Share your New Strokes Gained Data from GAME Golf!

[billchao]

1 minute ago, Golfingdad said:

This is how I tag them as well.  Since I can't walk to the OB spot and mark where the first one ended up, I simply tee up another, and add the +2 like Jeremie did.

Same here. This is another flaw in their system, IMO. The data is missing all the errant tee shots that result in OB and lost balls. My driving  is worse than it appears on Game Golf.

I suppose you could tag twice to get the strokes gained data more accurate, but I wonder what all those 0 yard drives will do to your driving stats.

[dsc123]

1 hour ago, iacas said:

I think we're just scratching the surface here guys. I think very good things are inbound.

I won't belabor the point beyond this, but have they actually told you that they are going to address any of these things specifically?  Or are you just expressing hope?

 

We had them on here answering questions months ago.  People brought up a lot of important issues but they wouldn't respond directly and instead vaguely promised big things in the future.  I guess that was this, and its cool in a lot of ways, but it didn't fix any of those problems.  In some ways, it actually exacerbated them.  So I wonder whether it is wise to get our hopes up that any of this will change.  

[Dave2512]

IMO the OB issue only a factor for those that hit it OB frequently. Even then it appears there are other flaws.

I don't doubt they want to offer the best product they can but it seems some of the feature launches are either ho-hum or half way there. What good is flawed SG analysis. I'd rather they beta stuff and iron out every kink before rolling it out.

That said I don't think their goal is to please the hardcore small percentage of golfers that want precise stats. For me it really wouldn't change any goals. I can see with my eyes what's wrong with my golf. Being able to slice it thinner isn't going to reveal anything I don't already know.

If they add anything to the SG thing I'd like more ways to compare. For example I'd like to be able to see how I compare to others in the challenges I enter. Not just SG but all of it. I got more from joining challenges than anything. When the GIR challenge was going it had me trying to hit more greens. Not that shouldn't be a goal anyway I was just more aware of it.

[RFKFREAK]

1 hour ago, billchao said:

Same here. This is another flaw in their system, IMO. The data is missing all the errant tee shots that result in OB and lost balls. My driving  is worse than it appears on Game Golf.

I suppose you could tag twice to get the strokes gained data more accurate, but I wonder what all those 0 yard drives will do to your driving stats.

That's how I've done it, and then go back and forth which is best so, for me, I'm totally inconsistent in how I tag OB shots where I re-hit the shot.

The other thing with doing the 0 drives way is that for shot dispersion, it won't tell you if you hit it right or left OB.  You could figure that out if they implement something like @Golfingdad suggested which would be useful to know.

[iacas]

1 hour ago, dsc123 said:

I won't belabor the point beyond this, but have they actually told you that they are going to address any of these things specifically? Or are you just expressing hope?

We're in the early stages of making GAME Golf one of our three premier partners here on TST for 2016. Well, more middle stages, but they're on board, we're on board, and we're finalizing things here soon.

1 hour ago, dsc123 said:

We had them on here answering questions months ago.  People brought up a lot of important issues but they wouldn't respond directly and instead vaguely promised big things in the future.  I guess that was this, and its cool in a lot of ways, but it didn't fix any of those problems.  In some ways, it actually exacerbated them.  So I wonder whether it is wise to get our hopes up that any of this will change.  

They answered questions and obviously can't give away business plans or too much about the future, never mind that even if it's a small thing, there's little upside in making promises because things can change.

49 minutes ago, Dave2512 said:

IMO the OB issue only a factor for those that hit it OB frequently. Even then it appears there are other flaws.

I agree. But if the OB one is available, it's a very easy thing to take action on.

49 minutes ago, Dave2512 said:

I don't doubt they want to offer the best product they can but it seems some of the feature launches are either ho-hum or half way there. What good is flawed SG analysis. I'd rather they beta stuff and iron out every kink before rolling it out.

I agree, but let's give this a little time. Yes, I am on board with saying that I wish this had been tested a wee bit more. But at the same time, I also don't think it's quite as bad as we're looking at, and I also think small changes will have a fairly large effect, in part because every shot gained by one category (say, approach shots) will be lost by others (say, short game).

49 minutes ago, Dave2512 said:

If they add anything to the SG thing I'd like more ways to compare. For example I'd like to be able to see how I compare to others in the challenges I enter. Not just SG but all of it. I got more from joining challenges than anything. When the GIR challenge was going it had me trying to hit more greens. Not that shouldn't be a goal anyway I was just more aware of it.

I agree, and I'll admit to being a little… disappointed… with how slowly the stats available in GG have grown. I'd like to see, for example, historical data on how I play certain holes. I have an idea, but often, the ideas aren't exactly right, and at lower handicap levels, even a tenth of a stroke, or a quarter of a shot, here and there mean quite a bit.

[Dave2512]

26 minutes ago, iacas said:

I'd like to see, for example, historical data on how I play certain holes.

This would be huge and it's a big reason I will continue to support them with the hope it eventually develops into the badass tool it could be.

FWIW IMO it's better than anything else out there. I liked the massive collection of stats my previous hand input stat tracking offered but it was tedious. After months of dual I use I started using just GG. With GG seeing was believing for me and GG definitely revealed things to me I had previously misjudged. The stats I was keeping really didn't mean anything until I could see just how poorly I was striking the ball and that's the real usefulness of GG. It changed how I plan shots and for that I am grateful. The missing ingredient for me isn't lack of stats, to improve in 2016 I need to find an instructor.

[kpaulhus]

So I also use USHandicap.com, along with GHIN, and GAME GOLF< because I'm a bit of a data geek. The amount of data provided at US handicap is pretty stout considering Im only entering my hole by hole scores, fairways, and putts. I can search by hole and see my average score of the last 20 rounds, YTD, and career at each and every course. 

Since Im a member of a private club and play the same course 95% of the year, I know what my tough holes are and what I usually score on them. Im looking to Game Golf to help me understand how I can play these holes differently and score better. 

[Dave2512]

21 minutes ago, kpaulhus said:

So I also use USHandicap.com, along with GHIN, and GAME GOLF< because I'm a bit of a data geek. The amount of data provided at US handicap is pretty stout considering Im only entering my hole by hole scores, fairways, and putts. I can search by hole and see my average score of the last 20 rounds, YTD, and career at each and every course. 

Yep US Handicap/GolfNet offers a lot of detail. Loved it. But my guess is that much detail with a GPS driven system is a lot ask, unless they add a bunch of editing features. Which I'd be fine with. Just get the shot/tag locations there and I'll do the work. GG could do a lot with that regarding the strokes gained right down to what to exclude and include.

[kpaulhus]

10 minutes ago, Dave2512 said:

Yep US Handicap/GolfNet offers a lot of detail. Loved it. But my guess is that much detail with a GPS driven system is a lot ask, unless they add a bunch of editing features. Which I'd be fine with. Just get the shot/tag locations there and I'll do the work. GG could do a lot with that regarding the strokes gained right down to what to exclude and include.

I spend on average 30 mins or more looking at stats when I get home from my round of golf. Usually I'm watching football or the PGA Tour so I sit and upload my round and look at my F ups. 

[dkolo]

On November 18, 2015 at 12:19:01 PM, Golfingdad said:

This is how I tag them as well.  Since I can't walk to the OB spot and mark where the first one ended up, I simply tee up another, and add the +2 like Jeremie did.

Perhaps, similar to the putting idea I had up above, they could add a way to manually estimate shots that lead into penalties like that.  Instead of just a "+2", let you be more specific and say it was OB or lost, and let you manually tag it afterward.  Maybe a blue line showing the stray drive, then a +1, then the red line showing the third shot and so on.

I dunno, just brainstorming here.

I don't know what benefit it'd have. People would just be putting in terrible guesses messing up data. It would be more useful for them to start adding tags for what happened that caused penalty strokes and labeling shots as chips, hit trees, wind affected, lost, etc. 

[Golfingdad]

5 minutes ago, dkolo said:

I don't know what benefit it'd have. People would just be putting in terrible guesses messing up data. It would be more useful for them to start adding tags for what happened that caused penalty strokes and labeling shots as chips, hit trees, wind affected, lost, etc. 

You think?  I dunno, it seems like it wouldn't be that hard to get at least in the ballpark using your knowledge of your swing, distance and google maps landmarks.  I know if I hit a big ugly slice, it's probably going 220-240 or something and I can see that it went about 30 yards right of the edge of the pond, so I shouldn't have trouble marking that.

[Dave2512]

My guess is they are trying to keep it simple. I don't see many people using it and from the signed rounds I've looked at most are lazy editors as it is. The massively detailed functions people like us want is likely an incredibly small faction of GG users.

[dkolo]

15 minutes ago, Golfingdad said:

You think?  I dunno, it seems like it wouldn't be that hard to get at least in the ballpark using your knowledge of your swing, distance and google maps landmarks.  I know if I hit a big ugly slice, it's probably going 220-240 or something and I can see that it went about 30 yards right of the edge of the pond, so I shouldn't have trouble marking that.

Just from my experience and with people I play with, higher handicaps would be lucky to guess their yardages on drives to within 30-40 yards, especially on big misses. Besides, Game Golf is all about taking down measurements, not guessing. I dunno, I don't see it being that useful.

[dsc123]

22 hours ago, iacas said:

We're in the early stages of making GAME Golf one of our three premier partners here on TST for 2016. Well, more middle stages, but they're on board, we're on board, and we're finalizing things here soon.

They answered questions and obviously can't give away business plans or too much about the future, never mind that even if it's a small thing, there's little upside in making promises because things can change.

 

Thanks.  This was informative.  

Edited November 19, 2015 by dsc123

[Dave2512]

15 minutes ago, dkolo said:

Just from my experience and with people I play with, higher handicaps would be lucky to guess their yardages on drives to within 30-40 yards, especially on big misses. Besides, Game Golf is all about taking down measurements, not guessing. I dunno, I don't see it being that useful.

I agree but just because something isn't useful for higher handicap golfers doesn't mean it shouldn't be there. People don't have to use every function. What I think would be nice is options not necessarily having to choose one way or the other.

A way to exclude shots from stats would be nice. Forget having to identify by tree, OB, brick wall or whatever just toggle it in or out. Still it doesn't come up much. Every round there is maybe one or two tagged shots that are unusual for me. All the other crazy stuff is how I actually play.

[kpaulhus]

The way I mark an OB tee shot is by just re-hitting without tagging and adding the 2 stroke penalty after the round. 

[Dave2512]

I often tag twice from habit, I tag even when I don't have the dang thing on, and edit/delete later to add the penalty strokes. I don't think that's a bad way of doing it but the concern seems to be the impact on the driving and SG stats.

Personally I feel that if you are hitting so many shots OB your stats are flawed by the limitations of GG you already know what you need to work on. Seeing it perfectly analyzed by GG isn't going to change the answer. For everyone else not addicted to OB this is a small issue and likely one they will fix.

I knew I was a crappy ball striker before I started using GG. Seeing dead nuts SG stats won't change much for me because it's a moving target due to being a high handicap golfer dealing with periods of good and bad golf. Of course there are gremlins out there too. I have rounds with silly high for me GIR. Looks great on paper but I remember all the weird worm burners that rolled 80 yards to get there or whatever. If I see periods of higher than usual stats I need to remember stuff like that not necessarily a sign of improvement.

Point is after three years of stat tracking my goals have never changed, I need to be a better ball striker if I want to improve. And I have improved but not so much it still isn't the goal. Sure I'd like to improve other stuff too, like chipping, but the goal is not to have to chip so much.

First thing GG needs to do is expand the SG analysis to more than 10 rounds. My best to worst scores in my last 20 are in the 15 stroke range. With GG using any signed round as a round, if it's included in stats, it's not representing much. Could be less than 90 shots.

[InTheRough]

7 hours ago, dkolo said:

I don't know what benefit it'd have. People would just be putting in terrible guesses messing up data. It would be more useful for them to start adding tags for what happened that caused penalty strokes and labeling shots as chips, hit trees, wind affected, lost, etc. 

I wouldn't want to have to tag these things while I'm on the course but an option in the round review would definitely be nice.  Could be something as simple as a drop-down box when you enter a penalty with options like: OB Right, OB Left, Other Penalty...etc.  Also, an option to pick the club you hit it could be a good addition with so you can track how many strokes certain clubs actually cost you per round. I'm sure that most people know that they struggle with certain clubs but, coming from personal experience seeing my GG stats, sometimes actually seeing the numbers can be eye opening. 

7 hours ago, Dave2512 said:

My guess is they are trying to keep it simple. I don't see many people using it and from the signed rounds I've looked at most are lazy editors as it is. The massively detailed functions people like us want is likely an incredibly small faction of GG users.

I agree with you that they are more than likely keeping it simple and what the members of this site, who are golf enthusiasts, want is not always realistic, but with all of the data that GG can grab it would be cool to see more in depth analysis possibilities in the future.  GG could then turn into something like Excel...some people will just want it to do simple lists and spreadsheets and others will be able to use it for more complex analysis.