago, mcanadiens said:

Don't most people only refer to ESC in the context of calculating the index? If someone asks me what I shot on a particular hole I don't tell them the ESC number.

Yes, but he picks up when he hits a double bogey or 7. I dont know why, because he is only cheating himself. He might be a 23 index, who knows. I have seen him shoot 93 before on a super easy course with no bunkers.

[bmartin461]

12 minutes ago, kpaulhus said:

Yes, but he picks up when he hits a double bogey or 7. I dont know why, because he is only cheating himself. He might be a 23 index, who knows. I have seen him shoot 93 before on a super easy course with no bunkers.

I don't think he will break 127.  Can you pair him up with 3 other strangers, preferably better players?   Also, would be good to get an announcer on the first team to call out names, exchange scorecards etc. 

I remember my first tourney, the nerves do a lot to alter your ability.

[oregongolfguy]

I guess here is what i would say.  If a person played to not score 127.  As in you didn't care what your score was as long as it was less then 127 and largely bunted around the course then yep they would be under.  But if tried to play it more normally, then it would be at risk.  

[Golfingdad]

49 minutes ago, mcanadiens said:

Don't most people only refer to ESC in the context of calculating the index? If someone asks me what I shot on a particular hole I don't tell them the ESC number.

A lot of people, myself included, will consider ESC while playing a casual round.  If my chance at meeting or beating ESC is entirely gone, then there really isn't any point in continuing the hole - especially considering I've probably just dunked two in the water or pumped two OB.  It's just being economical.

---

Also of note, when considering the difficulty of the US Open qualifier courses ... there is a large range of difficulty between them.  Consider that there are 113 sites, and just through the first 83 sites, the score required to qualify ranges from 69 to 76. http://www.golfdigest.com/story/2017-us-open-local-and-sectional-qualifying-results

16 minutes ago, oregongolfguy said:

I guess here is what i would say.  If a person played to not score 127.  As in you didn't care what your score was as long as it was less then 127 and largely bunted around the course then yep they would be under.  But if tried to play it more normally, then it would be at risk.  

Yep, agree completely.  I thought the same thing yesterday.  It would (should) not be hard for him to beat 127 if he actively plays TO BEAT 127, however, if he plays like a normal 20 capper and just grabs driver, or whatever, mindlessly on each hole, then all bets are off.

[kpaulhus]

I also just pick up if I hit 2 OB during a casual round. Its a double bogey towards my handicap either way. 

After talking to @Golfingdad last night I am feeling that I am going to get screwed on this bet. He will be playing in a group with myself and two other decent players playing the same tees. He actually attested my 67 and witnessed my albatross last summer. We had a 14 stroke match play game going in which we tied, while I beat him by 32 strokes. 

[David in FL]

3 minutes ago, kpaulhus said:

I also just pick up if I hit 2 OB during a casual round. Its a double bogey towards my handicap either way. 

After talking to @Golfingdad last night I am feeling that I am going to get screwed on this bet. He will be playing in a group with myself and two other decent players playing the same tees. He actually attested my 67 and witnessed my albatross last summer. We had a 14 stroke match play game going in which we tied, while I beat him by 32 strokes. 

Obviously we're looking forward to hearing about the results.

It would be great if you'd VLog his round too!

[kpaulhus]

7 minutes ago, David in FL said:

Obviously we're looking forward to hearing about the results.

It would be great if you'd VLog his round too!

I dont think Youtube will allow a video that long haha

[Killa]

9 hours ago, Shorty said:

A bit more margin for error in volleyball. Golf is an individual game where the slightest error is magnified and very obvious. Your argument is like the one where people say they hit the ball a long way "because I used to play baseball."

That's not true, you get into pressure situations quite often. And once you've done enough of them you can either handle them or you can't. It doesn't matter what sport.

[Golfingdad]

36 minutes ago, kpaulhus said:

I also just pick up if I hit 2 OB during a casual round. Its a double bogey towards my handicap either way. 

After talking to @Golfingdad last night I am feeling that I am going to get screwed on this bet. He will be playing in a group with myself and two other decent players playing the same tees. He actually attested my 67 and witnessed my albatross last summer. We had a 14 stroke match play game going in which we tied, while I beat him by 32 strokes. 

Try to steer him towards actually playing "normally" instead of just trying to beat 127.  If he's playing in an actual qualifier, he's trying to qualify, not just beat the worst score ever. ;)

And if he does play that way, give him crap about it! Lol.

[GolfLug]

As some have pointed out I think the telling factor is the inability to pick up after ESC. Not only triple bogey is in play on every hole, I actually think there will be easily at least 5 holes with a double digit score. I would bet $25 that there would be he will have at least one hole with a 13. It is a certainty if he is a poor putter.

Gaming you to just beat 127 (e.g. start taking too many unplayables compared to his normal MO would be a red flag, but assuming this an honorable fella) still won't work IMO. Of course he can always have a career round and shoot 125.. :-))

Edited May 17, 2017 by GolfLug

[MacDutch]

No gimmies, play 100% by the rules. Rules mistake makes him dq or get 2 penalty strokes.

Is he playing marked balls, is he anouncing his provisional. Is he able to identify his ball properly? This is serious golf, no mercy.

Edited May 17, 2017 by MacDutch

[Tat14]

21 hours ago, No Mulligans said:

Torrey South is the course I'm familiar with.  Last I played there I hit a 93 from the Green tees 73.3/133, that equaled a differential of 16.9.  The back tees are 78.1/144 so the extra distance would add 5 strokes for the rating 6 strokes for the slope.  So now I'm at 93 + 5 + 6 = 104 due to the extra length and slope.

 

Chose the gold tees the last time I played there. A wise decision...

Many years prior to that date, I would play either South or North with this group from the bar I worked at. Had to play from the blues (ego). I would rather get kicked in the chest than ever do that again.

[kpaulhus]

1 hour ago, MacDutch said:

No gimmies, play 100% by the rules. Rules mistake makes him dq or get 2 penalty strokes.

Is he playing marked balls, is he anouncing his provisional. Is he able to identify his ball properly? This is serious golf, no mercy.

The mob of a gallery following him will make sure of it. 

[bmartin461]

54 minutes ago, kpaulhus said:

The mob of a gallery following him will make sure of it. 

Are you all going to yell "Get in the hole" and "Bababooey" after every shot?  LOL

[Shorty]

6 hours ago, Killa said:

That's not true, you get into pressure situations quite often. And once you've done enough of them you can either handle them or you can't. It doesn't matter what sport.

LOL - The chokes of golfers at the highest level - think of Speith at the Masters in 2016 and Norman a dozen times, Garcia several times, Watson at The Open not so many years back are exactly like the pressures volleyball players are under when it is played "at a high level". What happens when nerves take over at volleyball? Do nervous cyclists fall off their bikes at The Tour? Golf exposes how pressure is handled like no other sport.

Edited May 17, 2017 by Shorty

[Golfingdad]

6 minutes ago, Shorty said:

LOL - The chokes of golfers at the highest level - think of Speith at the Masters in 2016 and Norman a dozen times, Garcia several times, Watson at The Open not so many years back are exactly like the pressures volleyball players are under when it is played "at a high level". What happens when nerves take over at volleyball? Do nervous cyclists fall off their bikes at The Tour? Golf exposes how pressure is handled like no other sport.

Agreed.  Other sports are too fast-moving and instinct takes over; it's mostly just reacting.  You don't have time to contemplate what it would mean if you miss the ball that is screaming over the net at you.  In golf, you have (several) quiet MINUTES between every single shot.

[Aguirre]

Golf is a unique sport for choking. You just have too much time to think. I'm sure I'll miss some, but the others that come to mind:

1) Tennis (serving)

2) Field goal kickers at the end of games to tie or win

3) Free throws

4) Penalty kicks in soccer

That's about it. Everything else is in the flow of the game, and I don't think they compare. I think too much is made of choking at the highest level (thanks, Johnny Miller), but not when you stick a 20 handicap into a USGA event. Even if it's just a qualifier.

EDIT--And in the examples above, they do not encompass the entirety of play. In golf, it's EVERY shot.

Edited May 18, 2017 by Aguirre