Within 50 yds ....

[Gerald]

You have a point there !

it depends on the quality of the fringe and fairway, if it's dry and bumpy I will also opt for landing it at the green.

[ncates00]

  On 5/1/2018 at 3:07 PM, Gerald said:

20-30 yds

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Umm, the topic was 50 so as another guy said, yeah that would make sense then if you're that close with no obstacle.  But 50 yards or even 80 as another guy posted?  C'mon man lol

[Vinny Cap]

  On 5/1/2018 at 3:07 PM, Gerald said:

Today's players ...... sounds a bit to me that you mean today's tour players ..... not us.

Today's tour players are so seldom in that range from the hole

I am not a today's (tour) player and a bump and run from let's say 20-30 yds can be hard to judge with a high soft landing pitch shot compared to a low running and rolling bumb and run.

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Sorry if I was vague... I did mean the tour players as Johnny Miller doesn't come out to do color commentary on my rounds anymore. 😀

Most of my golf buddies don't have the shot in their bag as they never see it or have tried it.  Just a good option to have in my opinion.

  On 5/1/2018 at 3:07 PM, ncates00 said:

Agreed, but it isn't the go-to shot around the green.  Too much chance involved.  If you know your carry yardages and have some aptitude with a wedge, you'll be much closer to the hole to go with a more standard pitch shot.

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Agreed for sure.  I would rather 51 it to the hole but sometimes a 7i BnR get me closer when I can't fly it to the hole.

  On 5/1/2018 at 3:08 PM, Lihu said:

Sometimes too many options can mess you up too.

On the courses I play, if you can hit a wedge and have it stop reliably, that's the best bet. Everything else is making up for not being able to hit a wedge properly.

 

Where I play this is exactly the case. You really want the ball to plunk down as close as you can get it.

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True, true but not for all.  I like options as it can give me better results if it's wet, under trees, in a bad divot, etc.... you get the idea,

It's not a shot for everybody, that's for sure.

[Gerald]

  On 5/1/2018 at 3:14 PM, Vinny Cap said:

It's not a shot for everybody, that's for sure.

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well I have been playing that for about 40 years now, maybe it is experience, maybe it is that golf and conditions are different in Europe, than on most USA courses with faster greens.....

[Vinny Cap]

  On 5/1/2018 at 3:19 PM, Gerald said:

well I have been playing that for about 40 years now, maybe it is experience, maybe it is that golf and conditions are different in Europe, than on most USA courses with faster greens.....

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I am totally with you.  I like the BnR.  One of my fav courses has a lot of trees around 2 sides of the hole so if you are long on your approach, you can be under trees that you can't pitch or chip from.

Great shot that I use when I need it.  I won't be doing it all day long as I am good with my 51... would like to hit that all day long if I could!  LOL

Edited May 1, 2018 by Vinny Cap

[Groucho Valentine]

I use a 8 or 9i for a run of the mill bump and run shot most of the time. 20-30 yards maybe. But I've used everything from a GW to a hybrid for that type of shot. It really depends on what is in front of me. 

[Patch]

7 wood, choked down, with an extended putting stroke works well for me at 50+/- yards. This assuming there are no issues between my ball, and the pin. Works even better with a firm, relative flat, or slightly up hill run to the pin. 

I actually practice this 7 wood shot. 

Edited May 1, 2018 by Patch

[DaveP043]

  On 5/1/2018 at 3:19 PM, Gerald said:

well I have been playing that for about 40 years now, maybe it is experience, maybe it is that golf and conditions are different in Europe, than on most USA courses with faster greens.....

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From my limited experience in Scotland and Ireland, conditions are indeed pretty different from the US.  In my area, the grass is more lush, and watered more heavily, so that a chipped ball won't bounce or roll reliably through the fairway.  For that reason, its almost always better to fly a shot onto the green.  When I've been in Ireland or Scotland, the links turf is much firmer, is watered less heavily, and the ball bounces and rolls beautifully.  The greens are firmer, and less receptive to spin, so a ball flown onto the green will generally roll off the back.  In those conditions, the bump and run chip, or even the really long putt are the shots with a better chance of success.  I know I hit a 60 yard putt to within about 12 feet on the Old Course a few years ago.

[Elmer]

  On 5/1/2018 at 2:56 PM, ncates00 said:

And the new guys are MUCH better around the greens too.  There's a reason why no one does a bump n run as their stock short game shot.  Today's player isn't going to take their chances on...chance... of a odd bounce off a slope unless the shot dictates it.  Today players are in tune with their wedges from carry distance, trajectory, spin, etc.  I'd much rather flight a wedge in onto the green and let the ball roll just slightly from there, pending the lie and distance, you might even carry it onto the green with very little if any roll out.

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  On 5/1/2018 at 3:04 PM, Vinny Cap said:

It appears as they don't use it at all was more what Johnny was saying.

It should be an option in the bag.  The more options you have, the better.

I really like to 51 most short shots but after surveying the shot, landing, rollout, etc. it's the best option sometimes and I am glad I have it in my bag.

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If Johnny Miller could chip like the pros today he would never utter the phrase "bump & run" again!

Of course I wonder why the pros of today are better at chipping than bump & run? Maybe it should be phrased as "less skilled at bump & run".
Could today's wedges and variety of wedge/club options be a factor?

[Vinny Cap]

  On 5/1/2018 at 3:47 PM, Elmer said:

If Johnny Miller could chip like the pros today he would never utter the phrase "bump & run" again!

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Do you think you could chip wearing an outfit like this?  LOL

" Could today's wedges and variety of wedge/club options be a factor?  "

Yes for sure.  With wedge options from 45* to 64*, many options on bounce from 0 - 20+ and now custom grinds... it's like night and day.

Edited May 1, 2018 by Vinny Cap

[Gerald]

  On 5/1/2018 at 3:47 PM, Elmer said:

Of course I wonder why the pros of today are better at chipping than bump & run? Maybe it should be phrased as "less skilled at bump & run".
Could today's wedges and variety of wedge/club options be a factor?

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Might sure be be so, but I feel it has more to do with kind of grass on courses (like DaveP043 wrote) and "new school" hitting it close with enough spin to stop the ball quickly ..... Still when Phil Mickelson won the Open some years ago, he played a lot of those old school BnR shots

[DaveP043]

  On 5/1/2018 at 3:53 PM, Vinny Cap said:

" Could today's wedges and variety of wedge/club options be a factor?  "

Yes for sure.  With wedge options from 45* to 64*, many options on bounce from 0 - 20+ and now custom grinds... it's like night and day.

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I think clubs and grooves are definitely a factor, as well as the ability to mow fairways really tight.  At the AT&T at Congressional a few years ago, I watched Rory Sabbatini walk towards the short-game green, drop 4 balls on "fairway", and hit each one to about 3 feet, low, 2 bounce, and stop dead.  No practice, no warm-up, just perfect shots.  If you can do that, why take the chances of funny bounces that a bump and run require?

  On 5/1/2018 at 3:55 PM, Gerald said:

Might sure be be so, but I feel it has more to do with kind of grass on courses (like DaveP043 wrote) and "new school" hitting it close with enough spin to stop the ball quickly ..... Still when Phil Mickelson won the Open some years ago, he played a lot of those old school BnR shots

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I just don't believe that spin is as reliable in stopping a pitch shot in those conditions as is on most golf courses in the US.  If a player can't spin the ball to a stop, he has to learn how to hit a shot to roll it to a stop.

Edited May 1, 2018 by DaveP043

[NM Golf]

Most of the time on anything right at 50 yards I will use a 60° wedge. If at all possible I want any shot I hit to land on the green. The more times a ball bounces on fairway or rough length grass the better chance it has to take a weird hop. I have a much better idea of what a ball will do, how it will react, once it lands on the green. As I get closer to the green and if I have enough green to play with I will hit lower lofted clubs, but with the mindset I want that first hop to be on the green. To hamstring myself by trying to use one club for anything inside 50 yards is ridiculous, so many different lies, different shots, landing areas, etc. 

[Vinny Cap]

  On 5/1/2018 at 3:55 PM, Gerald said:

Might sure be be so, but I feel it has more to do with kind of grass on courses (like DaveP043 wrote) and "new school" hitting it close with enough spin to stop the ball quickly ..... Still when Phil Mickelson won the Open some years ago, he played a lot of those old school BnR shots

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  On 5/1/2018 at 4:05 PM, DaveP043 said:

I think clubs and grooves are definitely a factor, as well as the ability to mow fairways really tight.  At the AT&T at Congressional a few years ago, I watched Rory Sabbatini walk towards the short-game green, drop 4 balls on "fairway", and hit each one to about 3 feet, low, 2 bounce, and stop dead.  No practice, no warm-up, just perfect shots.  If you can do that, why take the chances of funny bounces that a bump and run require?

I just don't believe that spin is as reliable in stopping a pitch shot in those conditions as is on most golf courses in the US.  If a player can't spin the ball to a stop, he has to learn how to hit a shot to roll it to a stop.

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Here are more factors, the grass and how tight they can mow it.

I have played some really nice courses where you can putt from 20 yards off the green and get a good roll to the hole.

Watch some old replays from the Masters or other courses and look at how much different the fairways and greens are.

 

[ncates00]

  On 5/1/2018 at 3:47 PM, Elmer said:

Of course I wonder why the pros of today are better at chipping than bump & run? Maybe it should be phrased as "less skilled at bump & run".
Could today's wedges and variety of wedge/club options be a factor?

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Today's guys are just as skilled at BnR or the standard pitch or the flop or the low traj/high spin pitch.  These guys are better than yester year's players at all aspects of the game- short game included.

Today's equipment, including launch monitors and cameras, has a lot to do with it, but they're just better for all the reasons that we have talked about in other threads, such as "Tiger vs. Jack" and how all athletes across the board are better than ever.

 

This topic is getting very weird.  Some of us are referring to pitch shots around 50 yards, while others are referring to shots around 20 yards.  I think everyone would agree that what shot to play is determined by what you have in front of you and what the hole dictates.  For a short 20 yard shot, given no obstacles, we may play a BnR to get it running like a putt.  But you won't see many guys hitting BnR shots 50 yards off the green unless it's at St. Andrews or under a tree.  For the most part on smaller, faster greens, you see most guys hit standard pitch shots that LAND ON THE GREEN.  That controls your ball- you should know your carry numbers with your wedges and estimate the rollout.  That's why you see guys take a look at the contours of the green to see what kind of roll (if any) they will get.  Bump and run just leaves too much uncertainty and luck involved.

  On 5/1/2018 at 3:55 PM, Gerald said:

Still when Phil Mickelson won the Open some years ago, he played a lot of those old school BnR shots

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That's because that's what the course/particular hole dictated.  Phil, and most good players on the whole, do not default to a BnR from 50 yards away.  

  On 5/1/2018 at 4:30 PM, NM Golf said:

Most of the time on anything right at 50 yards I will use a 60° wedge. If at all possible I want any shot I hit to land on the green. The more times a ball bounces on fairway or rough length grass the better chance it has to take a weird hop. I have a much better idea of what a ball will do, how it will react, once it lands on the green. As I get closer to the green and if I have enough green to play with I will hit lower lofted clubs, but with the mindset I want that first hop to be on the green. To hamstring myself by trying to use one club for anything inside 50 yards is ridiculous, so many different lies, different shots, landing areas, etc. 

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This is basically what I've been trying to say.

[MGN]

  On 5/1/2018 at 7:51 AM, Gerald said:

Whenever I am within 50 yds from the hole .... I basicly use one single magic club if there are no hazards between me and the flag.

Whenever possible I play a low risk, high percentage up and down shot ..... it is my little secret for a low score on most holes.

Bump and run towards the flag.

My favo bump and run club is my 8 iron ..... what is yours ?

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I use a 7/8/9 depending on how much 'run' I want.   However,  if I have a clear shot, I'll use my 56/14 SW to float it to the flag with a small run; I personally feel that I can repeat this shot predictably compared to the bump and run from 50 yds out.

[GolfLug]

Unless limited by a low hanging branch I usually use my 56. Once I start actually thinking about my short game with a modicum of care I will experiment with other clubs. 

[JonMA1]

I also prefer a higher ball flight and less rollout at almost any distance beyond a few yards from the green. I can't get a ball to stop dead, nor can I normally expect a shot from 50 yards to stop within a one putt. I just feel better about getting it to and keeping it on the green with this type of shot.

That said, being able to control a bump and run would be a nice skill to have.