Mock Instructor Trials #001 - Richard

[David in FL]

I think with any golf analysis the bottom line question is -what is wrong? The FC comparison and dropping the club to the inside was a pretty good analysis I thought.

Is that his priority?

If so, then the next question posed in the OP is, how do you attack the problem to fix it?

[14ledo81]

I would say key #2 is main priority. I would have him hit balls using Erik's drill where you preset impact/weight forward and hit balls.

[Ernest Jones]

Golfer has two overriding issues.

Key#2 is close to non existent.

Key#4 is a bit of a mess.

Which Key do you call this lesson? Why?

I think, in terms of priority, the golfer needs to address both issues at the same time but for the purpose of catagorizing I would call it a key#4 lesson that will address key#2 as an aside. I would do this because I want this particular golfer to be thinking in terms of key#4 and getting the club to work on an inclined plane, he needs to be able to "see" this in his mind to get it.

What do you prioritize as top piece? Why?

As I stated above, I am going to prioritize getting the left shoulder to work downwards on the backswing to get him deeper and in a better position to execute the downswing. I think if I can get this golfer working on a proper incline the weight shift (key#2) piece will come much more naturally.

How do you attack that piece and what results would you like to see (in that piece and any related pieces)?

I'll be asking him to do some drills with an alignment rod held across his chest to get the feels for turning on the correct plane, I want to see him getting the shoulder nice and steep. I may ask him to try "pointing" his left shoulder at the ball as a goal for the backswing. From there I would ask him to make some downswing thrusts while feeling a pressure increase under his lead foot, possibly with aid of nerf ball or similar. I will be asking him to do a fair bit of drilling this concept without a club, just holding the alignment rod across his chest and making a nice steep backswing followed by an agressive forward thrust while "squishing" the imaginary (or real) ball under his front foot. I want him to film and review until he is seeing the correct movements on video, then we will add the club and continue to work these two pieces until something else becomes higher on the priority list.

I'll also ask him to correct his stated handicap.

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[Ernest Jones]

Just went back and read the other posters. I think it's cool and a testament to @iacas and @mvmac 's teaching skills that almost all of us have identified the same pieces, keys 2 and 4 and pretty much all of us have seen the key#4 element to be the starting point. I don't know if we're right yet, we'll have to wait for Erik's grand reveal but I think we are right. Addressing the weight shift first won't help much with the key#4 issues whereas addressing key#4 will assist in making key#2 easier which is why I believe that in this particular case the key#4 takes precedence over key#2 as a priority.

Can't wait to hear the pros' take on this.

[iacas]

Just went back and read the other posters. I think it's cool and a testament to @iacas and @mvmac's teaching skills that almost all of us have identified the same pieces, keys 2 and 4 and pretty much all of us have seen the key#4 element to be the starting point. I don't know if we're right yet, we'll have to wait for Erik's grand reveal but I think we are right. Addressing the weight shift first won't help much with the key#4 issues whereas addressing key#4 will assist in making key#2 easier which is why I believe that in this particular case the key#4 takes precedence over key#2 as a priority.

Can't wait to hear the pros' take on this.

Well aren't you going to be disappointed? :D

[Ernest Jones]

Well aren't you going to be disappointed? :D

Lol, I guess I am. At least I won't be alone!

So when is the reveal?

[freedrop]

Is that his priority?

If so, then the next question posed in the OP is, how do you attack the problem to fix it?

First David in FL let me say that I enjoyed your real time pitching demo.

If you look at R's hand position on the way down when they are head level,they are basically at the side of his head (from the side view -12 secs) while FC's hands  at the head height are in line with his shoulders.If R wants to keep the back swing as is but get the club in a more FC position on the way down, he can either consciously drop the right elbow down into his side from the top.. or.. if this doesn't suit then he could try and consciously bow the left wrist at the top of the swing.

Ideally he should flatten the swing on take away ,my guess is he isn't allowing the right wrist/forearm to rotate under on the way back from address causing the extreme upright swing.

Now get out into that driveway and prove me wrong.

[Golfingdad]

I don't really consider myself a mock instructor, but it seems fun, so I'll play the game.  I figure you guys put the keys in order (somewhat) so I'll just use that logic to say that my first lesson to him would be a Key #2 lesson.  His head isn't really moving at all - so I'd say he's fine with Key #1 - but he is very flat-footed, with virtually no weight transfer to the front side until after he hits the ball.

I'd start by having him flare out his right foot and then we'd work on his pivot.  (Basically the same exact thing you guys did with "my two dads")  On the backswing, feel the bend in the left knee, left shoulder under the chin, and right side streeeeeeeeeeetching.  In conjunction with that, I'd have him do pre-set drills because I think that is a really good way to get a feel for what it's like to have your weight forward, and what it feels like to make a really strong downward strike.

And ... that's pretty much my guess.

Just went back and read the other posters. I think it's cool and a testament to @iacas and @mvmac's teaching skills that almost all of us have identified the same pieces, keys 2 and 4 and pretty much all of us have seen the key#4 element to be the starting point. I don't know if we're right yet, we'll have to wait for Erik's grand reveal but I think we are right. Addressing the weight shift first won't help much with the key#4 issues whereas addressing key#4 will assist in making key#2 easier which is why I believe that in this particular case the key#4 takes precedence over key#2 as a priority.

I was one of the ones in the minority who have not mentioned Key 4.  Probably because I'm clueless, however, I will clarify my reasoning ...  I think the Key 2 changes I propose COULD help key 4 without him even knowing it.  My thought is that if the weight is so far back, then you're requiring the club to "come around" the body.  His lack of key 2 is helping to cause his lack of key 4.  So, my thought is that when you address the weight forward, now the body has gotten out of the way of where the club is supposed to go, and that will make it much easier for him to eliminate the OTT move.

[Ernest Jones]

I was one of the ones in the minority who have not mentioned Key 4.  Probably because I'm clueless, however, I will clarify my reasoning ...  I think the Key 2 changes I propose COULD help key 4 without him even knowing it.  My thought is that if the weight is so far back, then you're requiring the club to "come around" the body.  His lack of key 2 is helping to cause his lack of key 4.  So, my thought is that when you address the weight forward, now the body has gotten out of the way of where the club is supposed to go, and that will make it much easier for him to eliminate the OTT move.

Interesting. Well if I'm wrong I hope you're right. ;-)

[nevets88]

I think once you work on key #2, it depends on what the student does next, how he reacts to changes to the BS, what happens. Key #4 may resolve itself and I would think key #3 is next to work on. O/W key #4.

[saevel25]

I was one of the ones in the minority who have not mentioned Key 4.  Probably because I'm clueless, however, I will clarify my reasoning ...  I think the Key 2 changes I propose COULD help key 4 without him even knowing it.  My thought is that if the weight is so far back, then you're requiring the club to "come around" the body.  His lack of key 2 is helping to cause his lack of key 4.  So, my thought is that when you address the weight forward, now the body has gotten out of the way of where the club is supposed to go, and that will make it much easier for him to eliminate the OTT move.

I think that as well. I think people lack key 3 due to the fact they are using getting rid of key 3 to compensate for lack for key's 2 and 1. I do think in some regard fixing key 4 can help with key's 1 and 2 because certain moves promote a breakdown in those keys. Like two shallow of a shoulder turn can cause a person to shift their weight to far to the right side  (for right handed player). This guy has such a lack of key number 2 that I think that must be fixed first. He's actually falling away from the target going into impact. I can understand maybe to much extension way too early, but still getting over slightly. Falling away is a glaring weakness in my book.

[David in FL]

Now get out into that driveway and prove me wrong.

Ask and ye shall receive!   I just posted a FO video over on the other thread.

http://thesandtrap.com/t/39411/quickie-pitching-video-golf-pitch-shot-technique/270#post_948300

[Slowcelica]

Looks to me like he is all arms, he's not using his lower body at all.

[iacas]

So, does everyone want "the answer*"?

* "The answer" implies that there's only one correct answer. Rather, I'll simply be sharing our approach, what we did. There's a chance that, done another way, results would have been better or faster, but all I can tell you is what we chose to do, and why.

[David in FL]

So, does everyone want "the answer*"?

* "The answer" implies that there's only one correct answer. Rather, I'll simply be sharing our approach, what we did. There's a chance that, done another way, results would have been better or faster, but all I can tell you is what we chose to do, and why.

Hell yes!

[Ernest Jones]

YAY

Inquiring minds want to know!!

[Golfingdad]

Yes, I would love to hear it.

[iacas]

Well tough beans.

Bahahahahahahhaha.

(I'll do it in a bit.)