Playing in the wind: draw or fade

[taxgolf]

I have a question, watching the Scotish Open.

Picture this (right handed player). You are in the fairway, let's say an I7 to the green, to make it easy, flag a bit right of center. I know there are a lot more factors, like what is on the right side of the green, where do I miss it, what shot do you normally play etc. But for argument sake, lets leave that out. The wind is blowing accross the fairway, perpendicular. You have the choice for 2 type of shots.  A fade or a draw.

 

My question: what do you play? What is the safest option?

 

If I hit a fade, I want to let the ball turning in the wind, back to the flag. But if the wind catches on, I might up hitting a push. Vice versa with the draw. I want to start it right of the flag, which means the ball will start into the wind, but if the wind takes on, I might just end up with a ball way left of the flag.  

Does a ball turn into the wind? Or do you always play into wind? 

 

Do I hit a fade or a draw? Or is the answer simply: it depends?

 

I was just wondering and couldn't find an answer for myself.  I saw Mcdonald hitting a shot and he looked discusted with the outcome. I coulnd't see the type of shot he hit.

 

 

[dchoye]

I play at a course that is really wide open and windy links style 

I can't fade my irons   I can only hit a low straight knockdown type shot or high draw with my irons 

so if the wind blows left to right I tend to draw against the wind 

if the wind goes right to left I tend to hit my knockdown and aim bit left and maybe take less club 

the hard part is if the wind is directly behind me or against me    Wind with me I tend to take less club and high draw

Wind against me low knockdown 

off course the lie trumps everything   If I have a ball above me feet I feel like I need to draw the ball 

 

Edited July 9, 2016 by dchoye

[taxgolf]

So, wind left to right, you tend to draw it. And if you could hit a fade (which you can't), wind right to left, you want to hit a fade. Correct?

 

So can I take it that you want to start you ball in the wind?

[natureboy]

Not sure if draw / fade is the right either / or question. High vs. Low might be the better question to ask first and I would say lower is probably better.

For links golf that typically means more club (less loft) swung easier (less spin and ballooning).

In the OP scenario, it's likely to depend on the distance too. A shot that is curving with the wind is generally going to fly lower and travel further both linearly and laterally. A ball hit against the wind is likely to balloon up and fly higher than normal, travel shorter, and less laterally (vs. the same amount of spin axis tilt without wind).

Links courses more typically give a player the an option to run it up so going with the wind may be a safer play than on a 'target golf' type course where holding against the wind for a higher landing angle to hold the green might be better.

IMO, the 'all things being equal' scenario of the OP would be very rare to find on an actual golf course. Usually the particular hole layout matters a great deal in choosing the right approach (if you can pull it off).

Edited July 9, 2016 by natureboy

[DrvFrShow]

Wind against me? More club. Choke down. Low cut.

Wind behind me? Less club. (except on the drive)

Wind right to left. Normal shot.

Wind left to right: Normal shot just aimed a little more left. Driver - tee it high and let it fly. I'll play my fade, but aim further left and let the wind carry it further.

[Patch]

To me it depends on how much wind there is. No club, or, one or two club wind.  After that it depends on how many trees the course has, and how much protection they offer against the wind. 

After that, if there is enough wind,  it's keeping the ball low, with what ever club I can use. Usually punch shots with my 5, or 7 wood. I am not that consistent working the ball one way or the other, so low, and some what straight works best for me. I do aim a little left or right in cross winds. Less club with the wind, and more club against the wind. Main thing is I don't change my swing tempo. I use the same swing speed for every shot. 

It's pretty much the same in my short game depending on wind speed. 

Any wind speed, 2 club, or more, and I am pretty much toast as it is. 

[DaveP043]

For me, I want to hit it lower in windier conditions. That means the ball is further back in my stance. Further back means I'm more likely to catch it with the club heading toward the right (I'm right handed).  That means I'll be hitting a draw, or a straight push.  This tendency holds true no matter which way the wind is blowing. I have a hard time hitting a low fade, but that's just me.

[Jakester23]

2 hours ago, DaveP043 said:

For me, I want to hit it lower in windier conditions. That means the ball is further back in my stance. Further back means I'm more likely to catch it with the club heading toward the right (I'm right handed).  That means I'll be hitting a draw, or a straight push.  This tendency holds true no matter which way the wind is blowing. I have a hard time hitting a low fade, but that's just me.

I'm the exact opposite. When I try to hit a draw it's typically a straight pull. I do like the idea of shaping the ball against the wind on a approach shot. I would think it would stop quicker than going with the wind. I'm just not good enough to do it.

[DaveP043]

I'm a believer in playing my natural shot whenever I can. I'm a decent player, but I don't fade the ball reliably. I don't try to hit a fade unless I absolutely have to. In the wind, I think the best thing to do is to hit a shot you can rely on, and for my that's a draw. The further back I play it, in order to hit it low, the more likely  am to hit a draw. I don't try to fade it into the wind, that's a losing proposition for me.  If its a left to right wind, I can hold it into the wind. If it's the other way, I'll ride the wind. I was recently in Ireland, and a few times I was aiming at Canada, hoping to hit Ireland.

[billchao]

When the wind is right to left, I aim a little to the right and hit a draw.

When the wind is left to right, I aim a little to the left and hit a draw.

[Rainmaker]

I do not hit a good fade - EXCEPT into a right to left wind. Then it seems to work - especially on the range.  I often get this "held by the wind" effect where the fade spin vs the wind ends up going straight-ish. 

My fades are high but I'll hit one into a 2 club wind and think it will go straight (think is the operative word). 

My draws seem to draw against the wind even if it's pretty strong - the ball still moves left. 

[Patch]

I sometimes will go to my driving range during windy conditions and practice my long game. Maybe 15-20 balls just to get an idea what I can, or can't get away with. 

[David in FL]

11 hours ago, DaveP043 said:

I'm a believer in playing my natural shot whenever I can. I'm a decent player, but I don't fade the ball reliably.....

This.

Too many people watch the best players in the world make certain adjustments and assume that the should (try) to do the same.

Unless it's a real extraordinary exception, I'm playing my stock shot, taking as much club as necessary, and concentrating on an easy, well balanced swing.

[bkuehn1952]

I am with @DaveP043 and @David in FL in that I typically don't attempt to work a ball unless there is no reasonable alternative.  Right to left wind I aim a bit right, left to right a bit left unless there is something left or right that makes that approach aiming at trouble.  As I hit a bit of a draw when the hole is way over on the right and the wind is blowing right to left, I have to accept I am going to be, at best, in the middle of the green.

[vangator]

I haven't been on in a while.

Pretty easy decision. My stock shot is a draw.  With the pin on the right, if the wind is from the right, I aim for the center of the green and hit a fade.  If the wind is coming from the left, I aim at the pin with a draw and let the wind hold the draw off. The wind is tough to play in.  I always swing a little easier unless I'm downwind.  The extra spin won't hurt as much downwind.

I hardly ever play when there isn't wind.  I play a course on Tampa Bay and there's always wind.

If you can't reliably shape a shot, get a video on the mechanics and hit a few buckets of balls.  It will be worth it.

The way I fade a ball (I typically draw everything) is aim my body 20* left of my intended target line.  Point the face of my club at the target.  Swing about 15* left of target.  I take extra club because I'm not going to swing full speed.  I'm worried more about making the proper swing.  Swinging too fast (my normal draw speed) quite often results in a double cross.  Not good.  Play the ball a little forward helps fade the ball.  Shallower AoA.  I play it a little more toward to toe because it naturally releases my lag earlier (for some reason).

Nothing wrong with a 3/4 swing that gets the ball on the green.

Edited July 10, 2016 by vangator

[mvmac]

@taxgolf, stick with your stock curve unless you have to hit it around a tree or something. Since the ball is played further back for a wind shot, you'll have more outward path so for me it makes sense to play a draw.

Example below from the other day, hitting a "chip" 8-iron from 140 yards downhill. Wind was into me and blowing right to left. Just trying to hit it to the center of the green so I'm aiming at the flag and allowing the wind/draw to curve it to the center. I'm "chipping" it to control the distance and take some spin/curve off it. The "center" is a bit further right than what you see because a decent portion of the left side is false front. 

 

[taxgolf]

Thanks for all the answers.

 

I know a better player can probably work the ball. Myself, however, as much as I would like it, can not. I'll stay as much as I can with my stock shot (fade) and compensate the alignment. 

[natureboy]

10 minutes ago, taxgolf said:

I know a better player can probably work the ball. Myself, however, as much as I would like it, can not. I'll stay as much as I can with my stock shot (fade) and compensate the alignment. 

It wouldn't hurt to hit it lower by taking more club and swinging a bit easier.