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Cantankerish

The Cure for Remembering the Time I...

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There is this one hole on my home course.  It is a short par 4 with a tree-lined 90 degree dogleg left.  The actual distance from the tee to the hole is about 230 yards, but you can't actually go for it due to the trees and then the water on the other side of them.  Just, no.  The proper way to play the hole is two 9-irons or something like that.  It's really quite easy to par this hole.

The first time I took my nephew there, he could not resist the temptation.  He went for it, somehow lifted the ball barely over the trees and landed his tee stroke on the green.  The next bunch of times we played the course, he went for this shot again, always failing miserably. So he would get a 6 or 7 on what is certainly the easiest par 4 on the course, until he finally figured it out.

Thing is, I have done this too.  Not as obviously.  But I tend to remember that time I nutted the 3-wood and cleared the bunker to be on in 2 or when I punched through the trees to roll it up onto the green.  I think the worst thing that can happen to me is to succeed at a low percentage shot the first time I play a course. I even find myself trying to recruit cart-mates to be my caddie with requests like "remind me that I'm stupid if you see this club in my hand for the second shot" or "don't ever let me do that again", like a drunk pleading with the bartender.

Calmly typing here, I can see perfectly well the hindsight that informs me that, no, I did not have command of that shot.  But at the time, it really does seem reasonable. Someone please chime in with a similar story or advice or something.  I think I need a digital shoulder to cry on.

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9 minutes ago, Cantankerish said:

There is this one hole on my home course.  It is a short par 4 with a tree-lined 90 degree dogleg left.  The actual distance from the tee to the hole is about 230 yards, but you can't actually go for it due to the trees and then the water on the other side of them.  Just, no.  The proper way to play the hole is two 9-irons or something like that.  It's really quite easy to par this hole.

The first time I took my nephew there, he could not resist the temptation.  He went for it, somehow lifted the ball barely over the trees and landed his tee stroke on the green.  The next bunch of times we played the course, he went for this shot again, always failing miserably. So he would get a 6 or 7 on what is certainly the easiest par 4 on the course, until he finally figured it out.

Thing is, I have done this too.  Not as obviously.  But I tend to remember that time I nutted the 3-wood and cleared the bunker to be on in 2 or when I punched through the trees to roll it up onto the green.  I think the worst thing that can happen to me is to succeed at a low percentage shot the first time I play a course. I even find myself trying to recruit cart-mates to be my caddie with requests like "remind me that I'm stupid if you see this club in my hand for the second shot" or "don't ever let me do that again", like a drunk pleading with the bartender.

Calmly typing here, I can see perfectly well the hindsight that informs me that, no, I did not have command of that shot.  But at the time, it really does seem reasonable. Someone please chime in with a similar story or advice or something.  I think I need a digital shoulder to cry on.

Save that "carry the corner and the trees" crap for scrambles.  ☺️  Understand your odds like a seasoned Las Vegas bookie.

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9 hours ago, Cantankerish said:

There is this one hole on my home course.  It is a short par 4 with a tree-lined 90 degree dogleg left.  The actual distance from the tee to the hole is about 230 yards, but you can't actually go for it due to the trees and then the water on the other side of them.  Just, no.  The proper way to play the hole is two 9-irons or something like that.  It's really quite easy to par this hole.

The first time I took my nephew there, he could not resist the temptation.  He went for it, somehow lifted the ball barely over the trees and landed his tee stroke on the green.  The next bunch of times we played the course, he went for this shot again, always failing miserably. So he would get a 6 or 7 on what is certainly the easiest par 4 on the course, until he finally figured it out.

Thing is, I have done this too.  Not as obviously.  But I tend to remember that time I nutted the 3-wood and cleared the bunker to be on in 2 or when I punched through the trees to roll it up onto the green.  I think the worst thing that can happen to me is to succeed at a low percentage shot the first time I play a course. I even find myself trying to recruit cart-mates to be my caddie with requests like "remind me that I'm stupid if you see this club in my hand for the second shot" or "don't ever let me do that again", like a drunk pleading with the bartender.

Calmly typing here, I can see perfectly well the hindsight that informs me that, no, I did not have command of that shot.  But at the time, it really does seem reasonable. Someone please chime in with a similar story or advice or something.  I think I need a digital shoulder to cry on.

It’d be nice to go on Google Earth and show us an aerial of this hole.😁

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As you wish.

thirteenth.thumb.jpg.e363145cca4a5b389b3b375c47277072.jpg

That's the 13th at Southwinds in West Boca Raton.  Each of those white chords is about 150 yards.  Every once in a blue moon, they will have the tees far enough back that you are actually behind the tree line (you have to play this course from the back tees to feel the design).  On that occasion, you can pull out the 3-wood or something and really go for it, but that sorta nerfs the hole.  Also, you can see that final tree is huge  The others are a mass of tall areca palms.  But that last one is a white oak or something.  It gets in your way if you mishit the tee stroke.  Beyond that the hole is a cake walk.

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2 hours ago, Cantankerish said:

As you wish.

thirteenth.thumb.jpg.e363145cca4a5b389b3b375c47277072.jpg

That's the 13th at Southwinds in West Boca Raton.  Each of those white chords is about 150 yards.  Every once in a blue moon, they will have the tees far enough back that you are actually behind the tree line (you have to play this course from the back tees to feel the design).  On that occasion, you can pull out the 3-wood or something and really go for it, but that sorta nerfs the hole.  Also, you can see that final tree is huge  The others are a mass of tall areca palms.  But that last one is a white oak or something.  It gets in your way if you mishit the tee stroke.  Beyond that the hole is a cake walk.

Boy that is tempting. Being a lefty I’d be very tempted to hit a cut down there close. Especially with the high chance of shanking an iron into that tree line off the tee which of course would peel some bark off and head straight to the water.

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You do get two club lengths to go back and stay in the teeing area… By my measurements, it's < 210 yards to cover the water, and 80 yards wide. I'd be really tempted to cut a 3W every time. Forget going over - go around. And if you really, really cut it, it'll fly shorter but cut more, and probably be safe again.

Screen Shot 2019-12-05 at 9.48.32 AM.png

It's as little as about 180 if you don't take an angle toward the back of the green.

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Oh, you guys...

I started the thread to get advice to prevent me from doing exactly this. In fact, you guys are discussing the extreme example I gave as an obviously bad plan as if it were tempting.

 

But yeah, it is great when the tees are far enough back, they just rarely are.

...you damned devils on my shoulder.

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2 hours ago, Vinsk said:

Boy that is tempting. Being a lefty I’d be very tempted to hit a cut down there close. Especially with the high chance of shanking an iron into that tree line off the tee which of course would peel some bark off and head straight to the water.

You could play your stock draw and go right around the trees as @iacas showed.

If you shank it you're f***ed anyway even if you were laying up.

11 minutes ago, Cantankerish said:

In fact, you guys are discussing the extreme example I gave as an obviously bad plan as if it were tempting.

Clearly the mistake you made was in shot selection and trying to hit over the trees instead of trying to hit around them.

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16 minutes ago, billchao said:

You could play your stock draw and go right around the trees as @iacas showed.

Damn....good call. Sorry @Cantankerish...I’m pulling that trigger...

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22 minutes ago, Vinsk said:

Damn....good call. Sorry @Cantankerish...I’m pulling that trigger...

LOL.  But...the trees.  The water.

39 minutes ago, billchao said:

Clearly the mistake you made was in shot selection and trying to hit over the trees instead of trying to hit around them.

Not me, sir.  It's 9-iron for me on this hole.

 

I do not think I am going to convince any of you to play it safe on that hole...even in a thread created to get advice from the likes of you to help me play it safe.

Friggin' bassackwards charlatans.

Oh well.  I guess there is always my cart mates.

Or the bartender.

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46 minutes ago, Cantankerish said:

I do not think I am going to convince any of you to play it safe on that hole...even in a thread created to get advice from the likes of you to help me play it safe.

At 210 to clear the water it's basically a long par 3 that requires a specific shot shape.

48 minutes ago, Cantankerish said:

Friggin' bassackwards charlatans.

That's just @Vinsk. Damn lefties 😜

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I hit easy a high fade/slice with my driver. I will go for it everytime, aiming at the front of the green. If i miss left i will be on the green or green side bunker. If i miss rigth i will be on the fairway. All of them birdie oportunities, that´s better than an easy par from the fairway corner. 

It´s a win/win going for it for me. 
 

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My local course has a couple similar holes.  Good golfers might be able to go at the green, but I have to hit a couple irons to get there. The first one pictured has elevated tees and a good player can clear the trees, but you have to worry about going long into the woods and creek around the green. The second one has a significant rise (100 ft?) from the tee and tee shot landing area to the green.

BBC2.thumb.JPG.0db7e1686c543a3e15fd1547666e8913.JPG

BBC15.thumb.JPG.3e848476310f5dea37ac54600647662c.JPG

 

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This is hole 4 of the local short course. Par 71 but only 5000 yards from the whites (maybe 5300 from the blues which I should play far more but don't). Whites are at the front of the rear tees, right where I put the marker. Blues are at the back of that same box.

This is a par 4. With an average drive total distance of 220-230 yards, it looks obvious and should be a birdie, par at worst. Take driver at the green. If I catch it good, I could be on. If I don't, I will be no more than 40 yards from the front of the green. The problem with this hole comes from the creek that runs through it, and the slope of the hole. From the tee, it it fairly flat until you get over the creek, then it starts sloping hard right to left somewhere around the 550ft mark on this overhead. Also, it is probably 20 ft uphill within the last 60 yards. The fairway narrows heavily at my normal driver distance. Anything in the left rough is going into the creek, and as you can see (even from a junk satellite image) the bunkers on the right pool water. Even if you avoid the bunkers right, the woods are thick enough that you will lose the ball if you go that far right. If you manage to go right, avoid the bunkers, and find your ball, the green will be sloping away from you and you will have a significant downhill lie as the cart path sits above the green by 5 feet.

I think what I am supposed to do is hit a 5, or more likely, 6 iron to somewhere shy of the the upper bridge over the creek, hopefully middle to middle right fairway. From there, it is a 9 iron, PW, or 53 degree in depending on strike quality of the mid iron. Fairway there is decently wide, and no hard slope compared to green side. Almost certainly a par/bogey for me if I take this route, which I am fine with at my skill level. But......

I cannot bring myself to take anything other than driver on this hole. Out of the 20 or so times I played this course this year I have 1 birdie, 3 pars, 5 bogeys, and the rest doubles or worse (yes, a 7, 8 or even 9 on a 240 yard hole is well within my capabilities if I hit an errant drive right that causes a provisional (and an almost certainly lost ball off the tee). I honestly don't know what it will take for me to stop doing this. I have shot even par on the back nine of this course, but my best on the front is +5, which is the par 35 half.

hole 4.png

Edited by Bonvivant

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45 minutes ago, Bonvivant said:

This is hole 4 of the local short course. Par 71 but only 5000 yards from the whites (maybe 5300 from the blues which I should play far more but don't). Whites are at the front of the rear tees, right where I put the marker. Blues are at the back of that same box.

This is a par 4. With an average drive total distance of 220-230 yards, it looks obvious and should be a birdie, par at worst. Take driver at the green. If I catch it good, I could be on. If I don't, I will be no more than 40 yards from the front of the green. The problem with this hole comes from the creek that runs through it, and the slope of the hole. From the tee, it it fairly flat until you get over the creek, then it starts sloping hard right to left somewhere around the 550ft mark on this overhead. Also, it is probably 20 ft uphill within the last 60 yards. The fairway narrows heavily at my normal driver distance. Anything in the left rough is going into the creek, and as you can see (even from a junk satellite image) the bunkers on the right pool water. Even if you avoid the bunkers right, the woods are thick enough that you will lose the ball if you go that far right. If you manage to go right, avoid the bunkers, and find your ball, the green will be sloping away from you and you will have a significant downhill lie as the cart path sits above the green by 5 feet.

I think what I am supposed to do is hit a 5, or more likely, 6 iron to somewhere shy of the the upper bridge over the creek, hopefully middle to middle right fairway. From there, it is a 9 iron, PW, or 53 degree in depending on strike quality of the mid iron. Fairway there is decently wide, and no hard slope compared to green side. Almost certainly a par/bogey for me if I take this route, which I am fine with at my skill level. But......

I cannot bring myself to take anything other than driver on this hole. Out of the 20 or so times I played this course this year I have 1 birdie, 3 pars, 5 bogeys, and the rest doubles or worse (yes, a 7, 8 or even 9 on a 240 yard hole is well within my capabilities if I hit an errant drive right that causes a provisional (and an almost certainly lost ball off the tee). I honestly don't know what it will take for me to stop doing this. I have shot even par on the back nine of this course, but my best on the front is +5, which is the par 35 half.

hole 4.png

I've played this same hole more times than I can count.

Each time I hit the tee box it's all about my confidence in my driver, which can be very shaky.

If the driver is on the outs, I'll hit the 5W dead at the closer bunker on the right. It'll probably be short, but otherwise it'll hook in. Then it's just a pitch shot onto a long but narrower-than-the-photo looks green.

Missing big with the driver is what puts a big number up here.

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Finally!

This is the sort of thing I made the thread for.

Bonvivant, this is a sneaky hole. I think I like mcanadiens plan.  The landing zone about 100 feet shy of the center of the green looks good.  Are you confident in your 200 yard club?

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1 hour ago, Cantankerish said:

Finally!

This is the sort of thing I made the thread for.

Bonvivant, this is a sneaky hole. I think I like mcanadiens plan.  The landing zone about 100 feet shy of the center of the green looks good.  Are you confident in your 200 yard club?

The one time I didnt take driver on this hile was the last time i played. Played my 19 degree hybrid. Hit it fat and left. Right behind the first big tree on the left. No chance at all. To be fair, the club is new and it was like my 5th shot ever with it, but it resulted in a 6 on the hole. Season is pretty much over now but I am going to have to mess with this hole next year and try some things out

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