Jump to content
IGNORED

The Importance of a Trouble Shot


iacas
Note: This thread is 2339 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Recommended Posts

32 minutes ago, David in FL said:

Great shot, and a great point as well.  

I probably would've hit a little skanker through the same gap, but with a 5 or 6 iron, without attempting the draw.  Attempting to draw through that small window would increase the likelihood that I'd pull the shot and catch a tree.  The reward just isn't worth the risk of a really big number for me, at my skill level.  I like my chances of saving par from 40 yards short of the green though. 

I thought about this a bit more and because the opening is angled closer to the green, decided a straight punch would leave me with a pretty close wedge shot. 

When I try these shots it's usually from further out (>150 yds) and around a single obstacle, rarely through a gap that tight. It's usually an attempt to leave a much shorter approach shot, not roll it onto the green.

Jon

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

8 minutes ago, JonMA1 said:

I thought about this a bit more and because the opening is angled closer to the green, decided a straight punch would leave me with a pretty close wedge shot. 

When I try these shots it's usually from further out (>150 yds) and around a single obstacle, rarely through a gap that tight. It's usually an attempt to leave a much shorter approach shot, not roll it onto the green.

This is what I answered originally as well, but for some reason my original post was deleted. Straight out to red is the best path. It looks just as risky to take the side shot anyway. I should know, I've been getting into this kind of crap a lot lately. I really hope that changes this weekend with straighter drives. . .

:ping:  :tmade:  :callaway:   :gamegolf:  :titleist:

TM White Smoke Big Fontana; Pro-V1
TM Rac 60 TT WS, MD2 56
Ping i20 irons U-4, CFS300
Callaway XR16 9 degree Fujikura Speeder 565 S
Callaway XR16 3W 15 degree Fujikura Speeder 565 S, X2Hot Pro 20 degrees S

"I'm hitting the woods just great, but I'm having a terrible time getting out of them." ~Harry Toscano

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

The window looks big enough that I probably would have tried to slap a low 3I through it. 

That said, I'd also get ready to hit the deck because it looks like the sort of place a hacker like me might get a come-backer.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

20 minutes ago, mcanadiens said:

The window looks big enough that I probably would have tried to slap a low 3I through it. 

That said, I'd also get ready to hit the deck because it looks like the sort of place a hacker like me might get a come-backer.

Pretty much. :-D

 

  • Like 1

:ping:  :tmade:  :callaway:   :gamegolf:  :titleist:

TM White Smoke Big Fontana; Pro-V1
TM Rac 60 TT WS, MD2 56
Ping i20 irons U-4, CFS300
Callaway XR16 9 degree Fujikura Speeder 565 S
Callaway XR16 3W 15 degree Fujikura Speeder 565 S, X2Hot Pro 20 degrees S

"I'm hitting the woods just great, but I'm having a terrible time getting out of them." ~Harry Toscano

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

1 hour ago, RussUK said:

As a high handicapper i know when to take my medicine and play the safe shot. For me its just a case of get it back on the fairway and hopfully end up with a bogey at worst.

I play with some high handicap golfers and its amazing how many times they go for the high tariff shot and end up with a triple. At the end of the day you need to know what you can pull off at your skill level. If you can low hook through the trees then go for it if you cant then dont.

I always say to myself "If in doubt, easy way out"

Yup this is me.  Punch it out with a 6 Iron to about 50 yards short of the pin, a distance I practice, and wedge it up and hope for a one putt par but for sure take a double off the table.

Butch

Link to comment
Share on other sites


3 hours ago, DaveP043 said:

I think my choice would have been a low running shot through the larger (red line) gap.  I'm not sure, but I probably would have used a less lofted club, something like a 5 or 7-iron, to be sure I was under all the limbs.  I know that when I play the ball back in my stance, it tends to hook a bit more, so that would fit.  The goal would be between the two traps right in front, perfect would be like yours, on the green, and poor would probably be too firm and straight, ending up in the bunker, which makes bogey still probable.  

+1. That's what I would have done, and have many times. Right or wrong, more often than not I use a very low lofted iron and the "low screamer" through the opening that advances the ball most AND I believe I can hit to get away from lots of trees in the rough. In the OP's example, I would have just punched straight thru the red line opening, I don't have the skills to expect a reliable draw. Sometimes I can reach a green, usually not. I always move the ball forward as much as possible leaving some decent next shot, and only "chip out" when I am essentially forced to. I wish I had the skills to pull off the shot the OP did - I never have and probably never will.

Edited by Midpack
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Like above low runner and get it on the ground so that if it doesn't draw it stops before OB and bad news happens.  Prob 7 iron or so, back of stance and try to draw it up near front of green and try for up and down.  more like a chipping motion for me.  If I try to "hood" things I end up hitting it about as pure as I can and straight where the trouble is.. lol

Link to comment
Share on other sites


  • Administrator
2 hours ago, DeadMan said:

But in thinking about it more, I think I have roughly an equal chance of saving par from short of the bunker in the fairway and from the bunker.

Your odds are almost surely better from the fairway than in the bunker.

2 hours ago, RussUK said:

As a high handicapper i know when to take my medicine and play the safe shot. For me its just a case of get it back on the fairway and hopfully end up with a bogey at worst.

No, that's what the topic is about: even higher handicappers should punch a ball through the gap, with enough to get past the trees and ideally stay short of the bunker. Think of it as a 25-yard chip shot through a fairly (at that distance) large window.

2 hours ago, RussUK said:

I play with some high handicap golfers and its amazing how many times they go for the high tariff shot and end up with a triple.

This isn't one of those. The window is relatively large at only 15-20 yards.

2 hours ago, RussUK said:

If you can low hook through the trees then go for it if you cant then dont.

I always say to myself "If in doubt, easy way out"

You're costing yourself strokes. Every shot has a ton of options. Not just "super risky" or "ultra safe."

2 hours ago, Lihu said:

This is what I answered originally as well, but for some reason my original post was deleted. Straight out to red is the best path. It looks just as risky to take the side shot anyway. I should know, I've been getting into this kind of crap a lot lately. I really hope that changes this weekend with straighter drives. . .

Your first post made very little sense @Lihu and was going to potentially derail the topic right off the bat. You'll have to trust me on that.

2 hours ago, mcanadiens said:

The window looks big enough that I probably would have tried to slap a low 3I through it. 

A 3I would probably hit the hill/slope about halfway up.

Is everyone not seeing that it's a hill there?

  • Informative 1

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 & "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 :edel: :true_linkswear:

Check Out: New Topics | TST Blog | Golf Terms | Instructional Content | Analyzr | LSW | Instructional Droplets

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

16 minutes ago, iacas said:

Your odds are almost surely better from the fairway than in the bunker.

I think it's pretty close. It's hard to tell 100% from what you posted. To stay short of the bunker, it looks like you leave yourself with about a 30-50 yard pitch shot. If you're in the bunker, you probably have between a 10-20 yard bunker shot. For me, that's about equal odds of getting up and down. I.e., pretty rarely. I'm bad from bunkers but I'm also bad with a 50 yard pitch. That's also not including the possibility that I get it onto the green from the trees with the shot that brings the bunker into play.

My answer changes, though, if I can be 30 yards or closer with the pitch or if I could end up with a 20+ yard bunker shot.

-- Daniel

In my bag: :callaway: Paradym :callaway: Epic Flash 3.5W (16 degrees)

:callaway: Rogue Pro 3-PW :edel: SMS Wedges - V-Grind (48, 54, 58):edel: Putter

 :aimpoint:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

  • Administrator
1 minute ago, DeadMan said:

I think it's pretty close. It's hard to tell 100% from what you posted. To stay short of the bunker, it looks like you leave yourself with about a 30-50 yard pitch shot. If you're in the bunker, you probably have between a 10-20 yard bunker shot.

You don't have an equal chance from the bunker as you do from the fairway short of the bunker:

Screen%20Shot%202017-10-12%20at%2012.33.

The difference is 35 yards (bunker) vs. 52 yards (fairway). You're much better off in the fairway.

4 minutes ago, DeadMan said:

My answer changes, though, if I can be 30 yards or closer with the pitch or if I could end up with a 20+ yard bunker shot.

You're not getting to within 10 yards on that bunker shot. The bunker lip to the hole location is 21 yards.

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 & "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 :edel: :true_linkswear:

Check Out: New Topics | TST Blog | Golf Terms | Instructional Content | Analyzr | LSW | Instructional Droplets

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Question for @iacas

Why did you use a 9? Sure it's up a slight hill, but slapping a 5 or 6 up there would get up high enough, plus you'd go a lot farther if you catch it fat, which for me would be likely considering it's hooded and the leading edge is exposed with zero bounce. Isn't it also easier to curve a lower lofted club than a higher lofted one?

Colin P.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

22 minutes ago, iacas said:

You don't have an equal chance from the bunker as you do from the fairway short of the bunker:

Screen%20Shot%202017-10-12%20at%2012.33.

The difference is 35 yards (bunker) vs. 52 yards (fairway). You're much better off in the fairway.

You're not getting to within 10 yards on that bunker shot. The bunker lip to the hole location is 21 yards.

Ah, okay. Then yeah, I'm going to hit a straight punch shot to finish in front of that bunker. If I need a par for whatever reason, then I'll try the low hook.

-- Daniel

In my bag: :callaway: Paradym :callaway: Epic Flash 3.5W (16 degrees)

:callaway: Rogue Pro 3-PW :edel: SMS Wedges - V-Grind (48, 54, 58):edel: Putter

 :aimpoint:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

1 hour ago, iacas said:

Your first post made very little sense @Lihu and was going to potentially derail the topic right off the bat. You'll have to trust me on that.

Ah, makes sense.

I can see that it makes little sense. My reasons are somewhat based on instinct at this point, because don't really use too much conscious thought with my shot zones any more. It's turned into a feel thing for me. Trust me, I see more trees than everyone on this site. Each round involves >15 tree trimming episodes off the tee and at least 10 of those end up with shots past/through/around a tree(s), shot zones are ingrained within my pre-shot routine. :-D

:ping:  :tmade:  :callaway:   :gamegolf:  :titleist:

TM White Smoke Big Fontana; Pro-V1
TM Rac 60 TT WS, MD2 56
Ping i20 irons U-4, CFS300
Callaway XR16 9 degree Fujikura Speeder 565 S
Callaway XR16 3W 15 degree Fujikura Speeder 565 S, X2Hot Pro 20 degrees S

"I'm hitting the woods just great, but I'm having a terrible time getting out of them." ~Harry Toscano

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

  • Moderator
2 hours ago, iacas said:

Is everyone not seeing that it's a hill there?

I see it as slightly uphill. Is it steeper than it looks in the picture?

Bill

“By three methods we may learn wisdom: First, by reflection, which is noblest; Second, by imitation, which is easiest; and third by experience, which is the bitterest.” - Confucius

My Swing Thread

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

23 hours ago, iacas said:

What about you? What would you do?

Based on the elevation change (which is hard to discern how much there is from the photo), probably a 6 or 7i and try to draw it.

I think if you are a creative player, these types of shots are very fun and while I don't like putting myself in these situations, I really enjoy trying to get out and making a shot of it. Nothing is sadder than pitching out 15 yards sideways into the fairway.

Link to comment
Share on other sites


I would've played it the same way as @iacas other than I may have played an 8-iron if it was a back pin and the 9 for a front pin.  A hooded 7, 8 or 9 iron is my go to shot for getting out of trouble when you want to hit a nice hook.

Edited by jsgolfer

-Jerry

Driver: Titleist 913 D3 (9.5 degree) – Aldila RIP 60-2.9-Stiff; Callaway Mini-Driver Kura Kage 60g shaft - 12 degree Hybrids: Callway X2 Hot Pro - 16 degree & 23 degree – Pro-Shaft; Callway X2 Hot – 5H & 6H Irons: Titleist 714 AP2 7 thru AW with S300 Dynamic Gold Wedges: Titleist Vokey GW (54 degree), Callaway MackDaddy PM Grind SW (58 degree) Putter: Ping Cadence TR Ketsch Heavy Balls: Titleist Pro V1x & Snell MyTourBall

"Golf is the closest game to the game we call life. You get bad breaks from good shots; you get good breaks from bad shots but you have to play the ball where it lies."- Bobby Jones

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Same line, but a lower lofted iron.  But that means I likely couldn't turn it as much.  (perhaps it's an indication I should practice hooded shots)

fun shot - getting into trouble just means the chance to try fun shots

 

I'd also accept the following:

2017-10-12 15_55_45-The Importance of a Trouble Shot - Swing Thoughts - The Sand Trap .com.jpg

What, too risky?

Edited by rehmwa
  • Like 1

Bill - 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

  • Administrator
3 hours ago, colin007 said:

Question for @iacas

Why did you use a 9? Sure it's up a slight hill, but slapping a 5 or 6 up there would get up high enough, plus you'd go a lot farther if you catch it fat, which for me would be likely considering it's hooded and the leading edge is exposed with zero bounce. Isn't it also easier to curve a lower lofted club than a higher lofted one?

Because I wanted to get up the hill, and hook it, and by playing the ball back in my stance I could do both.

Hitting a shot like this too low makes judging the flight distance far trickier because the landing angle is so much flatter.

trajectories.png

A 15% change in power changes the landing location and makes the runout far more difficult to predict than a higher lofted shot.

2 hours ago, billchao said:

I see it as slightly uphill. Is it steeper than it looks in the picture?

You can't see the green, or the mound behind the green, or even the base of the trees that are farther up the hill and right of the green… and that's a photo taken from eye level. It's probably 15' uphill over the 15-20 yards.

6 minutes ago, rehmwa said:

Same line, but a lower lofted iron.  But that means I likely couldn't turn it as much.

The opposite is true: less loft makes it easier to tilt the spin axis.

  • Informative 1

Erik J. Barzeski —  I knock a ball. It goes in a gopher hole. 🏌🏼‍♂️
Director of Instruction Golf Evolution • Owner, The Sand Trap .com • AuthorLowest Score Wins
Golf Digest "Best Young Teachers in America" 2016-17 & "Best in State" 2017-20 • WNY Section PGA Teacher of the Year 2019 :edel: :true_linkswear:

Check Out: New Topics | TST Blog | Golf Terms | Instructional Content | Analyzr | LSW | Instructional Droplets

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awards, Achievements, and Accolades

Note: This thread is 2339 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


  • Want to join this community?

    We'd love to have you!

    Sign Up
  • TST Partners

    TourStriker PlaneMate
    Golfer's Journal
    ShotScope
    The Stack System
    FlightScope Mevo
    Direct: Mevo, Mevo+, and Pro Package.

    Coupon Codes (save 10-15%): "IACAS" for Mevo/Stack, "IACASPLUS" for Mevo+/Pro Package, and "THESANDTRAP" for ShotScope.
  • Posts

    • I agree with @klineka & @DaveP043 above.  When a new member first joins the club they cold be told that they are not eligible for tournaments until they have an established HCP.  As you said, it only takes a few rounds.  If they do not to post HCP that was their choice and choices have consequences.  If playing in the tournament is important to them then they should step up and establish an HCP.  Maybe they miss the 1st tournament, is that a real big deal?  And if it is a "Big Deal" to them then they had the opportunity to establish the HCP. As for not knowing how to report for HCP I assume your club has a pro and they should be able to assist in getting the scores reported and I suspect out of state courses may also have staff that can assist if asked.
    • Wordle 1,013 2/6 🟨⬜⬜🟨🟨 🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩 Thought I was gonna be a big shot today...  🙂    Nice Job!
    • Cool here's my tweak, "If a player’s ball lies in the general area and there is interference from exposed tree roots or exposed rocks that are in the fairway or 1 club length from the fairway the tree roots and exposed rocks are treated as ground under repair. The player may take free relief under Rule 16.1b.[But relief is not allowed if the tree roots only interfere with the player’s stance.]
    • I would never do the extended warranty on the $50 slow cooker.  I also routinely reject the extended service plans on those toys we buy for the grand-kids.  I do consider them on higher cost items and will be more likely to get one if the product has a lot of "Electronic Tech" that is often the problem longer-term.  I also consider my intended length of ownership & usage.  If my thought is it would get replaced in 2-3 years then why bother but if I hope to use it for 10 years then more likely to get the extension. I did buy out a lease about a year ago.  Just prior to the lease end date the tablet locked up and would not function.  I got it repaired under the initial warranty and would not have bought it out if they had not been able to fix it since IMO once electronic issues start in a car they can be hard to track down & fix.  They did fix it but when I bought out the lease I paid up for the extended warranty the would cover electronic failures because my intent is to keep that car for another 8-10 years and I just do not trust the electronics to last.  Last week the touch screen went black and was unresponsive.  It reset on the 2nd time I restarted the car but that is exactly how the last malfunction started.  I fully expect to have a claim on that on repair under the extended warranty.  I do not recall the exact cost to fix last time since I did not pay it but I think it was @ $700-$800 and I suspect that will be higher next time.
    • Have you looked at Model Local Rule F-9 Relief from Tree Roots in or Close to Fairway?  You could extend this to cover exposed rocks.  The rule is recommended to be used only for areas relatively near the fairway, a player who hits a shot 20 yards in the woods doesn't really deserve relief.   Players can always take Unplayable Ball relief, they're not required to play it from a rock or a root.  Of course, they hate to take the penalty stroke too.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Welcome to TST! Signing up is free, and you'll see fewer ads and can talk with fellow golf enthusiasts! By using TST, you agree to our Terms of Use, our Privacy Policy, and our Guidelines.

The popup will be closed in 10 seconds...