Plumb Bobbing (Putting) Master Thread

[zipazoid]

Originally Posted by dsc123

So the idea is that the club gives you a line that is straight up and down, and then you judge whether the green to the left of the club is higher or lower than the green to the right of the club?  So a flat read would be perpendicular, and you can sort of estimate degrees from perpendicular?

Not that complicated. Just cover the ball with the shaft & look up to see whether the hole is to the left or right of the shaft. That's the way the putt will break.

[dsc123]

Originally Posted by zipazoid

Not that complicated. Just cover the ball with the shaft & look up to see whether the hole is to the left or right of the shaft. That's the way the putt will break.

Hmm, I dont get that.  As golfingdad said, doesn't that just show that your eye, the putter, the ball, and the hole, are in line?

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by dsc123

So the idea is that the club gives you a line that is straight up and down, and then you judge whether the green to the left of the club is higher or lower than the green to the right of the club?  So a flat read would be perpendicular, and you can sort of estimate degrees from perpendicular?

If you were able to hold the club at a perfectly horizontal angle, then this might make sense to me.  Obviously, that isn't feasible (unless someone invents a putter that has a level bubble in the shaft), so that couldn't help you.

When you are holding it vertically, even if you are 100% sure that it is 90* vertical, you are still guesstimating the horizontal angle in relation to the putter shaft.

Zip is right though ... it harms no one and if it gives you more confidence, so it "works" in that sense.  Confidence is powerful!

Reminds me something Crash Davis once said ... "A player on a streak should respect the streak.  You know why?  Because they don't happen very often.  If you believe you're playing well because you're getting laid, or because you're not getting laid, or because you wear women's underwear, then you are!"

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by dsc123

Hmm, I dont get that.  As golfingdad said, doesn't that just show that your eye, the putter, the ball, and the hole, are in line?

Exactly.  You can manipulate that reading by every teeny little eye movement, and never will the break actually change.

In fact, I could come through while you are plumb-bobbing (as long as you are patient and the greenskeepers are otherwise busy) and dig a giant 10' deep hole from one inch in front of your ball to one inch short of the hole and your read still won't change.

But, again, it gives you confidence, so more power to you.

[iacas]

Originally Posted by broomhandle

Setting aside the authoritative bluster in several posts these are the REAL problems in spite of the basic principle being perfectly sound.

It's not perfectly sound at all. Plumb bobbing does nothing but provide a vertical reference point.

I'd ask you to prove it (in a scientific sense), but you can't.

Originally Posted by Ernest Jones

If authoritative bluster is not to your tastes, you may have chosen the wrong place to hang out.

And if you tend to see facts and those who share them in an attempt to help golfers with their games as "authoritative bluster" then good luck to you.

Originally Posted by zipazoid

Then why do some pros do it?

Very few do, but for those who do, what do you want me to say? That some of them are idiots too? Perhaps they're using the shaft as a vertical reference point. Because, again, that's all plumb bobbing can do (and even then the shaft has to be oriented so that it's actually vertical).

Originally Posted by zipazoid

I plumb-bob if I can't get a good read otherwise. Sometimes I use it to just make up my mind; for example, if I think the putt breaks left I'll bob it to confirm.

That's the key, though - you think it breaks left so you set up so the plumb bob confirms it. The plumb bob can't actually tell you anything.

Originally Posted by zipazoid

I get you think it's worthless, but if a player thinks it isn't, what's the harm in it? Golfers have a lot of habits that would appear worthless. In my case it takes out uncertainty - if the bob says it goes left then I feel more confident in my read. That's not a bad thing.

That doesn't mean plumb bobbing itself works, and that's not the argument being made. If someone said "the side of my mouth my gum happens to be on is the way the putt will break" was their method and it "instilled confidence" then great, go for it.

But that's just hocus pocus. Maybe it's just me, but I don't understand someone gaining confidence from something that flat out doesn't work and makes absolutely no sense.

Originally Posted by dsc123

So the idea is that the club gives you a line that is straight up and down, and then you judge whether the green to the left of the club is higher or lower than the green to the right of the club?  So a flat read would be perpendicular, and you can sort of estimate degrees from perpendicular?

That's the ONLY thing plumb bobbing can do. Yet you'll hear people tell you "the hole will appear on one side or the other." It does not.

Originally Posted by zipazoid

Not that complicated. Just cover the ball with the shaft & look up to see whether the hole is to the left or right of the shaft. That's the way the putt will break.

Yeah, then take a step six inches to the left or right. Cover the ball with the shaft and the ball will be on the other side of the shaft. OH NOES IT BREAKS THE OTHER WAY!!!

Plumb bobbing is entirely dependent on where you're standing!!! A straight line up through the ball will make the hole appear to the left if you're slightly to the left of the ball-hole line and slightly to the right if you're to the right of the ball-hole line.

That's it. Stand on the wrong side of the ball by an inch or two and you get the wrong "read."

So plumb bobbing relies on the probability of you standing slightly to the side of the ball-hole line, kind of along your "aim line" for the putt. If a putt breaks subtly to the left, plumb bobbing relies on the probability that you'll stand slightly to the left of your ball so the hole appears to the left of the putter shaft.

That's it. It's bogus. If you have a left-breaking putt and you stand slightly to the right the hole will appear on the other side of the shaft. And if you stand directly on that line (with your dominant eye), then the shaft will line up with the ball and the hole. Period. 100%. Every time.

[Fourputt]

Originally Posted by zipazoid

Then why do some pros do it?

I plumb-bob if I can't get a good read otherwise. Sometimes I use it to just make up my mind; for example, if I think the putt breaks left I'll bob it to confirm.

I get you think it's worthless, but if a player thinks it isn't, what's the harm in it? Golfers have a lot of habits that would appear worthless. In my case it takes out uncertainty - if the bob says it goes left then I feel more confident in my read. That's not a bad thing.

It's just another way to waste time on the green, where too many weekend golfers waste too much time already.  Most golfers have too many pace killing habits as it is, so I see no reason to encourage anyone to pick up yet another one.

[Phil McGleno]

So did this thread die when it got merged or what? Plumb bobbing is plumb crazy.

[sean_miller]

Originally Posted by Phil McGleno

So did this thread die when it got merged or what?

Plumb bobbing is plumb crazy.

I sure don't have any interest in posting in merged threads, and I post a lot, so you could be on to something.

[mvmac]

Does plum bobbing tell me where Lake Merced is?

[iacas]

Originally Posted by mvmac

Does plum bobbing tell me where Lake Merced is?

Yes. But only if you already know where Lake Merced is.

[Golfingdad]

Originally Posted by mvmac

Does plum bobbing tell me where Lake Merced is?

Originally Posted by iacas

Yes. But only if you already know where Lake Merced is.

I thought that was a game you played at Halloween parties??

[Papa Steve 55]

Why is it, whenever I ask a guy that plumbs his putts, what he is looking for, they can never explain it? You see them holding the putter like this / , what the heck is that telling them?

[iacas]

4 minutes ago, Papa Steve 55 said:

what the heck is that telling them?

Nothing.

Plumb bobbing makes almost no sense. The only sense it can make is to provide a "vertical" line, but even then, people often goof that up as you noted.

[MrGolfguy67]

It supposedly will show you which side of the hole is higher thus telling you which way the putt will break.

[Shindig]

3 hours ago, Papa Steve 55 said:

Why is it, whenever I ask a guy that plumbs his putts, what he is looking for, they can never explain it? You see them holding the putter like this / , what the heck is that telling them?

It's telling them that sooner or later, they're going to have to hit their putt.  And if they're like the people I know who plumb bob, it's more later than sooner. 

[iacas]

1 hour ago, MrGolfguy67 said:

It supposedly will show you which side of the hole is higher thus telling you which way the putt will break.

It doesn't, though.

The hole is supposed to appear on one side of the shaft or another… which makes no sense, because you an stand slightly left or right and get the hole to appear on both sides, or directly under the shaft to say "straight."

[Papa Steve 55]

7 hours ago, Shindig said:

It's telling them that sooner or later, they're going to have to hit their putt.  And if they're like the people I know who plumb bob, it's more later than sooner. 

Yeah, I think you hit the nail on the head. Its a delaying mechanism the golfer uses hoping the break will magically appear. That, along with tamping down the invisible spike marks that knocked the ball 12 inches off line.   

[Patch]

Some folks swear by it, others don't. It's the old chicken or the egg scenario. I've tried it because some the pros do it. Never seen any advantage to using it. Just figured I was doing it wrong by not seeing what ever the association is between the hanging shaft and the surface of the green. 

Me, I am one of those who sometimes looks at the plastic insert in the hole. I look for any difference  between the top of the insert, and the top of the hole. Even that can be considered iffy by some.

Other times I like to look at my putt from the other side of the hole. This seems to work best for me. 

I say what ever gives you confidence in your putting, do it.