A <different> pace of play situation!

[jkelley9]

So I had an unusual pace of play situation this past Sunday. I'm curious as to how some of you may have handled this.

I played 9 holes, walking. This happened on #8.

Background:

I had been keeping up with the group in front of me all round. I played a couple extra balls at times because I had the time. I play pretty fast by myself walking but they were at a ~2 hour pace (4-some) so I didn't want to interfere. No big deal there.

One hole #6 I had a single in a cart I saw behind me waiting on the tee box for only but maybe 1 minute as I was in the fairway waiting for the 4-some on the green to clear. They go, I hit in and hit the green. It's a severe dogleg right with a massive hill so I gave the guy a thumbs up that he could go ahead and hit because my ball hit the green. With a poor shot you can really be in someone's range if you're crazy and try to "drive the green" which is realistically more like just a short chip shot to the green, I don't think there's a realistic line to the green - and it's RIDDLED with hazard if you try. SO I gave him the thumbs up and he waits for me to clear, and hits. Good.

The walk from #6 to #7 is the longest on the front 9. I walked briskly and made it to the tee box. Hit my shot, on the green. 3-putted  but the guy still wasn't on the tee box so I'm like... hmm. Ok, guess I'll just move on no big deal. Go to #8 where I crush my drive but then I'm really waiting on this 4-some in front. I'm like.... "double-u-tee-eff." The guy behind me goes from playing #7 to being on the tee box waiting for me for about another 2 minutes. A long time I guess. This hole is also a severe steep downhill to the green so I give him a thumbs up that it's okay to hit trying to signal that my approach is ~4 yards off the edge of the green. So he hits in. No problems still.

The situation:

What happens next is what's funky. I'm 4 yards off the green about to chip up. This ball comes flying up from BEHIND the green and lands on MY green.... and literally lands exactly where I was planning on my ball to land and roll out. So naturally I'm like "umm.... what do I do?" So I'm standing there... waiting to figure out who's freaking ball this is. So I wait... and wait. About 2 minutes go by and I'm about to just move this ball. The guy behind me is now at the top of the hill at about 100 yards with a "what the crap man???" face on. I point to the ball literally directly in my line and I'm like "I don't know what to do." But I know he can't hear me. Maybe he can't even see the ball, I dunno. But then I see this group on #4 (adjacent green, blocked by a hill though. Note that my green is at LEAST 40 yards from theirs'. So I'm like "maybe it's one of theirs." I wait another minute. Nobody in their group is walking up to my green though, they've all grabbed their putters and are walking onto their green. FINALLY, about 30 seconds after THAT... one guy walks up and non-nonchalantly and I'm like "your ball is on the green in my line" so then he runs up and just grabs it and leaves. I chip up and one putt - success.

When I get up to the next tee box I'm free to tee off obviously, so I do. Crushed the drive on the par 5 over a tough hill to reach and then it rolls out 40+ yards (great success!). But It's out of the tee box's line of sight. So I stand at the top of the hill with my 3h in hand because I only have 190 to the back pin to be on in 2. The group in front is on the green. The guy behind me quickly catches up and is on the tee box. I swear to goodness, the group on the green took a solid 4 minutes to putt out AND THEN went back to their carts and added up all their scores and started f***ing chatting for a solid 2-3 minutes. I've waited a good 5-7 minutes on one shot. I yelled up at them "WAITING ON YOU!" as I'm saying that I hear a ball land about 20 yards to my right and behind me..... The guy felt it was okay to hit into me I guess. So the group on the green leaves and I just wait. Guy behind gets to his ball and and tell him "If you're in that much of a hurry, so go ahead and play through." He says "Sorry but the guys behind me are pressing." I didn't say anything, just hit my shot to about 5 yards from the edge of the green and just started walking.

Obviously he shouldn't have hit into me. But what the heck? He knows I'm waiting on them. He could have yelled or gestured (preferably) at me or something if he really wanted to play through - I looked back at him frequently and obviously.

I'm even more curious how you guys would have handled the "mysterious ball on the green and in my line" situation lol. 

[Golfingdad]

Just move the ball, hit your shot, and move it back.  I don't understand why you'd be confused by that?

If you're playing a par 3 where you're asked to wave the groups behind you up, if one of them hits a good shot, you don't wait until they arrive, do you?  Just mark it, and play on, then put it back.

Same thing if one of your partners hits a bunker shot into your line.  Just mark it for him and play, don't wait for him to finish raking.

And I'm not entirely sure about the second part ... you said he hit "30 yards to the right and behind you" which isn't the same as INTO you.  (And he also apologized when he got up to you)  Isn't it possible that he simply knew his range and that you were outside of it?

[jkelley9]

4 minutes ago, Golfingdad said:

Just move the ball, hit your shot, and move it back.  I don't understand why you'd be confused by that?

If you're playing a par 3 where you're asked to wave the groups behind you up, if one of them hits a good shot, you don't wait until they arrive, do you?  Just mark it, and play on, then put it back.

Same thing if one of your partners hits a bunker shot into your line.  Just mark it for him and play, don't wait for him to finish raking.

And I'm not entirely sure about the second part ... you said he hit "30 yards to the right and behind you" which isn't the same as INTO you.  (And he also apologized when he got up to you)  Isn't it possible that he simply knew his range and that you were outside of it?

I guess I've learned something then, because I thought that was a faux pas to move someone else's ball without their permission. 

Regarding your par 3 example, that's never happened to me, actually. Maybe I haven't been playing long enough to have that experience.

Good to know though!

Edit: I missed your "range" comment at first. He had already waited like 4-5 minutes. So I had to have been within his range. Otherwise, he would have just hit.

Edited May 24, 2017 by jkelley9

[drmevo]

Well, if there's one thing I know for sure, anyone who hits their ball on the wrong green had damn well better have their tail between their legs if there was no fore yelled. Plus, he can't play the ball from the surface of the green, so even if you didn't mark his ball and just note the general spot before moving it, that should be good enough since he'll have to drop anyways. I'd say you were a lot more polite than you needed to be!

[Golfingdad]

46 minutes ago, jkelley9 said:

I guess I've learned something then, because I thought that was a faux pas to move someone else's ball without their permission. 

Well, I wouldn't go around moving just any ball, but with the right circumstances, it can be warranted.  And, as @drmevo pointed out, since you knew it didn't come from your hole, then it wasn't going to be playable from that spot anyway.  No need to even mark, just kick it aside, hit your chip and then put it roughly back where it was.

49 minutes ago, jkelley9 said:

Regarding your par 3 example, that's never happened to me, actually. Maybe I haven't been playing long enough to have that experience.

Actually, neither have I, but I know that if it ever does happen, that's how I'd handle it. 

[jamo]

1 hour ago, jkelley9 said:

I guess I've learned something then, because I thought that was a faux pas to move someone else's ball without their permission. 

They're going to have to move the ball off the green to play their next shot anyway, so it shouldn't be a huge deal to just toss it to the side. If they're still not there by the time you're done, I'd just replace it. 

I'm also a little confused why you couldn't hit into the green on the next hole. If they're off to the side of the green in their carts, you can probably hit. I guess it depends exactly how far away from the green they are.

[bkuehn1952]

Or wave the trailing single up on #6 and play in as a twosome?  I play as a single at times and that is fine.  However, when things start to get a bit compressed, one needs to consider grouping singles and twos together.

[roamin]

1 hour ago, jamo said:

I'm also a little confused why you couldn't hit into the green on the next hole. If they're off to the side of the green in their carts, you can probably hit. I guess it depends exactly how far away from the green they are

No, not exactly...just a general or rough definition of "in the vicinity" will do. Not all of us are 1.5ers. 

[jkelley9]

3 hours ago, drmevo said:

Well, if there's one thing I know for sure, anyone who hits their ball on the wrong green had damn well better have their tail between their legs if there was no fore yelled. Plus, he can't play the ball from the surface of the green, so even if you didn't mark his ball and just note the general spot before moving it, that should be good enough since he'll have to drop anyways. I'd say you were a lot more polite than you needed to be!

I didn't realize this was a rule. But it makes sense.

1 hour ago, jamo said:

They're going to have to move the ball off the green to play their next shot anyway, so it shouldn't be a huge deal to just toss it to the side. If they're still not there by the time you're done, I'd just replace it. 

I'm also a little confused why you couldn't hit into the green on the next hole. If they're off to the side of the green in their carts, you can probably hit. I guess it depends exactly how far away from the green they are.

They parked their carts on the shorter side of the green. So they were at ~160 yards or so. No way I would hit with them there. And the path even dipped in towards the fairway at the location they parked them.

1 hour ago, bkuehn1952 said:

Or wave the trailing single up on #6 and play in as a twosome?  I play as a single at times and that is fine.  However, when things start to get a bit compressed, one needs to consider grouping singles and twos together.

I would normally do this but since I was wanting to play a few balls and was easily keeping up, I didn't really feel like dealing with it today knowing I only had 3 holes to go. Also, this was later in the evening. There was nobody behind him when I saw him on #5 green for at least 2 full holes.

15 minutes ago, roamin said:

No, not exactly...just a general or rough definition of "in the vicinity" will do. Not all of us are 1.5ers. 

Yea, I don't mess with being even remotely close. I've carried a drive ~290 yards at least a couple of times so I know I wouldn't ever hit with a number under that.

[onthehunt526]

3 hours ago, jkelley9 said:

So I had an unusual pace of play situation this past Sunday. I'm curious as to how some of you may have handled this.

I played 9 holes, walking. This happened on #8.

Background:

I had been keeping up with the group in front of me all round. I played a couple extra balls at times because I had the time. I play pretty fast by myself walking but they were at a ~2 hour pace (4-some) so I didn't want to interfere. No big deal there.

One hole #6 I had a single in a cart I saw behind me waiting on the tee box for only but maybe 1 minute as I was in the fairway waiting for the 4-some on the green to clear. They go, I hit in and hit the green. It's a severe dogleg right with a massive hill so I gave the guy a thumbs up that he could go ahead and hit because my ball hit the green. With a poor shot you can really be in someone's range if you're crazy and try to "drive the green" which is realistically more like just a short chip shot to the green, I don't think there's a realistic line to the green - and it's RIDDLED with hazard if you try. SO I gave him the thumbs up and he waits for me to clear, and hits. Good.

The walk from #6 to #7 is the longest on the front 9. I walked briskly and made it to the tee box. Hit my shot, on the green. 3-putted  but the guy still wasn't on the tee box so I'm like... hmm. Ok, guess I'll just move on no big deal. Go to #8 where I crush my drive but then I'm really waiting on this 4-some in front. I'm like.... "double-u-tee-eff." The guy behind me goes from playing #7 to being on the tee box waiting for me for about another 2 minutes. A long time I guess. This hole is also a severe steep downhill to the green so I give him a thumbs up that it's okay to hit trying to signal that my approach is ~4 yards off the edge of the green. So he hits in. No problems still.

The situation:

What happens next is what's funky. I'm 4 yards off the green about to chip up. This ball comes flying up from BEHIND the green and lands on MY green.... and literally lands exactly where I was planning on my ball to land and roll out. So naturally I'm like "umm.... what do I do?" So I'm standing there... waiting to figure out who's freaking ball this is. So I wait... and wait. About 2 minutes go by and I'm about to just move this ball. The guy behind me is now at the top of the hill at about 100 yards with a "what the crap man???" face on. I point to the ball literally directly in my line and I'm like "I don't know what to do." But I know he can't hear me. Maybe he can't even see the ball, I dunno. But then I see this group on #4 (adjacent green, blocked by a hill though. Note that my green is at LEAST 40 yards from theirs'. So I'm like "maybe it's one of theirs." I wait another minute. Nobody in their group is walking up to my green though, they've all grabbed their putters and are walking onto their green. FINALLY, about 30 seconds after THAT... one guy walks up and non-nonchalantly and I'm like "your ball is on the green in my line" so then he runs up and just grabs it and leaves. I chip up and one putt - success.

When I get up to the next tee box I'm free to tee off obviously, so I do. Crushed the drive on the par 5 over a tough hill to reach and then it rolls out 40+ yards (great success!). But It's out of the tee box's line of sight. So I stand at the top of the hill with my 3h in hand because I only have 190 to the back pin to be on in 2. The group in front is on the green. The guy behind me quickly catches up and is on the tee box. I swear to goodness, the group on the green took a solid 4 minutes to putt out AND THEN went back to their carts and added up all their scores and started f***ing chatting for a solid 2-3 minutes. I've waited a good 5-7 minutes on one shot. I yelled up at them "WAITING ON YOU!" as I'm saying that I hear a ball land about 20 yards to my right and behind me..... The guy felt it was okay to hit into me I guess. So the group on the green leaves and I just wait. Guy behind gets to his ball and and tell him "If you're in that much of a hurry, so go ahead and play through." He says "Sorry but the guys behind me are pressing." I didn't say anything, just hit my shot to about 5 yards from the edge of the green and just started walking.

Obviously he shouldn't have hit into me. But what the heck? He knows I'm waiting on them. He could have yelled or gestured (preferably) at me or something if he really wanted to play through - I looked back at him frequently and obviously.

I'm even more curious how you guys would have handled the "mysterious ball on the green and in my line" situation lol. 

IMHO, maybe he knew he couldn't reach you, it's odd, that foursome should have gotten away from the green faster, and you would not have this problem. As for the rogue ball on the 8th green, I honestly would have marked it and put it aside, and replaced it after you played your shot. They would have had to drop it off of the green anyway.

[Fourputt]

13 hours ago, bkuehn1952 said:

Or wave the trailing single up on #6 and play in as a twosome?  I play as a single at times and that is fine.  However, when things start to get a bit compressed, one needs to consider grouping singles and twos together.

+1 on  this^^.   It's stupid to keep dealing with those issues when you could just wave him up and play the rest of the way as a twosome.  The 2 of you would still probably be waiting on the guys ahead of you, but at least you wouldn't be trying to communicate your situation by sign language, and the group behind him would be able to see what the two of you were dealing with. 

I wouldn't think twice about it before doing that.  I've made such impromptu pairings many, many times over the years.  It's a good way to find new golfing friends, and even if it doesn't reach that point, at least you have a less stressful finish to your round.

[Moppy]

A single with a cart, unless the course is on the empty side, is always going to be disruptive. The guy should be prepared to wait, chip balls, practice putting, or whatever. I Always let them play through, even if there is not an empty hole in front of me, because, frankly, who needs it, and it probably won't slow me down anyway by more than a minute or two. Another single walking or even a twosome? I will join up.  It's more fun. 

[Jeremie Boop]

15 hours ago, jkelley9 said:

I didn't realize this was a rule. But it makes sense.

They parked their carts on the shorter side of the green. So they were at ~160 yards or so. No way I would hit with them there. And the path even dipped in towards the fairway at the location they parked them.

I would normally do this but since I was wanting to play a few balls and was easily keeping up, I didn't really feel like dealing with it today knowing I only had 3 holes to go. Also, this was later in the evening. There was nobody behind him when I saw him on #5 green for at least 2 full holes.

Yea, I don't mess with being even remotely close. I've carried a drive ~290 yards at least a couple of times so I know I wouldn't ever hit with a number under that.

As soon as you noticed that there was someone behind you waiting consistently you should have realized that you weren't going to be able to play extra shots and just let the guy join you. I've been in your same situation a few times, taking the extra time I had playing extra chips/putts and tee shots, but as soon as someone was behind me and had to wait I offered to either let them through or join me. As situations change, so too should be your mindset. Also, it's possible he was waiting for you to move because he was planning on hitting driver, but once he realized he was being pushed he may have switched to a 3 wood or 5 wood to play a safe distance behind you. 

[krupa]

18 hours ago, bkuehn1952 said:

Or wave the trailing single up on #6 and play in as a twosome?  I play as a single at times and that is fine.  However, when things start to get a bit compressed, one needs to consider grouping singles and twos together.

I always wave a single up to join me and I hate it when a single is in front of me, waiting on a group, and doesn't wave me up.  A twosome will still wait on a foursome but not as much and you might make a new friend.

[jkelley9]

I usually do wave people in or through, especially a single in a cart. 

I also wasn't hitting extra balls per se. What I was doing was waiting for the group in front while I was on the tee box and I would hit a few 7 iron shots to a nice landing zone for easy pick up. When they cleared I'd play my tee shot with driver, 3w, whatever, then just pick up my iron shots on the way too my ball, which I had plenty of time to do.

I guess I just wasn't feeling social that day.