The Definitive Pace of Play Thread

[RGoosen]

Right. Not taking your driver with you to the green when the tee is close by, leaving your clubs in the wrong place around the green, putting the headcover on your club when you can just hold it for the cart ride and put it in the bag when you hit your next shot, waiting until it's your turn to read your putt or get your yardage.

I agree completely. Most people don't think about putting the head cover on later, but I do it all the time when I'm the passenger in a cart. One thing that has not been mentioned that I can recall... When you get paired up with someone or another group tell them early on that you play ready golf. I tell them I have a hard enough time keeping my score so if it is up to me I would prefer to give up the tee box if someone is ready to hit before me. If it is a group of players I am joining then I let them do their own thing. If another person joins my group we expect them to play when they are ready to hit. If they are not ready and someone else is closer then the player ready to hit will hit. Tee box honors in our group is reserved for birdies/eagles, otherwise we fire when ready off the tee.

[Fourputt]

Regardless I think it's nitpicking if the scorecard is clipped to the wheel and your partner says what did you get and writes it down we used a grand total of about 10-15 seconds of time writing it down. Really, I get the point but we're talking about three minutes a round writing dow the score. It's not even close to the cause of slow play. It's mostly ball searches, deciding on what shot to hit and just plain bad shots. When I have a bad hole and it takes me 4 shots to hit the green even If I am moving as fast as I can I am causing slow play simply by just not playing well. If you're a beginner and you throw up a few snowmen a round that is going to take a lot more time than someone who hits the green in two.

It's a simple matter of etiquette.  It doesn't take very many of the "3 minute"  delays to turn into a road block.  If you can rationalize a little bit of wasted time there, then a little bit somewhere else, then again, etc., you become not part of the problem, you are the problem.  Every post you have made has tried to justify taking time for this and that unnecessarily, mostly because you just want to, and that tells me exactly where your head is at, and it's dark up there.

It's time you woke up and admitted that you are simply resistant to being tutored on your shortcomings - the classic "Nobody can tell me what to do" attitude.  By denying justified criticism you are trying to rationalize your actions instead of taking a look inside and realizing that you are wrong.

[Lihu]

While I agree with all the comments on slow play, remember that people here are not here to be scapegoats representing all slow players. I would like to learn more about why, and read what at least one of them has to say.

[Psyber]

It's a simple matter of etiquette.  It doesn't take very many of the "3 minute"  delays to turn into a road block.  If you can rationalize a little bit of wasted time there, then a little bit somewhere else, then again, etc., you become not part of the problem, you are the problem.  Every post you have made has tried to justify taking time for this and that unnecessarily, mostly because you just want to, and that tells me exactly where your head is at, and it's dark up there.   It's time you woke up and admitted that you are simply resistant to being tutored on your shortcomings - the classic "Nobody can tell me what to do" attitude.  By denying justified criticism you are trying to rationalize your actions instead of taking a look inside and realizing that you are wrong.

Lol ok. So basically my only offense of slow play is taking ten seconds to write score down in my cart and my attitude is no one can tell me what to do. Usually my buddy drives the cart and that's when he writes score and I'm simply not going to bitch at him when we basically make every other attempt to keep a good pace from the tee to the green. Want to know what I don't do? Spend more than a minute looking for lost balls. Past a minute I just drop a new one because I buy them used most of the time so I don't mind doing that. I've played with people who lost a ball every few holes and used every last bit of their five minutes looking for each one. Now THAT is something to complain about. Fact is I can't remember the last time I didn't see people start hitting their ball as soon as we sat in the cart so I'm not holding anyone up.

[David in FL]

I would like to learn more about why, and read what at least one of them has to say.

You won't hear that, for the simple reason that the VAST majority of slow players don't think that they're slow. Many (most?) simply think that faster players are speed demons rushing (hence the title of this thread) to get around the course.

[DaveP043]

Fact is I can't remember the last time I didn't see people start hitting their ball as soon as we sat in the cart so I'm not holding anyone up.

If they were waiting for you to get into your cart, you were holding them up.  That may be completely unavoidable, if you were keeping up with the group in front of you, but they were waiting.

These pace of play threads seem so repetitive.  Some guys say they play fast.  Others say they can't go any faster, because they're always waiting on the group ahead.  I have never read a post where someone says..."I (or we) could definitely play faster, we seem to regularly have some space in front of us.  What can we do different?"  I know I play with groups that fall behind sometimes, and we all work to catch up.  Do any of you EVER fall behind?  What do you do to catch up?

What would encourage (or force) you to play faster?  I know of private clubs where slow play gets you a letter of warning, a second letter means you're restricted to later tee times.  I know of clubs where start AND finish times are posted, so everyone can see who played slow that day.  I've seen a flag system...a yellow flag waiting for you on a tee means you're out of position, a red flag means you're REQUIRED to skip a hole and go to the next tee.   I'm talking about a combination of slower than "acceptable times, AND being out of position, not simply one or the other.  Would these, or could these, work where you play?

[Jon Hoover]

These pace of play threads seem so repetitive.  Some guys say they play fast.  Others say they can't go any faster, because they're always waiting on the group ahead.  I have never read a post where someone says..."I (or we) could definitely play faster, we seem to regularly have some space in front of us.  What can we do different?"  I know I play with groups that fall behind sometimes, and we all work to catch up.  Do any of you EVER fall behind?  What do you do to catch up?

I can say that because of errant shots their are times where on any given hole me or my group will fall behind, when that happens you will see me running to my next shot or back to the cart in order to get back on pace. The thing I hate to see is the idea that if people are having to wait because the course is slow then that gives them the perceived right to take as much time as they want by re-putting after the hole is finished or what not. I think that it is really inconsiderate, if I have to wait that sucks but I won't force others behind me to wait just because I have no where to go. I still play as quickly as I would as if the course is open. If I have to wait on the tee box so be it but don't waist time on or around the green just because you may have to wait on the next tee box.

[Fourputt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveP043

These pace of play threads seem so repetitive.  Some guys say they play fast.  Others say they can't go any faster, because they're always waiting on the group ahead.  I have never read a post where someone says..."I (or we) could definitely play faster, we seem to regularly have some space in front of us.  What can we do different?"  I know I play with groups that fall behind sometimes, and we all work to catch up.  Do any of you EVER fall behind?  What do you do to catch up?

I can say that because of errant shots their are times where on any given hole me or my group will fall behind, when that happens you will see me running to my next shot or back to the cart in order to get back on pace. The thing I hate to see is the idea that if people are having to wait because the course is slow then that gives them the perceived right to take as much time as they want by re-putting after the hole is finished or what not. I think that it is really inconsiderate, if I have to wait that sucks but I won't force others behind me to wait just because I have no where to go. I still play as quickly as I would as if the course is open. If I have to wait on the tee box so be it but don't waist time on or around the green just because you may have to wait on the next tee box.

Yes.  You don't get the right to delay leaving the green just because you know that you will have to wait on the next tee.  That sort of attitude adds to the delay for those behind you.  If we all did that the typical round would be 5 hours by mid morning and over 6 hours by close.  Immediately clearing the green when they are finished putting is one of the simplest things that players can do to help pace of play.  While not a good situation any time, it's still less frustrating to wait on the tee than it is in the fairway.  Especially if that fairway wait is because the group ahead is just screwing around.  Marking scores, putting away clubs, digging out a fresh ball, cleaning the current ball, picking your nose, scratching your ass - all should be left until you get to the next tee.

Good pace of play and ready golf is nothing more than using your time efficiently and allocating tasks not associated with making a stroke to the expected wait times between strokes, and moving out smartly as soon as possible after making your stroke to clear the area for the next group.

[Dave2512]

What I don't think the people dawdling on greens understand is it's clue that says "I don't think I am slow and I will play however I want" to the players around them. It rarely stops there these are also the people that take a long time searching for errant shots, are slow at the turn, misuse carts, all of the things that eventually make people slow.

I am convinced slow golfers don't understand how the accumulation of minutes leads to overly long rounds. It's just 60 seconds here and there right? Even if you finish just 12 minutes over the POP on each side that's equivalent to how it takes a foursome to play one par 4. The problem I see is slow groups get into what I call in between spots on the course that makes it tough for faster players to get around them until the gap is so great it caused a backup. Someone slow clearing a green is slow getting off the next tee. Even if there is a group on the tee ahead they usually aren't prepared to be ready to play the instant it becomes available. It makes it tough to recover from bad shots because time has already been wasted where it shouldn't have and this is how the group ahead gets away from them.

[Moppy]

While I agree with all the comments on slow play, remember that people here are not here to be scapegoats representing all slow players.

I would like to learn more about why, and read what at least one of them has to say.

No. What needs to be done is to hurl insults, concoct graphics, whatever, to shout down anybody who has an alternate point of view. At least that is what I learned on these threads.

[Fourputt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lihu

While I agree with all the comments on slow play, remember that people here are not here to be scapegoats representing all slow players.

I would like to learn more about why, and read what at least one of them has to say.

No. What needs to be done is to hurl insults, concoct graphics, whatever, to shout down anybody who has an alternate point of view. At least that is what I learned on these threads.

What "alternate point of view"?  One that says slow is okay?

[Dave2512]

From what I've read the alternate point of view is worst cast scenario (the max published POP) is acceptable as long as you don't exceed it. Which is fine with me as long as people are moving without delay. On a busy course I am fine with that. But it's a rare day we don't look ahead and see people dawdling.

[Jon Hoover]

[colin007]

From what I've read the alternate point of view is worst cast scenario (the max published POP) is acceptable as long as you don't exceed it. Which is fine with me as long as people are moving without delay. On a busy course I am fine with that. But it's a rare day we don't look ahead and see people dawdling.

heres the rub - ive never played a round at the max PoP (usually 415-430) without there being delays .

[Lihu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lihu

While I agree with all the comments on slow play, remember that people here are not here to be scapegoats representing all slow players.

I would like to learn more about why, and read what at least one of them has to say.

No. What needs to be done is to hurl insults, concoct graphics, whatever, to shout down anybody who has an alternate point of view. At least that is what I learned on these threads.

Still laughing. . .

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moppy

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lihu

While I agree with all the comments on slow play, remember that people here are not here to be scapegoats representing all slow players.

I would like to learn more about why, and read what at least one of them has to say.

No. What needs to be done is to hurl insults, concoct graphics, whatever, to shout down anybody who has an alternate point of view. At least that is what I learned on these threads.

What "alternate point of view"?  One that says slow is okay?

I have no idea either, that's why I want to find out?

[pumaAttack]

What "alternate point of view"?  One that says slow is okay?

You do know people move at different paces right?

Why do they have to conform to your pace?  Why don't you conform to theirs instead?

What makes you right and them wrong?   Golf is supposed to be a recreational activity to be enjoyed and for many people that means a slower pace than everyday life.   Some people are enjoying the weather, the outdoors, etc. and don't feel the need to rush through every shot likes its a race.

Maybe you need to take a step back and enjoy your surroundings instead of racing to the finish line.

[Lihu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fourputt

What "alternate point of view"?  One that says slow is okay?

You do know people move at different paces right?

Why do they have to conform to your pace?  Why don't you conform to theirs instead?

What makes you right and them wrong?   Golf is supposed to be a recreational activity to be enjoyed and for many people that means a slower pace than everyday life.   Some people are enjoying the weather, the outdoors, etc. and don't feel the need to rush through every shot likes its a race.

Maybe you need to take a step back and enjoy your surroundings instead of racing to the finish line.

We have no choice in this matter.

[RussUK]

Was this started by Kevin Na?