The Dan Plan - 10,000 Hours to Become a Pro Golfer (Dan McLaughlin)

[Lihu]

It's not me! I actually  hope he does well, but I honestly don't think he puts in as much time as he says he does. I also think the way he is going about the whole thing is flawed. If I can average 75 in tournaments after 6 years of golf then him putting in as much time as he has said would put him at least in the 70's. Maybe Talent and hand eye coordination are more important than 10,000 hours though. If he can make it, I sure as hell I know I can lol. He needs to play in tournament after tournament after tournament and grind out rounds from here until the 10,000 hour mark. He has everything at his disposable such as a coach, technology, time that I really don't have. There is no reason in this world that he shouldn't be shooting in the 70's unless. If you can shoot 85 in a tournament, I truly believe you can practice hard enough and shoot 78 in a tournament every once in awhile. Maybe I am wrong and there are some people who just will never be able to break a certain number.

Well, I feel it should have been.

[chris3putt]

At least for me, I do not think he is living a dream. It would be great to play golf everyday, but I get the sense the he is on the edge of making ends meet so much that he has to ask for donations. I consider this far from a dream.

The problem I think many of us have is that he is testing a "proven" theory that 10,000 hours of practice will make you an expert. Now though almost everyone in this thread thinks he has gone about the wrong way and is not actually testing anything. He now looks like he is someone looking for attention.

I would venture a guess that everyone who follows this thread and Dan are curious to know if the 10,000 theory is correct. We truly want to see it tested. Dan has screwed us because he has not gone about testing a scientific theory with ANY science, or at least any we can see. That is frustrating.

There are always going to be detractors in anything but everyone here at one time wanted to know if the 10,000 thing worked with golf. Now we'll never know, at least not in the way he has gone about it.

This is the kicker for me, also.

From what I remember of "The Talent Code", it isn't just the 10,000 hours that matter, but that the hours are put in practicing at the edge of your ability , so that you are constantly expanding said ability.

The author of "The Talent Code" gives the great example that most of us have over 10,000 hours in the skill of driving a vehicle, but haven't really improved since the first few years of getting our licence, because we have reached a safe, predictable standard. There is no need to push ourselves to drive any differently.

I can't see where Dan is demonstrating (and recording) how he is practicing at the edge of his ability. The hours alone don't count

[bkuehn1952]

He has everything at his disposable such as a coach, technology, time that I really don't have.

One of Dan's problems is money.  He last saw his coach/pro on July 31.  I suspect he sees him so infrequently because he can't afford an hour every other day.  He lost access to his "Trackman" over a year ago.  After Nike outfitted him, he has had to purchase every piece of equipment since.  He stopped getting the services of a physical trainer over a year ago.  He finally had to begin paying for the use of a golf course and practice area a year ago (was comped previously) and now he is complaining that his dues are going up, along with various fees and "food" minimums.

The other issue is his quest for the "magic beans."  He has convinced himself that there must be a system that will miraculously transform him into a great golfer.  Initially it was swing speed (as measured by his borrowed Trackman).  Then it became the search for the perfect clubs; the right set of clubs was all that he needed.  Then it was "goal setting".  Then it was the "play box" from Vision54 and "Dynamic Loft" which he discovered in Australia.  Unfortunately for Dan, there are no "magic beans."  You become a good golfer from good, regular instruction and lots and lots of practice and playing.  I really think his typical day has become an hour of hitting balls and then 18 with a few friends and acquaintances.  Not a bad life if one can afford it but not likely to produce a champion golfer.

[newtogolf]

One of Dan's problems is money.  He last saw his coach/pro on July 31.  I suspect he sees him so infrequently because he can't afford an hour every other day.  He lost access to his "Trackman" over a year ago.  After Nike outfitted him, he has had to purchase every piece of equipment since.  He stopped getting the services of a physical trainer over a year ago.  He finally had to begin paying for the use of a golf course and practice area a year ago (was comped previously) and now he is complaining that his dues are going up, along with various fees and "food" minimums.

The other issue is his quest for the "magic beans."  He has convinced himself that there must be a system that will miraculously transform him into a great golfer.  Initially it was swing speed (as measured by his borrowed Trackman).  Then it became the search for the perfect clubs; the right set of clubs was all that he needed.  Then it was "goal setting".  Then it was the "play box" from Vision54 and "Dynamic Loft" which he discovered in Australia.  Unfortunately for Dan, there are no "magic beans."  You become a good golfer from good, regular instruction and lots and lots of practice and playing.  I really think his typical day has become an hour of hitting balls and then 18 with a few friends and acquaintances.  Not a bad life if one can afford it but not likely to produce a champion golfer.

Great insight and an example of the poor planning on Dan's part.  Before one dedicates themselves to playing golf for 10,000 hours and claiming publicly that their goal is to become a PGA pro they need to consider all the possible hurdles they might encounter.  Dan didn't secure himself financially ($100,000 isn't enough) or through sponsorship to ensure he could sustain the effort for the full 10,000 hours and now he's at a point where without the funding and sponsorship it will be nearly impossible for him to make it to 10,000 hours, no less achieve his goal of becoming a PGA pro.

Anyone with basic intelligence would realize there was a big risk that the experiment would fail and / or that public / sponsor interest would wane.  If he's smart, he gives up and goes back to work.  A 10 handicap is plenty good for a recreational golfer with a full time job.

[Lihu]

Great insight and an example of the poor planning on Dan's part.  Before one dedicates themselves to playing golf for 10,000 hours and claiming publicly that their goal is to become a PGA pro they need to consider all the possible hurdles they might encounter.  Dan didn't secure himself financially ($100,000 isn't enough) or through sponsorship to ensure he could sustain the effort for the full 10,000 hours and now he's at a point where without the funding and sponsorship it will be nearly impossible for him to make it to 10,000 hours, no less achieve his goal of becoming a PGA pro.

Anyone with basic intelligence would realize there was a big risk that the experiment would fail and / or that public / sponsor interest would wane.  If he's smart, he gives up and goes back to work.  A 10 handicap is plenty good for a recreational golfer with a full time job.

That's my goal anyway. 8-10 handicap would be really awesome.

IMHO, he should have saved up $500,000 just for living/travel expenses and another $500,000 for a club membership at a difficult course for ten years. It probably costs at least a million dollars for someone with talent to become a pro golfer.

[flopster]

That's my goal anyway. 8-10 handicap would be really awesome.

IMHO, he should have saved up $500,000 just for living/travel expenses and another $500,000 for a club membership at a difficult course for ten years. It probably costs at least a million dollars for someone with talent to become a pro golfer.

I'm not so sure that would be the dollar amount, in fact what I think is the springboard for a lot of the top talent in the world is collegiate golf, they play some of the best courses in the world and constantly play in tournament formats, that age of 18 -22 is where the real top tier emerge. Dan on the other hand appears to once again take another backwards step or to be more realistic is realizing just where he is ability wise, his index appears to be rising back above 5 and more precisely 5.3. He's now down to 4500 hours and is still a long ways from scratch level IMO, also I'm noticing he's not putting in the hours like he used to, burn out very well may be on the horizon as well.

[Lihu]

I'm not so sure that would be the dollar amount, in fact what I think is the springboard for a lot of the top talent in the world is collegiate golf, they play some of the best courses in the world and constantly play in tournament formats, that age of 18 -22 is where the real top tier emerge. Dan on the other hand appears to once again take another backwards step or to be more realistic is realizing just where he is ability wise, his index appears to be rising back above 5 and more precisely 5.3. He's now down to 4500 hours and is still a long ways from scratch level IMO, also I'm noticing he's not putting in the hours like he used to, burn out very well may be on the horizon as well.

Agreed, my thinking is that the cost of putting a kid into collegiate golf on a scholarship is on the order of $500,000.

[CraiginKSA]

He doesn't have the game to get into a Division 1 school.  And the other divisions don't offer scholarships for golf.  A 5 HC is not going to even get him onto the JV squad at a community college.  If he's out of money, he needs to take his bucket of balls and find a mowed field somewhere and go with the "secret in the dirt" strategy.

[Lihu]

He doesn't have the game to get into a Division 1 school.  And the other divisions don't offer scholarships for golf.  A 5 HC is not going to even get him onto the JV squad at a community college.  If he's out of money, he needs to take his bucket of balls and find a mowed field somewhere and go with the "secret in the dirt" strategy.

Not even to place in regional level high school level tournaments.

[iacas]

He doesn't have the game to get into a Division 1 school.  And the other divisions don't offer scholarships for golf.

You can get an athletic scholarship to play for a Division 2 school.

[CraiginKSA]

You can get an athletic scholarship to play for a Division 2 school.

Yes, you can, but even in Div. 1 the golf scholarships are sometimes either partial or shared.  The Div. 2 and 3 in the minor sports like swimming, wrestling, lacrosse, golf, Call of Duty etc. are not always full rides.  Sometimes just tuition, or tuition and books, or a meal plan.

Amyway, Dan is not getting any scholarships unless he lowers his index about 5-6 strokes.

[David in FL]

1 Sept revision.....

Anti-hcp is 10.7.

Name:

Dan McLaughlin

Club	Handicap Index	Effective Date	Low H.I.
Riverside Golf & Country Club Oregon Golf Association	5.3	9/1/2014	2.6

Revision Scores Recent Scores H.I. History C.H. Calculator

Used	T	Date	Score	CR/Slope	Diff.
*	H	8/14	77	71.9/131	4.4
*	T	8/14	80	72.3/130	6.7
	T	8/14	86	72.3/130	11.9
	H	8/14	88	71.9/131	13.9
*	AI	8/14	73	71.5/121	1.4
*	I	8/14	80	71.9/131	7.0
	H	8/14	84	71.9/131	10.4
*	H	8/14	80	71.9/131	7.0
*	AI	8/14	79	72.0/128	6.2
*	I	8/14	80	73.0/133	5.9
*	AI	8/14	78	74.0/139	3.3
	I	8/14	83	71.9/131	9.6
	T	8/14	83	71.9/131	9.6
*	H	6/14	81	71.9/131	7.8
	H	6/14	81	71.9/131	7.8
*	T	6/14	80	73.0/133	5.9
	H	6/14	86	71.6/130	12.5
	T	6/14	87	72.5/135	12.1
	T	6/14	86	72.5/135	11.3
	T	6/14	88	72.5/135	13.0

T = Score Type (H - Home, A - Away, T - Tournament, P - Penalty,
C - Combined, I - Internet)
U - Used for USGA Handicap Index® Computation
Low H.I. = Lowest Handicap Index over the last 12 months.

[Pretzel]

Yes, you can, but even in Div. 1 the golf scholarships are sometimes either partial or shared.  The Div. 2 and 3 in the minor sports like swimming, wrestling, lacrosse, golf, Call of Duty etc. are not always full rides.  Sometimes just tuition, or tuition and books, or a meal plan.

Amyway, Dan is not getting any scholarships unless he lowers his index about 5-6 strokes.

You can get full rides to division II schools, you just have to be on the cusp of getting into a division I school on a scholarship for it to happen. The reason that full rides are less common than the other types are because schools, per NCAA regulations, are only allowed to give out so many scholarships each year for a given sport. They are allowed to split scholarships between multiple people such that it totals out to the number of full scholarships they are allowed to give, but they can't give out any more than that number. It prevents the rich schools from having a massive advantage by being able to give out full rides to every single athlete.

As for him placing in regional high school tournaments, I would say his chances are pretty doubtful with his tournament scores. I'm currently the second place player in the 4A Northern League conference (it goes league, then regionals, then state) and my worst tournament score was a 78. The guy in 8th (our #3 player) is only a few strokes behind me. The guy in first is miles ahead of me, but he shot a 63 at a league match and has finished over par only once so far this year (luckily, he's our team's #1 so we don't compete against him). The thing is, even though our high school team has the #1, #2, and #8 players, we're placed third in the league because of our #4 player scores. High school tournaments usually (around here) end up stacked in the high 70's, so you don't have a chance if your other players are shooting high 80's or in the 90's.

The winning team for the regional tournament will have a score between -3 and +5 overall, and to win state at Walking Stick (in Pueblo, a pretty easy course) I imagine the team will need to be at or under par. Dan is nowhere near that currently.

[Lihu]

Agreed, Dan plays tournaments as well as a typical high school kid who practices and plays 200 hours a year.

[flopster]

You can get full rides to division II schools, you just have to be on the cusp of getting into a division I school on a scholarship for it to happen. The reason that full rides are less common than the other types are because schools, per NCAA regulations, are only allowed to give out so many scholarships each year for a given sport. They are allowed to split scholarships between multiple people such that it totals out to the number of full scholarships they are allowed to give, but they can't give out any more than that number. It prevents the rich schools from having a massive advantage by being able to give out full rides to every single athlete.

As for him placing in regional high school tournaments, I would say his chances are pretty doubtful with his tournament scores. I'm currently the second place player in the 4A Northern League conference (it goes league, then regionals, then state) and my worst tournament score was a 78. The guy in 8th (our #3 player) is only a few strokes behind me. The guy in first is miles ahead of me, but he shot a 63 at a league match and has finished over par only once so far this year (luckily, he's our team's #1 so we don't compete against him). The thing is, even though our high school team has the #1, #2, and #8 players, we're placed third in the league because of our #4 player scores. High school tournaments usually (around here) end up stacked in the high 70's, so you don't have a chance if your other players are shooting high 80's or in the 90's.

The winning team for the regional tournament will have a score between -3 and +5 overall, and to win state at Walking Stick (in Pueblo, a pretty easy course) I imagine the team will need to be at or under par. Dan is nowhere near that currently.

That may be the case with a kid I know that will be going to Hawaii next October to take a look at the school that is offering a full ride, I'm not sure what school it is because it's div2 and I don't know if Hawaii is 1 or 2. Anyways he's been playing for just less than 2 years and already shoots high 60's so he may be on that cusp I'm not really sure but seeing where he is in his time frame compared to Dan just proves how big of a joke Dan is IMO, Dan and his blind followers are in their own little bubble thinking he still can reach his goal, it's going to be real entertaining when he's down to that last 1000 hours and still spraying his driver, I think the weight of reality will be pressing very hard by then.

[nevets88]

I was looking at videos of his swing - it really hasn't changed much. Backswing is shorter. I can't put my finger on it. The BS from dtl looks wonky. And the follow through, ouch, my back.

His improvement process - I was hoping he would do side by side video of old vs new swings. And he shouldn't be afraid to show videos of bad swings. That's part of deliberate practice, right? Make mistakes to make progress.

Instead of doing the Vision mental thing, if his putting was off, perhaps the time spent on Vision would be better spent learning Aimpoint?

I wanna learn how to learn better! Give me some ideas Dan Plan!

[Shorty]

I wanna learn how to learn better! Give me some ideas Dan Plan!

I'd be looking anywhere but there.

He has no ideas.

His mission at the moment seems to be to a have a positive mindset. That's it.

[Slice of Life]

I'd be looking anywhere but there.

He has no ideas.

His mission at the moment seems to be to a have a positive mindset. That's it.

Yup. If I spent as much time and money as he has so far, I'd be very disappointed to not be at least a scratch golfer.