Reading greens?

[LeftyTrevor]

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeftyTrevor

I usually just can imagine a line going from my ball to the hole and try to start it out on that line.

This is great - visualizing the shot is always good, I believe.  However, this is something that occurs AFTER the actual reading of the green.  How do you determine that line?

After thinking about it some I realize that I do a bit more. I guess I do take the sand traps, contour of the green, and drainage into account as well. I have been doing it so long that it's just second nature to have a feel for the break and visualize a line. I will add one other thing. You should be properly fit for a putter. I have learned that everybody sees straight a little different. I was fit for an Edel putter. During the fitting I lined up with my old putter and was completely blown away by the difference in my perception vs what was actually straight. It has made a difference in my game. I recommend them to everyone.

[dave s]

Pikapp23 hit on some good points.  MOST of the time, people don't see the big picture when reading a putt.  The big picture (to me) is looking left and right of you a LONG way when behind a putt.  Is the 'lay of the land' sloping one way or the other?  Is what is 200-400 yards in front of you going up or downhill?  This is useful to me when I see very little break. What my eyes see in the 'big picture'' usually happens on the green.

Another idea:  On putts longer than 15', I walk up and look for the spot at which the ball is going to go straight into the hole.  It could be anywhere from a foot from the hole, or as far as 10' from the hole on a  putt of 30' or longer.  That's usually the target area to roll the ball over for me.  I've been working with this strategy last 2 seasons and I seem to be reading putts much more accurately.  Not to say I make that many more, but I have made more this year and I ever have using this method of reading a green.  At the end of the day, it's more about correct speed than anything else.  Perfect line and not enough speed means leaving them right in the heart of the hole 6" short!

dave

[Club Rat]

I'll survey the green as I'm approaching, mainly looking for the direction/slope the green sheds water.

I then will glance at the area between the hole and my ball as I walk to mark my ball.

I'll pay close attention to others if they are putting in the same direction to see how their ball rolls when it's near the hole.

I usually only read my putts from behind my ball and read the break going to the hole.

If the area is very flat around the hole and difficult to determine if there is break, then I sometimes circle the entire hole.

Also I pay attention to the color and grain as others have mentioned.

Many great tips mentioned in previous posts.

But hey, this is TST.

Great thread guys.

Club Rat

[billchao]

MOST of the time, people don't see the big picture when reading a putt.  The big picture (to me) is looking left and right of you a LONG way when behind a putt.  Is the 'lay of the land' sloping one way or the other?  Is what is 200-400 yards in front of you going up or downhill?  This is useful to me when I see very little break. What my eyes see in the 'big picture'' usually happens on the green.

I'm pretty sure that whatever is going on in the world some hundreds of yards away from me has little to do with how my putt will break. If I were a golf course architect, I'd build all my greens sloping away from bodies of water and towards mountains just to mess with people.

[MS256]

I'm pretty sure that whatever is going on in the world some hundreds of yards away from me has little to do with how my putt will break. If I were a golf course architect, I'd build all my greens sloping away from bodies of water and towards mountains just to mess with people.

We've got one sloping away from a pond and toward a hill. Almost everybody (that hasn't played it before) misses it. Not much break but just enough so a 10 footer started close to center can lip out and leave them shaking their head.

[LeftyTrevor]

Quote:

Originally Posted by billchao

I'm pretty sure that whatever is going on in the world some hundreds of yards away from me has little to do with how my putt will break. If I were a golf course architect, I'd build all my greens sloping away from bodies of water and towards mountains just to mess with people.

We've got one sloping away from a pond and toward a hill. Almost everybody (that hasn't played it before) misses it. Not much break but just enough so a 10 footer started close to center can lip out and leave them shaking their head.

Something a few hundred thousand miles away controls the movement of the entire ocean. Given enough mass something a hundred yards away can definitely control the movement of a golf ball. Gravity is a booger.

[LeftyTrevor]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dave s

MOST of the time, people don't see the big picture when reading a putt.  The big picture (to me) is looking left and right of you a LONG way when behind a putt.  Is the 'lay of the land' sloping one way or the other?  Is what is 200-400 yards in front of you going up or downhill?  This is useful to me when I see very little break. What my eyes see in the 'big picture'' usually happens on the green.

I'm pretty sure that whatever is going on in the world some hundreds of yards away from me has little to do with how my putt will break. If I were a golf course architect, I'd build all my greens sloping away from bodies of water and towards mountains just to mess with people.

I meant to quote this comment.

[saevel25]

Something a few hundred thousand miles away controls the movement of the entire ocean. Given enough mass something a hundred yards away can definitely control the movement of a golf ball. Gravity is a booger.

That is only because the oceans are liquid and have cohesion. Think of it this way, you can sit a ball on a flat surface and it will not move because of the moon or sun. So what makes you think the ball will be affected by moon or sun when it is rolling on a green.

[natureboy]

Among the many errors in my game one used to be trying to read the break from too close to the ball. If I was on top of the ball - even if crouching - I underestimated the slope quite a bit. This was particularly true for some reason on downslopes.

If possible, I now back up so my eyes are as close to ball level as possible when I crouch down (elevated greens help) so I can see subtle slopes better.

[iacas]

Among the many errors in my game one used to be trying to read the break from too close to the ball. If I was on top of the ball - even if crouching - I underestimated the slope quite a bit. This was particularly true for some reason on downslopes.

If possible, I now back up so my eyes are as close to ball level as possible when I crouch down (elevated greens help) so I can see subtle slopes better.

Your mistake is in continuing to use your eyes at all. Go take an AimPoint Express class.

Plus, we have them in downtown Erie all winter… :D

[Patch]

[QUOTE name="saevel25" url="/t/21375/reading-greens/36#post_1063072"]   [QUOTE name="LeftyTrevor" url="/t/21375/reading-greens/36#post_1063069"] Something a few hundred thousand miles away controls the movement of the entire ocean. Given enough mass something a hundred yards away can definitely control the movement of a golf ball. Gravity is a booger.[/QUOTE] That is only because the oceans are liquid and have cohesion. Think of it this way, you can sit a ball on a flat surface and it will not move because of the moon or sun. So what makes you think the ball will be affected by moon or sun when it is rolling on a green.  [/QUOTE] Perhaps what Lefty is saying is that gravity will cause the ball to roll to lower spot, on a path of less resistance. If the ball is on a level surface there is no lower spot for it to roll to. The moon, and sun has gravitational effect on the ocean which cause the in, and out tides because it is a liquid and movable.  Pour water on the green and it will run to lower spot because of gravity. With out gravity, what else would allow for the water, and/or the ball to run down hill?  This thread is getting deep, really deep. :beer:

[natureboy]

Your mistake is in continuing to use your eyes at all. Go take an AimPoint Express class.

Plus, we have them in downtown Erie all winter… :D

I've heard good things about the class. Do you have a pic of your indoor putting surface? If they come back to Saratoga National next year or another course nearby, I'll probably give it a try. How much do they typically run?

In the meantime, the groups behind me will probably appreciate my using my eyes instead of only trying to feel the break with my feet or 'through my eyelids' like Nuke Laloosh.

Changing my viewing distance from the ball helped my reads significantly.

The most useful technique so far is going to school on the other guy's putt if it's a similar line.

[billchao]

Perhaps what Lefty is saying is that gravity will cause the ball to roll to lower spot, on a path of less resistance. If the ball is on a level surface there is no lower spot for it to roll to. The moon, and sun has gravitational effect on the ocean which cause the in, and out tides because it is a liquid and movable.  Pour water on the green and it will run to lower spot because of gravity. With out gravity, what else would allow for the water, and/or the ball to run down hill?  This thread is getting deep, really deep. :beer:

I don't think anyone is disputing the fact that gravity is what causes a ball to roll down a slope. The point is, large objects in the distance do not have enough gravitational force to affect your putt. The largest object that exerts the most pull on your golf ball is right below your feet. People can say water will drain into the ocean because it is a lower point all they want, but it doesn't mean all things will suck into the it like a great vortex. You can build a green that slopes away from the ocean and the putt will break away from it.

[Abu3baid]

The most useful technique so far is going to school on the other guy's putt if it's a similar line.

I think the only thing someone elses putt will do for me is confirm my read (even though I'm almost 99% sure of it when I make it now)..   At no point will seeing his putt give me the line I need to hit to sink the putt though..

[saevel25]

.

The most useful technique so far is going to school on the other guy's putt if it's a similar line.

A very bad habit to do. Unless the person is right near your ball mark it isn't something I would do. Even if a guy is directly behind me, I still have no clue if he pushed or pulled the putt, or how hard he hit it. The guy could bash his putt and get lucky to have it fall in. Then you'd think the putt is straighter than it is. Too many variables added in.

[inthehole]

Reading greens is an art IMHO.    I'm only now starting to get a fairly decent feel for it.     For putts under 10-12' or so (where it wont delay play), I've been walking around the back side & having a look, before I walk back to the ball, keeping an eye on the slope as I walk.    Before I address the ball, I take a step back and survey the general slope of the entire green in the vicinity of the hole (sometimes have to look wide right or left, or even well beyond), to get a general feel for the slope.    It's helped alot this year.

One thing I devised is when I'm looking down a putt, I envision rolling a golf ball underhand & trying to predict what it will do on it's way to the hole - that helps me as well.

[Golfingdad]

Reading greens is an art IMHO.

It doesn't have to be.  Learn Aimpoint and you take all guesswork and "art" out of the equation.  You also get to take your eyes out of the equation.  (Mostly)  I will still, if unsure, look around the green for some obvious runoff points, but otherwise, it's all done with the feet and the charts.  Nothing artsy about that.

[iacas]

Reading greens is an art IMHO.    I'm only now starting to get a fairly decent feel for it.     For putts under 10-12' or so (where it wont delay play), I've been walking around the back side & having a look, before I walk back to the ball, keeping an eye on the slope as I walk.    Before I address the ball, I take a step back and survey the general slope of the entire green in the vicinity of the hole (sometimes have to look wide right or left, or even well beyond), to get a general feel for the slope.    It's helped alot this year.

Listen to what @Golfingdad said.