Directed Force Putters

[JPitts]

1 hour ago, iacas said:

and ample experience says the majority won't be able to,

How many putters have you tested where the entire top line was visible at address and not obscured at all by the shaft or hosel? Serious question,  not trying to be a jerk.  It makes a huge difference for me with alignment.  I can't align the spider putters or the odyssey #7. I'm always a few degrees off with those.  I'm dead on with this one though. 

[Vinsk]

13 minutes ago, billchao said:

I wasn't referring to non-conforming clubs. What I was trying to say is, what shape the putter happens to be depends on how each individual aims. Not everyone is suited to a blade so a generalization like the one @Jack Watson made is inaccurate.

Well @Jack Watson is a bit unique in that he's happy with his golf as it is and just believes one needs to 'swing the club' without any nonsense regarding mechanics to get in the way.

[Ernest Jones]

1 hour ago, JPitts said:

How many putters have you tested where the entire top line was visible at address and not obscured at all by the shaft or hosel? Serious question,  not trying to be a jerk.  It makes a huge difference for me with alignment.  I can't align the spider putters or the odyssey #7. I'm always a few degrees off with those.  I'm dead on with this one though. 

I think the point is that because folks perception vary so much, there is no correct putter. Some folks may aim better when top line is obscured. Some aim way better with no alignment aids. For some, an alignment aid on the bottom shelf is better than one one the top of the putter. Some need offset, some suffer from offset and so on...

I'm wary of any putter that claims to work for everyone. 

[JPitts]

1 minute ago, Ernest Jones said:

I think the point is that because folks perception vary so much, there is no correct putter. Some folks may aim better when top line is obscured. Some aim way better with no alignment aids. For some, an alignment aid on the bottom shelf is better than one one the top of the putter. Some need offset, some suffer from offset and so on...

I'm wary of any putter that claims to work for everyone. 

I wasn't saying it did.  Just asked a question regarding his testing. 

[Ernest Jones]

12 minutes ago, JPitts said:

I wasn't saying it did.  Just asked a question regarding his testing. 

Erik is a fitter for Edel. I was shocked by how much he could **** with my aim by making tiny changes to headshape, placement of lines, dots or complete removal of any alignment aids. You'd be surprised at how much he knows about aim bias. 

[Mr. Desmond]

52 minutes ago, Ernest Jones said:

 

I'm wary of any putter that claims to work for everyone. 

Well, I don't think any one putter directly makes that claim, or it's just marketing. But it's funny in a sad way when I go to a forum and up pops a question on fitting or choosing a putter and people say - if it looks good, or it feels right, etc. Nothing to do with the science of aim and distance control but other factors that don't matter, including ego.

The DF is custom fitted as to lie - the claim being it is lie balanced - and I think the definition of lie balanced is not simple. The effect for me is that I can grip it very lightly in a relaxed manner. That may help some people but not others.

Aim was my primary concern with the DF. Frankly, I aimed it left of the hole in its standard look when I was fitted. I then had the idea to shorten the T line and was aiming it straight after doing so. I was lucky because that will not work for most. But that fitting was on an inside practice green. First 3 times I took the DF to the practice green, it was a struggle. Eventually, I positioned the ball off my left heel, and that helped starting it on line. After 3-4 times, I found it easier to aim on my line, and it's gotten easier as I've become more familiar with it. Now I have a lot of confidence ... on the practice green. The real thing is the real thing - it's different. We'll see.

[canadianpro]

I have been so impressed with this putter...it has taken me from being a bad, not confident putter into a good putter. Life member of the PGA of Canada...no need for any profit...I just think this is the best putter ever. Grip it lightly, aim and let it swing itself! I have had many many putters over the last 15 years...all the names...counter balanced etc...   Not even close to this one

[DBoys]

I had 14 putters at one time, what does that say about my weakest link. Bought this putter this spring when I saw how well it did at the PGA show in Orlando. Needless to say I sold all 14 putters, my putting still is my weakest link but no longer sweat the 2-6 footers. Current handicap is 1.2 and hope to be scratch by seasons end. All thanks to practice and this putter. 

[The Club Nut]

53 minutes ago, Mr. Desmond said:

Well, I don't think any one putter directly makes that claim, or it's just marketing. But it's funny in a sad way when I go to a forum and up pops a question on fitting or choosing a putter and people say - if it looks good, or it feels right, etc. Nothing to do with the science of aim and distance control but other factors that don't matter, including ego.

The DF is custom fitted as to lie - the claim being it is lie balanced - and I think the definition of lie balanced is not simple. The effect for me is that I can grip it very lightly in a relaxed manner. That may help some people but not others.

Aim was my primary concern with the DF. Frankly, I aimed it left of the hole in its standard look when I was fitted. I then had the idea to shorten the T line and was aiming it straight after doing so. I was lucky because that will not work for most. But that fitting was on an inside practice green. First 3 times I took the DF to the practice green, it was a struggle. Eventually, I positioned the ball off my left heel, and that helped starting it on line. After 3-4 times, I found it easier to aim on my line, and it's gotten easier as I've become more familiar with it. Now I have a lot of confidence ... on the practice green. The real thing is the real thing - it's different. We'll see.

Mr. Desmond, you're right. Nothing is really "simple" about the lie angle balancing, it's a lot of work to do so. I am a fitter in Lancaster PA for Directed Force. I can say that it's definitely not a one size fits all putter right out of the gate (not like ANY putter would be in reality) mostly because 100% of golfers are used to compensating for their current putter. Every putter that doesn't have the DF technology wants to open or close the minute it's off the ground during the stroke. A number of my clients share your sentiment and "learning curve" if you will, using it. Once they had a few practice sessions with it and figured out that they just needed to allow their muscles to neutralize, it was night vs. day.  Just find your setup and go.  My clients tell me it'll never leave their bag.  No club is a cure-all, obviously you have to still read the putt, and you have nerves with any putter, but if you trust the DF to know what square is you can take a lot of the variables out of your putting and concentrate on what matters. 

5 hours ago, caniac6 said:

Regardless of the science, a putter has to look good to me. Not sure I could use a DF putter. I like the looks of the Edel putters. If I ever try a custom putter it would probably be an Edel, but the closest fitter is about two hours away.

@caniac6, I said the same thing. If you can get your hands on one from a friend or colleague be sure to give it a good fair shake. I honestly thought that it was a big, bulky looking thing resembling more of a metal detector or branding iron, but when i set it down behind the ball and started rolling in putt after putt, the shape suddenly didn't matter and now it's all but an afterthought as i don't even notice anymore. Check out the Directed Force site and see who's in your area. They have a lot across the country. 

[The Club Nut]

7 hours ago, Lihu said:

There isn't any "lack of knowledge in physics" in your posts. I think most people were turned off by your overall tone, but I liked your review post. It's just that at 35 putts average which is closer to 38 right now, I'm not going to improve my putting no matter what I use.

@Lihu check their website www.directedforce.com to see if there's anyone in your area. This thing cured my yips and my year long search for a putter. Not saying it definitely will, but you can check out someone in your area and at least demo the putter. See it in action.  If anything can help, it'll be the technology in the Directed Force Reno.

[iacas]

6 hours ago, JPitts said:

How many putters have you tested where the entire top line was visible at address and not obscured at all by the shaft or hosel? Serious question,  not trying to be a jerk.  It makes a huge difference for me with alignment.  I can't align the spider putters or the odyssey #7. I'm always a few degrees off with those.  I'm dead on with this one though. 

I've tested tens of thousands of putters with hundreds or thousands of golfers.

@Ernest Jones answered for me pretty well.

3 hours ago, canadianpro said:

I have been so impressed with this putter...

Peter, you're a fitter for DF.

[saevel25]

4 hours ago, Ernest Jones said:

Erik is a fitter for Edel. I was shocked by how much he could **** with my aim by making tiny changes to headshape, placement of lines, dots or complete removal of any alignment aids. You'd be surprised at how much he knows about aim bias. 

It is shocking how much a the clubhead shape and alignment markings will influence aim. Having witnessed a fitting in person, and going through a fitting, you really understand how the small details matter in getting a putter fitted for you.

[Jack Watson]

19 hours ago, Vinsk said:

Well @Jack Watson is a bit unique in that he's happy with his golf as it is and just believes one needs to 'swing the club' without any nonsense regarding mechanics to get in the way.

Pretty much.  I am a feel player.  I like the bullseye.  It's simple.  Obviously I just can't use the more techy millennium falcon Odyssey type mallets and stuff.  

Even though I don't aim a putter blade like a rifle visually,  i can't handle all those lines down there on the mallets.  I don't swing them well either.  I aim the same way I would point at something in the distance with my finger it's not like looking through a scope on a rifle for me.  

I have to say again I agree with @iacas on the simple fact that the forces of blade opening and closing are negligible.  It would be different if we had to use a jig like the revealer gizmo to putt with but we do not.  Also I would even argue that getting a feel you like on that where you can really feel that putterhead as it pendulums is a good thing.

I like a lot of what Crenshaw and Faxon have said re putting.  

Another point here is some have said the great thing about this df ugly duckling is you can lessen grip pressure and let it swing.

Well,  if you were not doing that already you weren't doing it right to begin with imo.

I absolutely have a simple feel key incorporated into my psr for putting that I have found is now embedded like bedrock.  It's my personal deal.  The feel and look of the simple blade is the feel I like.  

I don't tend to embarrass myself rolling my rock and some days I can make my share...

Also I think a great thing to do is practice putting with the sand wedge.  Really makes you focus the right way imo.

putting is like all of it get too mechanical and you are toast.  It's just rolling a ball with a stick.  It's not that hard to putt well enough.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 30, 2017 by Jack Watson

[JPitts]

5 hours ago, Jack Watson said:

It's my personal deal.  The feel and look of the simple blade is the feel I like.  

As is the directed force for me and several others.  There certainly is more than one way to skin a cat.  

I like to have an open mind. I've always agreed with the saying that great men are great because they know the one thing all great men know... that they don't know everything. 

 

[Phil McGleno]

48 minutes ago, JPitts said:

I like to have an open mind.

Hope that is mostly directed at @Jack Watson.-Very open minds here from what I have seen.

[Mr. Desmond]

22 hours ago, Jack Watson said:

 

I have to say again I agree with Erik on the simple fact that the forces of blade opening and closing are negligible.  It would be different if we had to use a jig like the revealer gizmo to putt with but we do not.  Also I would even argue that getting a feel you like on that where you can really feel that putterhead as it pendulums is a good thing.

Get the aid called the Putting Stick where precision is necessary to roll the ball down a thin piece of acrylic and you will see that something is happening with the forces opening and closing (as well as ball position), although if you have a putter fit to you (or that fits you), forces would lessen.

Another point here is some have said the great thing about this df ugly duckling is you can lessen grip pressure and let it swing. Well,  if you were not doing that already you weren't doing it right to begin with imo.

You have to experience and play with the DF a while to appreciate what it does and the very light grip pressure. I was taught by pros as to grip - maybe it was poor instruction but the guy taught Zach Johnson - enough pressure so no one could pull the putter out of your hands but wrists and arms were relaxed.

With the DF, pressure seems less than 1/10 and in the through stroke I increase it to 2/10. Feels like the hands are barely holding it. The putter is extremely stable. 

 

 

 

 

Please read inside the quote above in bold.

The results are that the consistency is uncanny and groupings are tight when practicing, when the ball is not going in the hole. Perhaps I am lucky - I did ask for a heavier weight than std - about 365g head and GP Snsr grip - not as thick as the new grips like the Superstroke. The fitter fit for length and lie. I had a custom sightline. Yep, I've had beautiful putters and ansers - TP Mills, Bettinardi, Scotty, etc. And this DF is a garden hoe and I laugh when I look at it, but it's a tool. If it gets the ball in the hole in less strokes, it's a go.

Edited October 1, 2017 by Mr. Desmond

[The Club Nut]

I will have to disagree with saying that the force opening or closing a putter face is negligible. That's how putts are pushed and pulled by average golfers. The blade goes back and opens, without some force to close the face it will remain open as the big muscles pull the putter through. It gets more important the heavier the putter is because there's that much force to add on. Perhaps it's not as big of a deal for someone who is a high level golfer, but even top amateurs have noticed a huge difference after switching.  In addition, it's as much about the pendulum as it is about the face angle.  Think about lifting weights - if you try to push up too early, you're increasing the weight load on your muscles because of the momentum so you even have to exert more effort. 

There is no shortage of unique hand grips, putting styles, stances, grip shapes, weighting and stroke types designed to take out variables in the putting stroke. With all of these things, the DF  Reno is the only putter that has actually shown to deliver on what it says it will do. 

[Jack Watson]

1 hour ago, Mr. Desmond said:

Please read inside the quote above in bold.

The results are that the consistency is uncanny and groupings are tight when practicing, when the ball is not going in the hole. Perhaps I am lucky - I did ask for a heavier weight than std - about 365g head and GP Snsr grip - not as thick as the new grips like the Superstroke. The fitter fit for length and lie. I had a custom sightline. Yep, I've had beautiful putters and ansers - TP Mills, Bettinardi, Scotty, etc. And this DF is a garden hoe and I laugh when I look at it, but it's a tool. If it gets the ball in the hole in less strokes, it's a go.

Hey,  who am I to say your feel is wrong.

My feel is I EMBRACE the toe of the putter.  Like I said,  I think grip pressure is very important.  I agree with Faxon.  

Ot

it seems strange so many one time posters talk about how this reverse fat goldfish putter is a magical tool that's cut 4 strokes off their game by itself.

I don't find that very convincing, guys.

Faxon here.  I really putt so much better by being dynamic as he says rather than trying to remain static.

 

Edited October 1, 2017 by Jack Watson