Higher Handicap Because of Terrible Putting

[rkim291968]

@RandallT ting my numbers in the spreadsheet.  I don't mind sharing the number.  Today, I had 31 putts, no 3 putts, and 5 one putts.  I started out poorly without  putting practice before the round - missed 3 straight short putts from holes #1 - #3.  This round's putting is slightly out of norm in that I normally have one to two 3-putts, and make more short & medium putts.   I've rounded up all numbers to next "foot."   Used my laser range finder to measure anything longer than 21 feet.  Shorter than 21 feet, I had to walk to measure (one large step = 3 feet).

Hole 1st putt 2nd putt

1 - 6 feet -> 1 feet -> hole

2 - 5 1

3 - 7 1

4 - 20 2

5 - 42 18

6 - 18 1

7 - 12 1

8 - 12 2

9 - 18 3

10 - 16

11 - 57 4

12 - 1

13 - 6

14 - 15 2

15 - 2

16 - 5 1

17 - 24 1

18 - 1

[RandallT]

@RandallT, thanks for putting my numbers in the spreadsheet.  I don't mind sharing the number.  Today, I had 31 putts, no 3 putts, and 5 one putts.  I started out poorly without  putting practice before the round - missed 3 straight short putts from holes #1 - #3.  This round's putting is slightly out of norm in that I normally have one to two 3-putts, and make more short & medium putts.   I've rounded up all numbers to next "foot."   Used my laser range finder to measure anything longer than 21 feet.  Shorter than 21 feet, I had to walk to measure (one large step = 3 feet).

Hole 1st putt 2nd putt

1 - 6 feet -> 1 feet -> hole

2 - 5 1

3 - 7 1

4 - 20 2

5 - 42 18

6 - 18 1

7 - 12 1

8 - 12 2

9 - 18 3

10 - 16

11 - 57 4

12 - 1

13 - 6

14 - 15 2

15 - 2

16 - 5 1

17 - 24 1

18 - 1

I enjoy taking a look at other people's stats, just to see what patterns are there. Anyway, it's clear you don't fit the mold of the OP (

Your numbers above break down like this:

You lost fewer than 3 strokes to PGA players this round due to putting. So if you'd putted like a median PGA pro, you'd have shot 88 or so, not 91.

You actually rocked on your long putts. Two putted from long range (even if one was an 18ft comebacker!). You sunk a 16ft putt.

It was in the 3+ to 15ft range, where you lost about 3 strokes. 4-5ft putts, in particular hurt you the most, but only 1.5 strokes, by the numbers.

Lots of caveats in the numbers, of course, but fair to say that even if a player with a profile like you (I'd think this is common) worked extremely hard on putting, the ceiling for that effort is only a few strokes- and that's if you got PGA-pro level competency at that skill.

I'd love for someone that fits the profile described in the OP (decent scores, but 36+ putts per round) sent me their putt tallies like you did. How many strokes are they giving up per round (when compared to Mark Broadie data anyway)?

[Aflighter]

IMHO, its going to be hard to lower your score to the next level by putting better.  10 shots is hard to make up by putting alone.  If you are barely breaking 80 with 32 putts, there is no way you are going to break 70 by improving your putting.  Its all about GIR and proximity to hole.  I worked on my wedge game, 40-110 yards and that alone made a 5 stroke difference.  It also improved putting a bit since i was closer to the hole and putting for more eagles and birdies. Basically, if you are not breaking 90, putting is the least of your concerns.  Focus on ball striking, wedge game, consistent ball contact.  Doesnt matter how well you putt if its always to save a par.

I beg to differ on that.Although I seldom shoot 90 or worse I did shoot 92 yesterday with 40 putts and that was with only hitting 4 greens so that tells you how bad my putting was.My putting has hit rock bottom.None of my drives were in trouble and my irons were up near greens in reg and chipping wasnt bad except fast greens made ball run out too much.So sorry to say but the supposedly easiest part of golf is not the easiest to me anyways.

[billchao]

I beg to differ on that.Although I seldom shoot 90 or worse I did shoot 92 yesterday with 40 putts and that was with only hitting 4 greens so that tells you how bad my putting was.My putting has hit rock bottom.None of my drives were in trouble and my irons were up near greens in reg and chipping wasnt bad except fast greens made ball run out too much.So sorry to say but the supposedly easiest part of golf is not the easiest to me anyways.

I think you may be seeing confirmation bias. You shot 92 but you only hit 4 GIR, meaning you either:

1. Could have shot better by hitting more GIR
2. Didn't chip the ball as well as you think you did

You said yourself that the ball ran out farther than you expected on your chips. Yes, 40 putts is bad, but unless you're missing a bunch of of 3 footers or hit your lag putts 6 feet past the hole or something, I think you could have more make-able putts if you just chipped closer from off the green. That's one of the biggest problems with using putts/round to look at one's putting skill: there are a lot of other factors that contribute to that overall number.

[ghalfaire]

The process of putting always struck me as one of the least athletic activities in sports.  Putting requires no great strength or timing. The actual movement for almost everyone is a fairly simple back and forth of the putter.  It has always seemed to me that other than people with excessive nerves (yips), almost anyone should be reasonably competent in putting with a moderate amount of practice. Yet all the reports I hear about otherwise excellent golfers who can't putt would seem to shatter my assumption that competent putting was a skill that should be mastered by all but a few people with mental or physical difficulties.

If there are any people out there who would be willing to share their story, I would really like to understand what the issues are.  If someone play 5-10 times a year and never practices putting, I can somewhat understand averaging close to 40 putts.  If a player frequents a golf course with diabolical greens like Augusta National, 40 putts starts to make sense, too.  But for the average avid golfer who plays regularly, puts in some practice time and plays a typical public-access course, how does one not become competent enough to get by with something under 36 putts?

FWIW: I believe the secret of good putting is believing in yourself.  More than any other part of the game putting requires confidence.  When on the course and you're addressing your putt you have to believe you're going to make a good putt.  How you gain that confidence is probably a personal process, but for me it was spending time on the putting green trying different putters, techniques and learning to read the breaks until I felt comfortable I had the correct putter, correct technique for me and could read greens.   For me it also consisted of something Arnie once said; "if you want to improve you putting stats, practice your chipping/pitching".  Lot easier to make a 3 foot putt than and 8 foot one, less stressful too.  So I don't want to get into a short game/long game discussion other than to say both are important and most players don't spend enough time on the short game and it costs them.

[natureboy]

Putting is easier to get to certain level.  Anyone can learn to make 3 foot putt at high rate.   But it has to be backed up by good chipping (getting it close to the hole), and good lag putt (getting it even closer to the hole for a tap in).   I average 31.5 putts per round this  month but most of that is due to getting close to the hole with chipping and 1st putt.  I have my 3-putts but they are usually from very long distance.

I've been perhaps the most outspoken bad putter on TST.

I'm a relatively new player (coming up on 5 years now), but in those years have played about as much as a person can play and remain gainfully employed.   After about a dozen putters and all this time, I'm finally starting to feel comfortable on the greens.  My lag putting has improved dramatically this year, and I now make many more than I miss from 3-4 ft.  Still don't make many from 6-10 ft, but that's ok, I'm rarely 3 putting those now.

I have a theory.

Many here may disagree ... I'm interested in hearing feedback.

I think putting REQUIRES REPS.    A $hit ton of reps.     Far more so than striking the ball.    Now I'm not talking about becoming a really good player (which I'll never be), which obviously requires ball striking reps, bigtime reps.       Speaking for myself, putting has required far more time to catch up to the rest of my game ... and I think it just required far more time and reps as it's a feel thing, as opposed to a whole body, large muscle athletic full swing thing. My $.02 ... thoughts ?

I think this is true of short game in general. It's important to have solid technique, but in the words of Paul Runyan, "Touch has to be acquired" . But, I still think full swing takes more to do as well. Sort of inverse skills - long game doesn't really require a lot of touch, but complex timing / coordination while putting takes a lot of touch, but is a fairly simple motion.

Many who grow up playing the game and getting to a high skill level discount the value that all those summer rounds at their club or on the muni brings to their instinctive touch. But since the putting and short game motions are fairly simple, some smart practice / drilling can help compensate for lack of time / reps. I agree with the first poster that short chips and pitches plus lag putting is the place to practice most as a high handicap.

[Aflighter]

I think you may be seeing confirmation bias. You shot 92 but you only hit 4 GIR, meaning you either: [LIST=1] [*] Could have shot better by hitting more GIR [*] Didn't chip the ball as well as you think you did [/LIST] You said yourself that the ball ran out farther than you expected on your chips. Yes, 40 putts is bad, but unless you're missing a bunch of of 3 footers or hit your lag putts 6 feet past the hole or something, I think you could have more make-able putts if you just chipped closer from off the green. That's one of the biggest problems with using putts/round to look at one's putting skill: there are a lot of other factors that contribute to that overall number.

well I had 2 4 putts and 3 3 pts and none were left short of hole.tough pin placements with the fact I couldnt hit the ball easy enough to tap in anything was issue.yes there were chips that ran out and thats my fault but a chip running out shouldnt excuse fact I didnt make anything with putter.twice I was near fringe and I took 5 shots to get in hole on par 3 and 4 on a par 4.both were pins where I put myself above hole and greens running at 12 on stimp undulating that killed me.Mine is alot mentally since im mentally weak haa.

[natureboy]

On a par 72 course with a standard setup, you would have had to hit 11 GIR to shoot an 84 with 41 putts. Statistically, that's a little too good for a 10 handicap.

Possibly, but this is based on the average player. If his game is as described then his putting could be holding back his potential scoring. So the low handicap long game is offset by the very high handicap putting with a resulting HCP index in-between. I'm in a similar, but slightly more balanced (but still 'bad' per this site's standards) situation. I've managed 7 GIR twice.

He could also be playing a course with unusually large greens that inflate his GIR, but leave him with really long first putts so he 3-putts more often.

[Aflighter]

Possibly, but this is based on the average player. If his game is as described then his putting could be holding back his potential scoring. So the low handicap long game is offset by the very high handicap putting with a resulting HCP index in-between. I'm in a similar, but slightly more balanced (but still 'bad' per this site's standards) situation. I've managed 7 GIR twice. He could also be playing a course with unusually large greens that inflate his GIR, but leave him with really long first putts so he 3-putts more often.

You hit it on the head Lihu.Im a 9.3 HCP and generally hit 8-10 greens on avg.Ive done figured up that if I had turned them 3 and 4 pts to 2 pts then I wdve shot 85.still not good to me but lot better than embarassing myself.

[natureboy]

You hit it on the head Lihu.Im a 9.3 HCP and generally hit 8-10 greens on avg.Ive done figured up that if I had turned them 3 and 4 pts to 2 pts then I wdve shot 85.still not good to me but lot better than embarassing myself.

That's pretty extreme too. An average of 9 GIR average correlates with a 'typical' 1 HCP. So your putting (and penalty stroke %) is more similar to a 30s HCP.

[Aflighter]

That's pretty extreme too. An average of 9 GIR average correlates with a 'typical' 1 HCP. So your putting (and penalty stroke %) is more similar to a 30s HCP.

Really? A 1 hcp only hitting 8-10 greens? Dont know how thats possible cause thats gotta put lot of pressure on chipping and putting.I must really suck on short game then.

[JonMA1]

The process of putting always struck me as one of the least athletic activities in sports.  Putting requires no great strength or timing. The actual movement for almost everyone is a fairly simple back and forth of the putter.  It has always seemed to me that other than people with excessive nerves (yips), almost anyone should be reasonably competent in putting with a moderate amount of practice. Yet all the reports I hear about otherwise excellent golfers who can't putt would seem to shatter my assumption that competent putting was a skill that should be mastered by all but a few people with mental or physical difficulties.

If there are any people out there who would be willing to share their story, I would really like to understand what the issues are.  If someone play 5-10 times a year and never practices putting, I can somewhat understand averaging close to 40 putts.  If a player frequents a golf course with diabolical greens like Augusta National, 40 putts starts to make sense, too.  But for the average avid golfer who plays regularly, puts in some practice time and plays a typical public-access course, how does one not become competent enough to get by with something under 36 putts?

I don't know why putting is so difficult for me. I have my days when its better than others, but for the most part, 3 feet and out is an adventure. The greens I play are easy - both in speed and slope.

The only time I seem to putt better is when I don't over-think or over-analyze what the ball will do. I make my read and make less of an adjustment than I think is needed. I have to believe mechanics are to blame in that I often start the ball on a different line than intended. As far as someone keeping below 36 putts, good lag putting as well as a good enough short game to get within 5 feet on a regular basis seems necessary.

In all fairness, I don't work on putting as much because my full swing needs so much work. So I don't really qualify with the name of this thread.

[Duff McGee]

Mvmac makes a good point about coverage in that the announcers don't always tell you if it is a clip or live. They try, but they don't always remember to distinguish.

[natureboy]

Really? A 1 hcp only hitting 8-10 greens? Dont know how thats possible cause thats gotta put lot of pressure on chipping and putting.I must really suck on short game then.

That's for a 'typical course rated about 72 and about 6500 yards. Your course may be much shorter, have big greens or have little trouble (low slope).

[iacas]

Lots of caveats in the numbers, of course, but fair to say that even if a player with a profile like you (I'd think this is common) worked extremely hard on putting, the ceiling for that effort is only a few strokes- and that's if you got PGA-pro level competency at that skill.

Plus… it'd probably require better greens. Lame greens cost players a stroke, sometimes two.

I think this is true of short game in general. It's important to have solid technique, but in the words of Paul Runyan, "Touch has to be acquired" . But, I still think full swing takes more to do as well. Sort of inverse skills - long game doesn't really require a lot of touch, but complex timing / coordination while putting takes a lot of touch, but is a fairly simple motion.

People have plenty of touch. Their technique simply prevents them from tapping into it.

You should buy this book . There's a short story in there about Lebron James that applies here…

---

To the topic, again, if you have a glaring weakness, work extra on it. Putting well is simply about three things. Work on the weakest of the three.

[ZappyAd]

You said yourself that the ball ran out farther than you expected on your chips. Yes, 40 putts is bad, but unless you're missing a bunch of of 3 footers or hit your lag putts 6 feet past the hole or something, I think you could have more make-able putts if you just chipped closer from off the green. That's one of the biggest problems with using putts/round to look at one's putting skill: there are a lot of other factors that contribute to that overall number.

+1 on this - I think I take more putts than I 'should' simply because I'm always starting further away from the hole.  Plus I often end up with putts in the wrong place - on the wrong tier or above the hole or with a nasty break which makes my 40 footer harder than a better player's who maybe manages their misses better.  I feel like if I had better control of my approaches I'd begin putting closer to the hole and have a higher percentage of my misses in a better place to putt from which would immediately make me look like a better putter on a putt count basis.

So I try not to beat myself up about 3 putting or total putts per round because the context has a lot to do with it.  I feel like I'm a good putter I just need some easier putts to start showing it on the scorecard.

[jgreen85]

this thread is helpful. It seems like 32 putts is an average putter? I'm at 32.4 over the last 5 and 34.2 over last 20, so it does confirm I'm a below avg putter, but maybe not as bad as I thought. Even getting to avg wouldn't do that much for my cap.

How much does difficulty of the greens play a role in the stats? I think the greens I play are fairly simple;most putts are pretty straight and not a ton of undulation.

PGA players spend half an hour (more?) before rounds practicing their putting; how much does that improve their putting stats? Should I expect to be near their avg considering I rarely practice putting before I tee off? Or would the difficulty of the greens they play outweigh the benefits of calibrating before teeing off?

How often do you all change your stroke round to round? I had, what felt like, a poor putting round saturday, and when I got home, started trying different setups/grips. My issue is starting the putt on line.

[Lihu]

this thread is helpful. It seems like 32 putts is an average putter? I'm at 32.4 over the last 5 and 34.2 over last 20, so it does confirm I'm a below avg putter, but maybe not as bad as I thought. Even getting to avg wouldn't do that much for my cap.

How much does difficulty of the greens play a role in the stats? I think the greens I play are fairly simple;most putts are pretty straight and not a ton of undulation.

PGA players spend half an hour (more?) before rounds practicing their putting; how much does that improve their putting stats? Should I expect to be near their avg considering I rarely practice putting before I tee off? Or would the difficulty of the greens they play outweigh the benefits of calibrating before teeing off?

How often do you all change your stroke round to round? I had, what felt like, a poor putting round saturday, and when I got home, started trying different setups/grips. My issue is starting the putt on line.

I think you need to have GIR along with putts to decide if you are below or above average?