Is Distance Really That Important for Amateurs?

[iacas]

That's possible, but he certainly was giving it 100%, well beyond the effortless looking swing that most pros have.

It's also possible he was trying to impress the pro and doesn't normally swing that hard.

But it was clear to me that he would benefit from easing back a touch and focusing a bit more on control rather than distance.

Not really the topic here @Somerset Simon .

For the umpteenth time, specific examples are not relevant here, whether they support or don't support the positions of anyone.

[inthehole]

Quote:

Originally Posted by inthehole

This was my point earlier in this thread - I see far more of these young guys that are obsessed with distance.     They have ridiculous length but no accuracy ... I haven't been paired with one yet that I haven't beat handily and I'm not even a single digit hcp (one of these days I'm sure I'll be paired with a really good player with distance AND accuracy, just haven't seen this species of golfer yet) ...

What is your definition of "these guys you haven't seen "?

Of all the young guys I've been paired with that swing out of their shoes & get it out there 30-40 yards longer than my 240-250 yd drive ... I have yet to see one control their drives.    That's all I meant ... looking forward to the day I get paired with a low hcp who gets it out there that far & actually controls it...

[saevel25]

Of all the young guys I've been paired with that swing out of their shoes & get it out there 30-40 yards longer than my 240-250 yd drive ... I have yet to see one control their drives.    That's all I meant ... looking forward to the day I get paired with a low hcp who gets it out there that far & actually controls it...

I would say you are playing with typical amateurs then. If you are hitting it 240-250 you are doing much better than the average golfer.

[inthehole]

Quote:

Originally Posted by inthehole

Of all the young guys I've been paired with that swing out of their shoes & get it out there 30-40 yards longer than my 240-250 yd drive ... I have yet to see one control their drives.    That's all I meant ... looking forward to the day I get paired with a low hcp who gets it out there that far & actually controls it...

I would say you are playing with typical amateurs then. If you are hitting it 240-250 you are doing much better than the average golfer.

Thanks man ... it's really funny, I'm gradually getting more length without consciously doing anything different.   Just seems like the more seat time I get under my belt (4 yrs now), the distance gains I've seen comes with better ball striking without any additional effort.

[Jakester23]

Of all the young guys I've been paired with that swing out of their shoes & get it out there 30-40 yards longer than my 240-250 yd drive ... I have yet to see one control their drives.    That's all I meant ... looking forward to the day I get paired with a low hcp who gets it out there that far & actually controls it...

[quote name="inthehole" url="/t/78188/is-distance-really-that-important-for-amateurs/540#post_1083825"] This was my point earlier in this thread - I see far more of these young guys that are obsessed with distance.     They have ridiculous length but no accuracy ... I haven't been paired with one yet that I haven't beat handily and I'm not even a single digit hcp (one of these days I'm sure I'll be paired with a really good player with distance AND accuracy, just haven't seen this species of golfer yet) ... [/quote] I wasn't trying to be rude I was just seeing what you thought was a long hitter. I am actually the exact opposite. I've only played with/seen one guy hit the ball 250+ on average who was a bad golfer. By bad I mean 100+ for 18.

[ay33660]

My son has been a junior member at my club since he was 6 years old.

He has had lessons and/or coaching for over 10 years now.

He has only had two different coaches in that time.

Both of them have told me they are teaching the kids how to get club head speed (distance) first and then once they have club head speed they will dial them back for accuracy.

Maybe some of the teaching pros here can comment on whether or not this is a legit teaching technique for juniors.

Or maybe this is just some crazy canuck pros up here in the land with 30% lefties.

Also I know that a hockey slap shot is totally different from a golf swing but I wonder if it makes any difference that the majority of kids that are juniors at the club also play hockey. With hockey you try to shot as hard as you can but you do have to stay in balance as you are are essentially standing on top of two knife blades on ice. So while my son tries to swing out of his shoes on every drive his is also in balance most of the time.

[k-troop]

Both of them have told me they are teaching the kids how to get club head speed (distance) first and then once they have club head speed they will dial them back for accuracy. Maybe some of the teaching pros here can comment on whether or not this is a legit teaching technique for juniors.

Absolutely valid IMO. Teach kids speed while they're young. IIRC Jack Nicklaus's coach when he was a kid gave him essentially the same lesson over and over again: hit it hard.

[turtleback]

I was down at the driving range on Monday evening.

Two bays up, there was a young guy (early 20's) getting fitted for a new driver.

He obviously had some basic talent.

He had a pretty good looking swing, nicely on plane, good balance, etc.

But... he was clearly obsessed with distance.

He was absolutely lashing it, achieving 145 mph club head speed on the monitor.

He was getting good distance, probably 20 yards more than me, around 250 carry with range balls.

But half his balls were going 30-40 yards off line.

I don't know anything about his short game, but I would be willing to bet I could beat him by at least 5 shots (maybe 10) on a typical UK championship links course, despite the fact he is 20 yards longer.

This is a very good example of what I often see when I watch young players these days.

Far too many of them seem to think it is impossible to shoot good scores unless you hit the ball pro distances.

Granted, if your ambition is to be a pro, then yes, you do need to hit your driver 280+.

But at amateur level, 250-270 is plenty far enough to get a scratch handicap and compete at national level.

Focus on technique and you will naturally achieve your maximum distance with maximum accuracy and consistency.

Focus on distance and you will probably just destroy your swing.

Well, that convinces me.  Some bozo swinging out of his shoes is exactly what the pro-distance people have been advocating and your example conclusively ends the debate.

Hey, Erik, we need a good "sarcasm" emoticon.  Although I think in this case it is already apparent.

[mmoan2]

As a follow-up to this, anyone chime in:

I'm at a bit of a crossroads right now, trying to figure out how I want to improve at golf, especially with my iron play. I'm 100% in agreement that distance is very important to score well, but this got me to thinking about how to take that.

I've been playing on and off again for about 4 years, and I'm getting to the point now where I'm financially able to pursue the game of golf as diligently as I want to. I guess I don't know how far I am supposed to hit the ball . Not a guy like me, but me - 39 year-old me, 6'2, 280, with my flexibility, my muscle memory, my athletic ability, my clubs, etc. I find that when I take the advice to swing 3/4 instead of 100%, etc., I don't turn my hips and I'm pulling the ball almost as badly as if I swung 100%, just on a more consistent path and 10-15 yards shorter. I'm grappling trying to ask a complicated question, but I guess it's this:

Generally what should one work on to increase distance and maintain enough accuracy to remain serviceable? I imagine the answer is that no one would really know without really analyzing my swing, and I plan on doing Evolvr again beginning Jan. 1. I've almost told myself that I plan on trying to groove a 3/4 swing with all of my irons and just club up on shots instead of trying to go at 90-100% and risk a huge mishit. Is that a sensible plan? What about purchasing "distance" irons like TM Speedblades to give yourself a few extra yards, allowing yourself to swing "less hard" but get a bit more distance?

Thanks

[Jakester23]

As a follow-up to this, anyone chime in: I'm at a bit of a crossroads right now, trying to figure out how I want to improve at golf, especially with my iron play. I'm 100% in agreement that distance is very important to score well, but this got me to thinking about how to take that. I've been playing on and off again for about 4 years, and I'm getting to the point now where I'm financially able to pursue the game of golf as diligently as I want to. I guess I don't know how far I [U]am supposed to hit the ball[/U] . Not a guy like me, but me - 39 year-old me, 6'2, 280, with my flexibility, my muscle memory, my athletic ability, my clubs, etc. I find that when I take the advice to swing 3/4 instead of 100%, etc., I don't turn my hips and I'm pulling the ball almost as badly as if I swung 100%, just on a more consistent path and 10-15 yards shorter. I'm grappling trying to ask a complicated question, but I guess it's this: Generally what should one work on to increase distance and maintain enough accuracy to remain serviceable? I imagine the answer is that no one would really know without really analyzing my swing, and I plan on doing Evolvr again beginning Jan. 1. I've almost told myself that I plan on trying to groove a 3/4 swing with all of my irons and just club up on shots instead of trying to go at 90-100% and risk a huge mishit. Is that a sensible plan? What about purchasing "distance" irons like TM Speedblades to give yourself a few extra yards, allowing yourself to swing "less hard" but get a bit more distance? Thanks

Distance irons don't really exist. They change the loft and length to make you think your hitting it further when all your really doing is hitting a 6 iron that they stamped 7. The number on the clubs doesn't matter. I don't care if I have to hit a 8 and your hitting a 9 if we are using the same loft it's the same club.

[Lihu]

As a follow-up to this, anyone chime in:

I'm at a bit of a crossroads right now, trying to figure out how I want to improve at golf, especially with my iron play. I'm 100% in agreement that distance is very important to score well, but this got me to thinking about how to take that.

I've been playing on and off again for about 4 years, and I'm getting to the point now where I'm financially able to pursue the game of golf as diligently as I want to. I guess I don't know how far I am supposed to hit the ball. Not a guy like me, but me - 39 year-old me, 6'2, 280, with my flexibility, my muscle memory, my athletic ability, my clubs, etc. I find that when I take the advice to swing 3/4 instead of 100%, etc., I don't turn my hips and I'm pulling the ball almost as badly as if I swung 100%, just on a more consistent path and 10-15 yards shorter. I'm grappling trying to ask a complicated question, but I guess it's this:

Generally what should one work on to increase distance and maintain enough accuracy to remain serviceable? I imagine the answer is that no one would really know without really analyzing my swing, and I plan on doing Evolvr again beginning Jan. 1. I've almost told myself that I plan on trying to groove a 3/4 swing with all of my irons and just club up on shots instead of trying to go at 90-100% and risk a huge mishit. Is that a sensible plan? What about purchasing "distance" irons like TM Speedblades to give yourself a few extra yards, allowing yourself to swing "less hard" but get a bit more distance?

Thanks

I would say that if you can hit the ball 250 yards, you're really good.

13 handicaps on average have a 92-95mph drive that gets then 220-250 yards.

http://thesandtrap.com/t/64681/handicap-versus-clubhead-speed-driving-distance

Distance irons don't really exist. They change the loft and length to make you think your hitting it further when all your really doing is hitting a 6 iron that they stamped 7. The number on the clubs doesn't matter. I don't care if I have to hit a 8 and your hitting a 9 if we are using the same loft it's the same club.

I somewhat agree with what you are saying, but to me a 7i, let's say has the ability to stop on a green without a lot of roll. The RSI1 and BB 7i both do that on the simulators. Without really trying anything, I get about 6000rpm with both clubs, and get the longer distance to boot. It's like my current MP-32 4i except more spin (probably the lighter shaft).

[mvmac]

He was absolutely lashing it, achieving 145 mph club head speed on the monitor.

He was getting good distance, probably 20 yards more than me, around 250 carry with range balls.

That's not possible, I think 145 refers to the ball speed.

Focus on technique and you will naturally achieve your maximum distance with maximum accuracy and consistency.

Focus on distance and you will probably just destroy your swing.

Just to be clear, no one is advocating golfers just focus on distance.

Both of them have told me they are teaching the kids how to get club head speed (distance) first and then once they have club head speed they will dial them back for accuracy.

Maybe some of the teaching pros here can comment on whether or not this is a legit teaching technique for juniors.

Or maybe this is just some crazy canuck pros up here in the land with 30% lefties.

Obviously you want to focus on things that will help contact, accuracy and distance. There are a few studies out there that talk about how kids have a "window" of time to develop speed for various sports. Junior golfers should definitely be encouraged to develop and use speed in their games.

I'm at a bit of a crossroads right now, trying to figure out how I want to improve at golf, especially with my iron play. I'm 100% in agreement that distance is very important to score well, but this got me to thinking about how to take that.

I've been playing on and off again for about 4 years, and I'm getting to the point now where I'm financially able to pursue the game of golf as diligently as I want to. I guess I don't know how far I am supposed to hit the ball. Not a guy like me, but me - 39 year-old me, 6'2, 280, with my flexibility, my muscle memory, my athletic ability, my clubs, etc. I find that when I take the advice to swing 3/4 instead of 100%, etc., I don't turn my hips and I'm pulling the ball almost as badly as if I swung 100%, just on a more consistent path and 10-15 yards shorter. I'm grappling trying to ask a complicated question, but I guess it's this:

There really isn't a "suppose to" when it comes to distance. Maybe you're asking how hard/fast you should be swinging? I don't think it's a good idea to "gear down" on most swings, swing at about 80-90% while staying in balance. If you want to improve your iron play, work on improving your mechanics.

[GHIN0011458]

That's not possible, I think 145 refers to the ball speed.

http://www.ajc.com/news/sports/atlanta-golfer-goes-long-really-really-long/nQJQP/

That is possible..

[Pretzel]

http://www.ajc.com/news/sports/atlanta-golfer-goes-long-really-really-long/nQJQP/

That is possible..

Not for a majority of the population it isn't. I think mvmac was playing the odds there guessing that the person was not in the .01% of people on the planet who can do that, especially based on the distance that the balls were going.

Nobody who creates 145 mph of clubhead speed will be only hitting the ball with 250 yards of carry. I have a fairly pedestrian swing speed (comparatively) of 114 and I can fly it further than that with range balls.

[mvmac]

http://www.ajc.com/news/sports/atlanta-golfer-goes-long-really-really-long/nQJQP/

That is possible..

lol Let me clarify. A swing speed of 145mph with a driver will not result in a ball that goes 250 yards.

[mmoan2]

Distance irons don't really exist. They change the loft and length to make you think your hitting it further when all your really doing is hitting a 6 iron that they stamped 7. The number on the clubs doesn't matter. I don't care if I have to hit a 8 and your hitting a 9 if we are using the same loft it's the same club.

I hear you, but this seems a bit oversimplified. All of this stuff about trajectory, spin rate, face technology... I don't think if you took TM R9 irons and just changed the 5 to a 6 etc. you'd have Sldr irons. Anyway, I'm straying OT here...

[rkim291968]

Quote:

Originally Posted by GHIN0011458

http://www.ajc.com/news/sports/atlanta-golfer-goes-long-really-really-long/nQJQP/

That is possible..

lol Let me clarify. A swing speed of 145mph with a driver will not result in a ball that goes 250 yards.

Chuckle.  I'd say it will go a tad further.

Yesterday, I saw a man using his lady friend's club.   He was a beginner taking lesson from her.   Of course, he was trying to hit it for miles.   To make a long story short, he broke her club and its club head flew into the range about 70 yards.   If he had a swing speed of 145 mph, I think the club head would have gone 250 yards.  I am just saying.

[mmoan2]

lol Let me clarify. A swing speed of 145mph with a driver will not result in a ball that goes 250 yards.

It would with those used Nike balls I bought at Target for $7.99 a dozen. I thought I was hitting wads of bubble gum!