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"Putting is a huge part of the game."


MrGolfguy67
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(Mod Note: This topic was split off from the 2018 WGC Match Play topic.)


He said "might be"'; and he's right that Bubba would be in the discussion. Truth is nobody knows and there will never be a definitive answer, just getting everyone to agree on what 'best striker of a golf ball' even means would be a challenge.

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4 minutes ago, MrGolfguy67 said:

He said "might be"'; and he's right that Bubba would be in the discussion.

If the discussion includes 500 people, maybe, sure.

Not the topic here, but Bubba swings fast, which helps a lot.

Golf is a game primarily based on how well you strike the ball. Thus, wins and overall success is a pretty good judge of ball strikers.

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If you're a bad putter, it's a huge part of the game.

If you take 44 putts per round... then it's a high % of strokes (unless your long game is even worse).. :)

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2 hours ago, 3jacker said:

If you're a bad putter, it's a huge part of the game.

If you take 44 putts per round... then it's a high % of strokes (unless your long game is even worse).. :)

Outside of glaring weaknesses, ball striking matters way more than putting. It doesn't even have to be terrible ball striking. I'm talking about hitting shots OB off every other tee shot.

You can miss every green, no 3-putts, get up and down 50% of time and end up shooting 9 over par with 27 putts.  You have a guy hit every green, no 3-putts, and end up shooting 9 under par with 27 putts.

 

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Golfer A - hits 14 of 18 greens, gets up & down 3 of 4 times, makes 6 birdies, has no 3 putts, shoots 67 with 27 putts

Golfer B - hits 14 of 18 greens, gets up & down 0 of 4 times, makes 0 birdies, has (2) 3 putts, shoots 78 with 38 putts

I can also cherry pick a scenario that makes my point.

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17 minutes ago, MrGolfguy67 said:

Golfer A - hits 14 of 18 greens, gets up & down 3 of 4 times, makes 6 birdies, has no 3 putts, shoots 67 with 27 putts

Golfer B - hits 14 of 18 greens, gets up & down 0 of 4 times, makes 0 birdies, has (2) 3 putts, shoots 78 with 38 putts

I can also cherry pick a scenario that makes my point.

This is all off topic but, It sounds like both golfer a & b are the same one in your scenario.  They just had a bad day one time and a good day the other time. Seriously, you’re unlikely to hit 14/18 greens and shoot 78 every time. Same with the other guy. He’s unlikely to putt well every time and shoot 67. 

No, lets make it an extreme example. Lets take Tiger and Joe. Tiger is, well, Tiger and Joe has never touched a golf club before. To play a better round, would you rather have Tiger play to the green and have Joe putt, or have Joe hit the green and have Tiger putt?

The guys on the PGA Tour  leaderboards are typically those with the best ball striking that week. The guys in the top 3 are typically those who have been putting the best of those top ball strikers.

Or think of it this way, your ball striking determines your potential scoring range. Your putting that day determines whether you’re on the low side or high side of the average score. 

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2 hours ago, MrGolfguy67 said:

Golfer A - hits 14 of 18 greens, gets up & down 3 of 4 times, makes 6 birdies, has no 3 putts, shoots 67 with 27 putts

Golfer B - hits 14 of 18 greens, gets up & down 0 of 4 times, makes 0 birdies, has (2) 3 putts, shoots 78 with 38 putts

I can also cherry pick a scenario that makes my point.

There’s no need to craft scenarios. The facts are well known here.

And we have a lot of other topics about this stuff.

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I'm the 2nd to craft a scenario on this thread, mine is just more realistic than the other one. And I know the facts, better than you could ever imagine.

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1 hour ago, dennyjones said:

Huh?  What's that suppose to mean?

It means he thinks he knows more than a guy who wrote a meticulously researched book on virtually this exact topic that is admired far and wide.

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2 hours ago, MrGolfguy67 said:

I'm the 2nd to craft a scenario on this thread, mine is just more realistic than the other one. And I know the facts, better than you could ever imagine.

Fact: putting is the least important skill in the game with the lowest Separation Value across the entire gamut of abilities.

Driving is twice as important. Approach shots are nearly three times as important. The short game (which many extend out to 100 yards, even though a 95-yard shot is hardly what most people think of when you say "short game" and which inflates its value) is third in importance/separation.

Again, not the topic here, though.

17 minutes ago, turtleback said:

It means he thinks he knows more than a guy who wrote a meticulously researched book on virtually this exact topic that is admired far and wide.

If that's an LSW mention, thanks, but I'd actually point out that there are two such books. LSW and ESC.

If it was ESC you were referring to… then I'll make the same point. :-D

@MrGolfguy67, if you're actually interested, and not as close-minded as your point above makes it seem, there are plenty of topics here exploring that, as well as:

http://lowestscorewins.com

and

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Fact:  I'm new to golf, only having played for 41 years, but my best scores are when I putt well. Far & away. When you putt well you are making birdies or saving pars.

Driving good (into the fairway) guarantees nothing, you've still got to get it into the hole. Good approach shots guarantee nothing, you've still got to get it into the hole.

 

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20 minutes ago, MrGolfguy67 said:

Fact:  I'm new to golf, only having played for 41 years, but my best scores are when I putt well. Far & away. When you putt well you are making birdies or saving pars.

No.

Sorry, but you're just wrong here. I'm not going to dance around it, because you're simply wrong.

When you hit the ball well (off the tee, approach shots), you give yourself birdie putts. Then you don't even have to putt all that well to break par.

When you hit the ball poorly, your putting can surely "save" a round… but you're talking about turning what could have been an 84 into a 78 or something. When you're hitting the ball well, putting well turns a 69 into a 65, and putting poorly turns it into a 72.

Look, again, your "experience" or "what you think you know" is easily trumped by actual data - information, hundreds of thousands of rounds, millions of shots… And they lead to charts that look like this:

Notice: putting is the smallest number there, every time.

24 minutes ago, MrGolfguy67 said:

Driving good (into the fairway) guarantees nothing, you've still got to get it into the hole. Good approach shots guarantee nothing, you've still got to get it into the hole.

Putting for par or bogey guarantees that the best score you're going to make on that hole is par or birdie.


You're dead wrong. Putting is, on average, the least important. Driving is about 2x as important, and approach shots about 3x as important. At all levels of play.

You're also seemingly and resolutely, absolutely close-minded. Given that, this site isn't for you. Please find another site where you learn nothing new, old sayings are regarded as gold, conventional knowledge is never challenged, and everyone just says what they think is true in spite of ample evidence shouting differently. You'll be happier.

29 minutes ago, MrGolfguy67 said:

Driving good (into the fairway)

Nobody said "good" drives had to be in the fairway. There are plenty of times I'm perfectly content to be in the left or right rough.

Again, if I've read you wrong, and you're not absolutely dead-set in your ways and close-minded to boot:

http://lowestscorewins.com/

Every Shot Counts

Countless other topics here, too.

I say this without any malicious intent or tone at all: you're simply ignorant to the new understanding we have about how golfers truly score in golf. And as such you have a choice: bury your head deeper in the sand, or pull it out and look around at the new information.

I know which road I've always chosen.

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11 minutes ago, iacas said:

 

When you hit the ball well (off the tee, approach shots), you give yourself birdie putts.


 

Sorry but that is absurd. You actually believe that if I, for example, hit my drive 280 yds straight down the middle on a 450 yd par4, I then automatically have a birdie putt. Insanity.

Like I said before, which was correct then and is still correct, you still have to get the ball in the hole. A good drive down the middle guarantees nothing.

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