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Solheim Cup Controversy: Who is more at fault?


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  1. 1. Solheim Cup Controversy: Who is more at fault?

    • Alison Lee
      45
    • Suzann Pettersen
      32
    • Charley Hull
      6
    • Carin Koch
      4


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unless the player is absolutely positive that they heard "it's good", and others heard it as well, there is only ONE person "responsible" for the controversy, and that is the player that picked up the

I doubt anyone is going to change their mind about this, but I'm glad that the golf media has moved on and I think that this is one of the rarer instances where things resolved. Ultimately Lee is r

Why the secrecy? If that was true, that would have been THE FIRST thing that Petterson should have said in defense of herself when asked about it after the round.

I gotta admit I'm really surprised by some of the responses. Especially folks who are so adamant about following the rules of golf otherwise.

I've been in tons of matches where I gave short putts until later holes of the match, then got silent and made the opponent putt, even 2 foot putts. Had it done to me, too. No big deal, it's just part of the psychological side of match play. Previous concessions don't imply future concessions in any way. If it's not clearly given, end of story. You putt it out. And this happens at all levels of match play.

Walking towards the edge of the green means nothing. Maybe a little bad form but it doesn't mean "that's good, pick it up."

Saying that one should go back and let her put the ball back down and putt it out "in good sportsmanship" makes no sense if it wasn't given in the first place. It's against the rules. No different than someone hitting OB on the first tee and you won't give them a mulligan. She should not have picked it up. This wasn't a $2 nassau at the muni. It's the Solheim freaking Cup. Rules is rules!

If this was a money bet there would have been none of this misplaced angst. Maybe I grew up in too much of an atmosphere of matches and betting, but these matches are a big deal. Lee was clearly wrong, 100% her fault. She doesn't get a mulligan or a do-over. And the Euros aren't expletive-deleteds for holding her to it.

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Alison should not have assumed the putt was conceded...supposedly she was also warned earlier a couple of times about picking up putts...Alison should know better as she played match play many times in her Am career....likely a heat of the moment brain fart by Alison.

This vid should set some more light on Petterson's and Hull's intention.

http://www.lpga.com/videos/pettersen-and-hull-address-concession-controversy-from-morning-at-solheim-cup

Nike must use the same PR consultant for their golf pros....Suzann's answers sound like Tiger's responses.

Charley, don't chew gum at a press conference.

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I watched the LPGA video where SP is describing it. Total bollocks! Twice she says "we wanted to see the putt". Then don't walk away. This was a gotcha. Congrats you snagged someone in a rules violation that 99.9% of the time is "nah, don't worry about it" It does go against the spirit of the game to be like this. Maybe there should be a rule for Ryder and Solheim cups to play everything out. I want to beat an opponent when they are playing their best and I am as well. This is jackass-ery and exploiting a technicality. If you are so interested in that putt why did you rush off the green like you have to take a crap?!
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I didn't bother to read every post here, but can confidently say this...

In match play one may pick up if your next shot is EXPLICITLY conceded, or if you concede the hole  - else play it out.

Pretty simple!

Frankly, LPGA has been sub par in all respects this season, no disrespect intended to the ladies who have (despite the general trend) displayed exemplary play.

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Right but Lee thought she heard "that's good", give her the benefit of the doubt, put the ball back and have her putt it. It's not like Lee was trying to cheat or get away with something, it was an honest mistake.

I may have been wrong with my interpretation of the rule here. My thinking was the Euros could have allowed Lee to put the ball back but in watching the replay it's seems like that isn't an option because Pettersen/Hull didn't say anything and the rules official confirmed that, even though Lee thought she heard something. The body language of Hull indicated the hole was done but there needs to be some verbal communication.

Doesn't change my vote or how I feel about the situation. Lee is mostly to blame but in the spirit of the game/matches Pettersen and Hull should have given her the putt (even after she picked it up) and moved on to the next hole.

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I gotta admit I'm really surprised by some of the responses. Especially folks who are so adamant about following the rules of golf otherwise.

Totally agree with that.

I watched the LPGA video where SP is describing it. Total bollocks! Twice she says "we wanted to see the putt". Then don't walk away. This was a gotcha. Congrats you snagged someone in a rules violation that 99.9% of the time is "nah, don't worry about it"

I've only seen the video posted in the OP. That doesn't show SP walking off (she's not in the picture). Does anyone know if she started walking as well (or even better, is there video showing it)? If she's not walking off (and CH didn't concede the putt) then they've done nothing wrong in my view (in the video linked by Me22putt above CH says she wasn't walking off, she was walking over to SP). If SP did start walking off, then it's bad sportsmanship.

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Doesn't change my vote or how I feel about the situation. Lee is mostly to blame but in the spirit of the game/matches Pettersen and Hull should have given her the putt (even after she picked it up) and moved on to the next hole.

This sort of thing happens it soccer.  When a player is injured and down, whoever has the ball will kick it out to protect the downed player.  In a real pro match a few years ago, I've seen a player who didn't kick it out.   He continued to play and scored with it when both team members stopped playing, expecting him to kick the ball out.   Then, unlike what happened in the S-Cup, both team managers got upset at the player who scored.   When the play resumed, the team that  just scored the goal, intentionally allowed the other team to score.   That's the spirit of good sportsmanship.  Patterson, Hull, or the EU team seem to lack it.  Moreover, this is a black eye for women's golf.

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I gotta admit I'm really surprised by some of the responses. Especially folks who are so adamant about following the rules of golf otherwise.

I've been in tons of matches where I gave short putts until later holes of the match, then got silent and made the opponent putt, even 2 foot putts. Had it done to me, too. No big deal, it's just part of the psychological side of match play. Previous concessions don't imply future concessions in any way. If it's not clearly given, end of story. You putt it out. And this happens at all levels of match play.

Walking towards the edge of the green means nothing. Maybe a little bad form but it doesn't mean "that's good, pick it up."

Saying that one should go back and let her put the ball back down and putt it out "in good sportsmanship" makes no sense if it wasn't given in the first place. It's against the rules. No different than someone hitting OB on the first tee and you won't give them a mulligan. She should not have picked it up. This wasn't a $2 nassau at the muni. It's the Solheim freaking Cup. Rules is rules!

If this was a money bet there would have been none of this misplaced angst. Maybe I grew up in too much of an atmosphere of matches and betting, but these matches are a big deal. Lee was clearly wrong, 100% her fault. She doesn't get a mulligan or a do-over. And the Euros aren't expletive-deleteds for holding her to it.

Could not agree more.

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Suzanne has issued what looks to be a fairly humble apology on Instagram:

https://instagram.com/p/74r3eQOVA4/

Quote:
suzannpettersen I've never felt more gutted and truly sad about what went down Sunday on the 17th at the Solheim Cup.
I am so sorry for not thinking about the bigger picture in the heat of the battle and competition. I was trying my hardest for my team and put the single match and the point that could be earned ahead of sportsmanship and the game of golf itself! I feel like I let my team down and I am sorry.
To the U.S. team, you guys have a great leader in Juli , who I've always looked up to and respect so much. Knowing I need to make things "right," I had a face to face chat with her before leaving Germany this morning to tell her in person how I really feel about all of this. I wanted her also to know that I am sorry.
I hope in time the U.S. team will forgive me and know that I have learned a valuable lesson about what is truly important in this great game of golf which has given me so much in my life.
To the fans of golf who watched the competition on TV, I am sorry for the way I carried myself. I can be so much better and being an ambassador for this great game means a lot to me.
The Solheim Cup has been a huge part of my career. I wish I could change Sunday for many reasons. Unfortunately I can't.
This week I want to push forward toward another opportunity to earn the Solheim Cup back for Europe in the right way. And I want to work hard to earn back your belief in me as someone who plays hard, plays fair and plays the great game of golf the right way.

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If a putt is not conceded (yet), you don't pick up the ball.

That being said, it was poor sportmanship walking off the green like that, I can understand it makes the suggestion that you did concede the putt (why else would you walk off?). Following the rules the call was correct, but it feels a bit unfair.

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Laura Davies had this to say:

Laura Davies, the veteran who has appeared in a record 12 Solheim teams, saw it rather differently. “I’m disgusted,” the Englishwoman said on Sky Sports. “Charley Hull has just won a point and she is in floods of tears. That tells you the wrong thing was done. How Suzann can justify that I will never, ever know. She has let herself down and she has certainly let her team down.

“I’m so glad I’m not on that team this time. Pettersen will regret this. If the US go on to win, there’s only one person to blame.”

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Suzanne has issued what looks to be a fairly humble apology on Instagram:

https://instagram.com/p/74r3eQOVA4/


I think the above says everything.

One can take game playing too far.

Walking off the green while the ball is still in play in those circumstances and the way it was done, was too much game playing. And then doubling down by Petterson by saying it was not good, and Hull's reaction shows Suzanne had lost perspective.

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I'm with Laura Davies on this. There is no bigger supporter of Europe in Ryder and Solheim cups than me but after this I was pleased USA won.

I don't want to win on technicalities or using rules to your advantage. I immediately stopped wanting Europe to win as soon as I saw the video of this. And that sucks, as a patriotic British/European golf fan.

That is why I stopped watching soccer. I can't want my team to win when they constantly dive and feign injury to gain an advantage.

If my opponent mistakenly picked up a putt of any length, thinking it was conceded, I would just ask them to replace it and putt it out. Anything else is just manufacturing an advantage outside of playing golf. Lee gained nothing by picking it up, if she is asked to replace it. She is not trying to gain anything by picking it up. The only person who has intentionally gained an advantage from the situation is SP and therefore the Euro team.

And for those that say 'but the rules say there must be a statement of concession' or whatever, SP could have convinced that ref that she could see why Lee thought it was conceded and convinced the ref to let her replace the ball and putt out.

That is what anyone would do if they want to win by being better at golf.

In my eyes SP just showed that she is a fierce competitor, but not a proper golfer.

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In my eyes SP just showed that she is a fierce competitor, but not a proper golfer.

I wouldn't go that far. Seems like she just got swept up in the heat of competition and made a poor decision. She realized afterwards that she shouldn't have done that.

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Note: This thread is 2125 days old. We appreciate that you found this thread instead of starting a new one, but if you plan to post here please make sure it's still relevant. If not, please start a new topic. Thank you!

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