PGA Tour Caddies file class-action suit against PGA Tour for use of likeness, bibs

[deason]

I think this is ridiculous and they need to take a look at the bigger picture.

The players they work for win money invested by the sponsor!

Utter madness.

[Torres9]

No - I slammed the Christian caddies.

I'm confused by the Christian caddies comment? What does this mean?

[Lihu]

I see why they are suing. . .anyone who is required to wear something this loud should be compensated for it.

It looks like an apron from an obnoxious cooking show, or like those orange aprons that the helper people at Home Depot are forced to wear. . .

[Pretzel]

While I don't feel the caddies should be paid the $50 million they say they generate, it does seem to me like they could be paid for it. To be fair, they ate turned into what is essentially a walking billboard that stays right next to the main attraction at all times. Doors this mean they should get $2000 per weekend for it? No. Tier it based on how visible the advertising is. If it's a small logo, maybe $20/hour on the course tops, up to like $30-35 for the really gaudy ones. No need to make much more than the guy who spins the real estate sign on the street corner when that's essentially what you're being paid for, except televised instead of on the corner.

[Patch]

If they do win, I wonder if they will get paid according to TV exposure time? Missed cuts? Will Woody's caddie be paid more than Jeff Overton's caddie? Might it only apply to the top 100 pros' caddies? Lots of possible criteria to be looked at.

[9424tm]

I'm confused by the Christian caddies comment? What does this mean?

It's just someone that has a prejudice for one reason or another. Like, "Black caddies" or "Democratic/Republican caddies" or "Woman caddies". It's small minded behavior for no reason.

[tristanhilton85]

This thread isn't about whether the caddies are Christian or not. There is no mention of it in the article and the fact that some of them are or aren't isn't the topic here. Leave it out or it'll be considered off topic and deleted.

[mvmac]

This thread isn't about whether the caddies are Christian or not. There is no mention of it in the article and the fact that some of them are or aren't isn't the topic here. Leave it out or it'll be considered off topic and deleted.

Yep, let's keep it on topic please.

[dkolo]

Caddies are poorly treated by the Tour in general, though I don't think this particular case is a winner so much as a shot across the bow of the PGA to get them some improved labor concessions in the future.

[saevel25]

Caddies are poorly treated by the Tour in general, though I don't think this particular case is a winner so much as a shot across the bow of the PGA to get them some improved labor concessions in the future.

Isn't that a golfer issue? I am not sure if the caddies are unionized or if they are all organized through the PGA Tour. I always thought that caddies were basically independant contractors who sign deals with the golfer they caddie for.

Though if the PGA Tour is forcing them to wear certain advertisement, then they either have to pay them or they have to give them the option to not wear it. Unless that all organized through the golfers.

If the PGA Tour says to the golfer, hey your caddie needs to wear this. If that is a requirement to play in PGA Tour events then it is up to that caddie to negotiate that aspect with the contract they have with the golfer.

[Golfingdad]

I guess I can kind of see their position - if they're not benefitting specifically from wearing the bibs with logos on them, then why should they have to wear them?

OTOH, I think its silly for them to suggest that they actually are earning money for the tour and its sponsors.  Whatever the tour currently earns, if they eliminated caddie bibs completely, I'd be willing to bet that the PGA earnings change would be nil.

Seems like the simple solution would be to just have the caddies wear plain bibs for the sole (two) utilitarian purposes of carrying around their stuff in the kangaroo pouch and their players nameplate on the back.

[Patch]

Do a way with the caddies altogether. Make the pros carry their own bags. Do their own pre tournament routines. Figure things out on their own during a tournament. Pull/replace their own flags. That would solve this particular controversy.

[9iron]

I think this is ridiculous and they need to take a look at the bigger picture.

The players they work for win money invested by the sponsor!

Utter madness.

Exactly. If the purse is larger, then the 10% caddie take is also larger. In this context the caddies ARE already getting paid by the sponsors.

[9iron]

This is as much about the Dept. of Labor amd IRS drumming up money for themselves as it is about the caddies drumming up money. Those two organizations would like nothing more than to Unionize every possible group they can, and to force everyone to be an employee as opposed to being an Independent Contractor. They'd declare babysitters to be employees if they could. It is all about the Benjamins for them too.

[TJBam]

Seems the Christian caddies all want to be big stars too. They probably call themselves athletes.

I think a percentage of what they get ( the big name ones) is more than adequate compensation.

It is one thing to be taken advantage of and have someone profiting from your likeness if you are a famous person.

It is another thing to not understand that you are part of a big organisation and their are certain concessions you make.

Do ordinary workers complain if they have to wear a corporate logo and change it weekly to promote the organisation that is, ultimately, paying their bills?

Um,I for one am required to pay for "company" golf shirts with the logo on them.  I do so willingly.

What's this bit about the caddies complaining that the Tour doesn't give them health insurance?

I am not a lawyer but I think the closest comparison would be the pit crew in NASCAR.  Those guys wear the gear and logos, and they are "behind the scenes" players who are hand-picked by the driver and his management.  Closest comparison in sports that I can think of.

If I am the PGA Tour, I would be looking into how NASCAR handles payment, insurance, etc for the guys in the pit, and go from there with the legal counsel.  Anyone on TST familiar with the NASCAR-pit employment relationship?

E: is there a list available of caddies involved?  Any big names?

[turtleback]

Even if caddies are deemed to be employees, they will be employees of the player, not the tour.

From that perspective, wearing the bibs with the corporate logo is simply a condition of their employment.  They get compensated by continuing to be employed and by getting a paycheck.

The employer, i.e., the player, does not have the contractual freedom with the tour to have a caddie who does not wear a bib with the corporate logo.  It is required just as proper dress, and comportment is required.  If the caddie does not want to wear the bib then he cannot be a caddie.

I am sure the lawyers can and will make it a lot more complicated and it may get decided some other way, but on the issue itself it seems pretty simple and clear, to me.

[colin007]

Do a way with the caddies altogether. Make the pros carry their own bags. Do their own pre tournament routines. Figure things out on their own during a tournament. Pull/replace their own flags. That would solve this particular controversy.

i'm actually cool with that.  i would allow them to use push carts, but i would like to see that.

[Patch]

The employer, i.e., the player, does not have the contractual freedom with the tour to have a caddie who does not wear a bib with the corporate logo.  It is required just as proper dress, and comportment is required.  If the caddie does not want to wear the bib then he cannot be a caddie.

I am not so sure that is 100% correct. It may be up to the stature of the player (employer) . Some years ago Steve Williams showed up at tournament wearing shorts. That particular tournament required long pants to be worn by the caddy. After being told of the dress code, Williams refused to change into long pants, and had his employer's (Woods) permission not to do so. Eventually said if Williams couldn't wear shorts, then they would both leave the tournament. The dress code was amended at that point to allow shorts......for Williams. They did not want Woods to leave.

I think there was another incident a few decades ago where a player in the US Open (?) changed into shorts during the round.

Granted, shorts are not the same as bibs, but given enough clout, the dress code is not carved in stone.