What if Payne was alive today?

[14ledo81]

57 minutes ago, boogielicious said:

Please stick to the topic, Payne Stewart.

Did you read his post?

It was about Payne.....

[boogielicious]

4 minutes ago, 14ledo81 said:

Did you read his post?

It was about Payne.....

Quote

The next group consists of the "entertainers". They have a lot of natural ability and know how to properly use it without spending countless hours at the driving range. Ben Hogan, in his relentless pursuit of perfection, believed he hit only a few "good" shots a round. The Haig, by contrast, knew he would hit 7 bad shots a round and accepted that inevitability.  Hagen's philosophy was summed up his advice: "Don't hurry. Don't worry. And do NOT forget to smell the flowers along the way."                                        The entertainers believe the fans are there to see good shots AND also be entertained. Payne fits into this group, along with Hagen, Jimmy Demaret, Lee Trevino, Fred Couples, Doug Sanders, Fred Funk, the FUZ, Chi Chi, Ben Crenshaw, and Ian Poulter.                                                         Neither group is "right" while the other is "wrong".  You know the expression-----"different strokes for different folks"

This is not about Payne Stewart with regards to the OP. It is PEZ going off into other subjects he wants to discuss. He is doing this often and we are trying to break the habit.

[RussUK]

The tour would have been a lot less "sterile" had Payne still been around. The tour needs more characters like him.

[turtleback]

On 12/28/2015 at 9:22 AM, Patch said:

Yep. Same possible scenario, that would have probably included others besides Jack.  Champaign Tony Lema. Thanks for mentioning him.

The first golf instructional book I ever had was written by Champagne Tony.  Too bad he has been so completely forgotten.

[Lihu]

What if Payne were a live today? It seems like he would be a great example for those with natural talent and make golf more entertaining? Kind of like having more people like Bubba Watson, I suppose? There are lots more kids in the 15-18 year old crowd that play to a high level than those who work 6 hours a day to play at the same level? Seems like Payne would be a great role model for those more gifted kids?

[PEZGolf]

2 hours ago, Lihu said:

What if Payne were a live today? It seems like he would be a great example for those with natural talent and make golf more entertaining? Kind of like having more people like Bubba Watson, I suppose? There are lots more kids in the 15-18 year old crowd that play to a high level than those who work 6 hours a day to play at the same level? Seems like Payne would be a great role model for those more gifted kids?

Good post.  I failed to mention Bubba's name, so thanks for doing so.  I did this thread deliberately to talk about Payne in a greater context than just his accomplishments in winning tournaments.  His outgoing style, as reflected in the plus-4's, etc. made him a crowd favorite and that is why my family and  I became members of the Payne's Pals fan club I started.  When my Dad took me to the Thendara Golf Club to see an exhibition featuring the colorful Doug Sanders and the Merry Mex (Lee Trevino)in 1973, I was won over to the game of golf.  If we had seen two serious golfers who did not relate to the gallery, I would not have become a lifelong fan.  Many of today's golfers on the PGA Tour lose sight of this, and sometimes, it takes a reminder from the Old Guard, like Arnie, Jack, and The Black Knight to remind the New Guard that without fans, there is NO Tour and no income for them.

[PEZGolf]

Just for the record: in the 1999 US Open, Tiger bogied the short 71st hole and Payne birdied it. Tiger finished 2 back of Payne. That hole finished Tiger off, leaving only Phil and we all know what happened on the last hole.

 

[saevel25]

10 minutes ago, PEZGolf said:

Just for the record: in the 1999 US Open, Tiger bogied the short 71st hole and Payne birdied it. Tiger finished 2 back of Payne. That hole finished Tiger off, leaving only Phil and we all know what happened on the last hole.

 

So what? Tiger won the 2000 US open by 15 strokes, and he began the day with a 10 stroke lead. 

[PEZGolf]

1 hour ago, saevel25 said:

So what? Tiger won the 2000 US open by 15 strokes, and he began the day with a 10 stroke lead. 

You miss the point. Other people have posted that Payne would have been too old after 1999 to win more majors. He would have been 44 in 2001. When he won in 1999, Phil, Tiger, VJ and others were in contention. He beat ALL of them. Tiger did not win the US Open in 2001, 2003, 2004 or 2005. Payne had to beat not just Tiger, but the Goose, Furyk,and Campbell. And he did that in 1999.

 

 

[mvmac]

1 hour ago, PEZGolf said:

He beat ALL of them. Tiger did not win the US Open in 2001, 2003, 2004 or 2005. Payne had to beat not just Tiger, but the Goose, Furyk,and Campbell. And he did that in 1999.

You're giving Payne's game more credit than it deserves. Payne was a great player but he wasn't one of those players that was a top 5 favorite every time he teed it up.

[Golfingdad]

Just now, mvmac said:

You're giving Payne's game more credit than it deserves. Payne was a great player but he wasn't one of those players that was a top 5 favorite every time he teed it up.

Yeah, I don't remember him being nearly that "revered" when he was alive.  Methinks people wouldn't think much at all about him today if he was still alive.  He'd have the same amount of majors and we'd put him in a category with Fred Couples and Davis Love or thereabouts.  He'd get a teeny amount of extra "flash" credit because of his dress ... but then again, so does Ian Poulter.

He certainly wouldn't have a statue anywhere.

[PEZGolf]

4 minutes ago, mvmac said:

You're giving Payne's game more credit than it deserves. Payne was a great player but he wasn't one of those players that was a top 5 favorite every time he teed it up.

I agree that Payne was not a dominant player. I never said he was. He never was ranked #1 or 2. He was a very good player who won 3 Majors, 12 tournaments, earned his way onto 5 Ryder Cup teams, and was elected to the World Golf Hall of Fame. He won 3 Majors, 1 more than Greg Norman. His total Majors is equal to Tom Kite, Fred Couples, and Davis Love III COMBINED! Not bad!

[Phil McGleno]

If Payne were alive today it would be a modern miracle of some kind-Aviation, Medical. Maybe that Star Wars guy would have brought him back to life.

Odds are he would have never won again and would have won a few times on the Champions Tour. He would be 59 right now.

[PEZGolf]

I think we can ALL agree that NO ONE KNOWS how Payne would have done had he lived, any more than anyone KNOWS how Tiger would have done if he did not have injuries and surgeries. To say otherwise is whistling in the wind.

[Phil McGleno]

5 minutes ago, PEZGolf said:

I think we can ALL agree that NO ONE KNOWS how Payne would have done had he lived, any more than anyone KNOWS how Tiger would have done if he did not have injuries and surgeries. To say otherwise is whistling in the wind.

No shit.-That includes you.

Guess what-Some of us do not think Payne was the stud you think he is.

[SavvySwede]

6 minutes ago, PEZGolf said:

I think we can ALL agree that NO ONE KNOWS how Payne would have done had he lived, any more than anyone KNOWS how Tiger would have done if he did not have injuries and surgeries. To say otherwise is whistling in the wind.

Um... You started the topic. You can't dismiss it now because people disagreed with you.

[saevel25]

29 minutes ago, PEZGolf said:

He won 3 Majors, 1 more than Greg Norman. His total Majors is equal to Tom Kite, Fred Couples, and Davis Love III COMBINED! Not bad!

Greg Norman was a way better golfer than Payne was. Majors is not the measure of greatness in golf. Payne had his good 7 year run from 1985 till 1991. They guy only won 3 times after 1991. He basically fell off the map till he had a good one year in 1999. You are giving him way too much credit. 

[iacas]

4 minutes ago, SavvySwede said:

Um... You started the topic. You can't dismiss it now because people disagreed with you.

Yup.

At least with Tiger there's a more sizable history and thus more support for how he might have performed (and, at the same time, less history, because few people won as often as he did for so long).