2023 U.S. Open (Los Angeles Country Club)

[iacas]

6 hours ago, Rick Graham said:

100% true, us open should be most difficult track all year, usga only allowing 22k spectators is a joke as well.  2 62's????  Even brandel chamblee said this course is fine for members, but not for us open, usga leadership is questionable for the last 23 years.

Okay pal. Where'd those two guys who shot 62 finish, anyway?

[Rick Graham]

Dont care Buddie, probably should have been 3 62's?  Lowest 1st round scoring average in us open history.  I would like to see tougher course for these players, a true test.  But the players complain so much about tough courses and high rough, mike whan made his reputation on ladies tour where he bowed to every complaint they had, hell do same at usga

[iacas]

2 minutes ago, Rick Graham said:

Dont care Buddie, probably should have been 3 62's?  Lowest 1st round scoring average in us open history.  I would like to see tougher course for these players, a true test.  But the players complain so much about tough courses and high rough, mike whan made his reputation on ladies tour where he bowed to every complaint they had, hell do same at usga

Then don’t watch.

I’d love to see what you shoot at the course. The final round began with four really really good players in contention. I think the course identified who was playing the best.

[Rick Graham]

I didnt watch, along with many others

[snapfade]

Sounds like we heard something like this before a week or so ago from someone who isn't around anymore. Hmmmm

[iacas]

2 hours ago, Rick Graham said:

I didnt watch, along with many others

Then you don’t know what you’re talking about.

Thank you for clarifying.

[Rick Graham]

Been around a long time, seen alot of golf, sorry but i dont like the course.  Watched first round.  Now, PGA Championship was held on great course & seemed like true test, very good set up, great tourny.

[iacas]

23 minutes ago, Rick Graham said:

Been around a long time, seen alot of golf, sorry but i dont like the course.  Watched first round.  Now, PGA Championship was held on great course & seemed like true test, very good set up, great tourny.

Oh now you did watch. Sure thing.

[saevel25]

The course was fine. The biggest issue I had was the lack of crowds on the course. Even for how much Augusta National will limit where people can go in specific areas. You always see a good crowd on TV. It just seemed off to me. The tournament lacked that excitement that can come from the crowd reaction. 

As for the course layout. It was fine. When things started to dry out, and if the wind kicked up a bit, the course finally had some teeth to it. The course is fine, it is more the nice weather LA can have. So, for me. -10 was fine. It wasn't someone going -24 or something stupid like that. The course required 4 competent rounds of golf. It didn't seem like the course was playing easy. 

[snapfade]

If you listen closely, you can hear a horse being beat to death. Bring on the US Senior Open. 

[GolfLug]

40 minutes ago, saevel25 said:

The course was fine. The biggest issue I had was the lack of crowds on the course. Even for how much Augusta National will limit where people can go in specific areas. You always see a good crowd on TV. It just seemed off to me. The tournament lacked that excitement that can come from the crowd reaction. 

As for the course layout. It was fine. When things started to dry out, and if the wind kicked up a bit, the course finally had some teeth to it. The course is fine, it is more the nice weather LA can have. So, for me. -10 was fine. It wasn't someone going -24 or something stupid like that. The course required 4 competent rounds of golf. It didn't seem like the course was playing easy. 

IMO, wind is an underrated aspect of course difficulty. If there is no or little wind, I believe there is not a course setup in the world these guys can't take down with impunity- heavy rough, fast greens, tight runoffs and any other defense a course can muster up. Out of 156 players that start out, you will always have 15-20 who will show up with their A game and make any set up look tame. 

Once the wind kicks up (IMO it is about 12-15 mph), suddenly the course completely changes character, i.e. the rough, fast greens and the runoffs, becomes super relevant. Players become defensive and only a matter of time before anyone even slightly off game will tumble down to the bottom of the hill. 

It is hard to overstate how good a round Clark played on Sunday.  

[boogielicious]

57 minutes ago, GolfLug said:

IMO, wind is an underrated aspect of course difficulty. If there is no or little wind, I believe there is not a course setup in the world these guys can't take down with impunity- heavy rough, fast greens, tight runoffs and any other defense a course can muster up. Out of 156 players that start out, you will always have 15-20 who will show up with their A game and make any set up look tame. 

Once the wind kicks up (IMO it is about 12-15 mph), suddenly the course completely changes character, i.e. the rough, fast greens and the runoffs, becomes super relevant. Players become defensive and only a matter of time before anyone even slightly off game will tumble down to the bottom of the hill. 

It is hard to overstate how good a round Clark played on Sunday.  

Agree. Some courses expect wind to be a defense, especially in the British Open. When it’s calm, they go low.

I’ve been around for a long time too and see a lot of golf. The course was fine and had those interesting barrancas. It was softer than the USGA hoped to start, but they adjusted. It’s harder to set up courses that you haven’t worked with very much.

They’ll always be disappointed fans, no matter where the tournament is or the final score relative to par.

[snapfade]

2 hours ago, boogielicious said:

Agree. Some courses expect wind to be a defense, especially in the British Open. When it’s calm, they go low.

I’ve been around for a long time too and see a lot of golf. The course was fine and had those interesting barrancas. It was softer than the USGA hoped to start, but they adjusted. It’s harder to set up courses that you haven’t worked with very much.

They’ll always be disappointed fans, no matter where the tournament is or the final score relative to par.

Maybe the USGA/PGA/PGAT/LIV/DPWT/PIF can install marine layer producing devices, then we will see some real tournaments.

[colin007]

4 hours ago, snapfade said:

Bring on the US Senior Open. 

Said no one. Ever. 

[jxdama]

On 6/27/2023 at 2:15 PM, Rick Graham said:

100% true, us open should be most difficult track all year, usga only allowing 22k spectators is a joke as well.  2 62's????  Even brandel chamblee said this course is fine for members, but not for us open, usga leadership is questionable for the last 23 years.

 

I agree. Not a US Open worthy course.

[klineka]

17 minutes ago, jxdama said:

I agree. Not a US Open worthy course.

Why not? Only 18 players broke par for their 4 round totals.

That's 11.5% of everyone who entered.

6 of the last 10 US Open final scores have been within 4 shots (or higher) of this years final score. 

This wasnt THAT easy of a course

Edited June 29, 2023 by klineka

[jxdama]

5 minutes ago, klineka said:

Why not? Only 18 players broke par for their 4 round totals.

That's 11.5% of everyone who entered.

Winning score  of  -10 is too low. It would  have been lower except  the  3 top finishers  got tight. A  -7 and  2 -5's were shot  on the  last  day. They  need to get  back to rough surrounding the greens and fairways that  makes  it a  penalty for hitting  into it. 

[klineka]

4 minutes ago, jxdama said:

Winning score  of  -10 is too low. 

Over the last 10 years (Including 2023) the average winning score is 272.6. 

This year it was 270. So only slightly easier than average over the last decade of US Opens

 

9 minutes ago, jxdama said:

A  -7 and  2 -5's were shot  on the  last  day. 

Final Rounds of US Opens

2022 - A -5 and two -4s

2021 - Three -4s

2020 - One -3

2019 - Two -5s and four -4s

2018 - A -7, a -5 and a -4 (On a much harder golf course where the winning score was 281)

2017 - A -6, a -5, and two -4s

These players are so freaking good that no matter how difficult the course, at least a couple guys are capable of going fairly low any given round. 

Just because there was a -7 and two -5s on the last day doesn't mean the course isn't worthy of hosting a US Open. 

Based on your own logic then you should also think that Shinnecock isn't worth of hosting a US Open because there was a -7, a -5, and a -4 in the final round, right? The winning score there was 11 strokes higher than in 2023 yet someone went just as low in the final round there as they did in 2023. (Ironically enough it was Tommy Fleetwood both times)

Basing whether or not a course is fit to host a US Open based on the tournament score and final round score is a quite poor way to base it IMO. I think the course should be judged on how well it identified the best golfer that week, and how fine the line was between really good shots/golf and mediocre or poor shots/golf. Really good golf made LACC scoreable, and average/below average golf got punished. 

 

18 minutes ago, jxdama said:

They  need to get  back to rough surrounding the greens and fairways that  makes  it a  penalty for hitting  into it. 

That's a horrible way to determine the best golfer IMO. Rough around the greens brings the field closer together because the penalty for missing the green isn't nearly as severe as when there is short grass and the ball rolls and rolls further from the green and the next shot is off a tight lie to a super firm green.

When there are super firm greens and super thick rough surrounding the greens a ball that airmails the green by a couple yards is going to end up in the same exact spot as a ball that lands middle to back of the green and takes a big hop into the back rough. two quite different quality of shots yet they ended up in the same spot.