Ball Flight Laws post

[lastings]

11 minutes ago, shortstop20 said:

There are plenty of people who come too far from the inside. 

The vast majority of people who hook the ball, for example. 

nope.  untrue.  

There are lots of reasons for a hook.  but, mostly it has to do with face as it relates to path.  For, example if a person comes from 4 degrees inside with a straight face angle, The ball will start straight and hook.  you may believe that this was because you came too far from the inside.  but, if you have an inside-to-out swing you are intentionally playing a draw.  so, a straight face angle is wrong.   you need to have a slightly open face.   

and even worse is a pull hook.  a pull-hook comes from the outside-in with a face that is closed relative to the path.  

 

 

[MRR]

On 5/1/2017 at 0:20 PM, TN94z said:

Why did he switch his driver to a fade?

Pretty sure it's just the result of a consistent swing.

If he always swings so that the he is perfectly centered about an inch inside his left foot, then the path will be heading to the right for all his irons and woods, but coming back left for the driver when the ball is teed up and placed farther forward.

[Antneye]

30 minutes ago, shortstop20 said:

There are plenty of people who come too far from the inside. 

The vast majority of people who hook the ball, for example. 

I would think that the vast majority of bad hookers are people who are slightly over the top with a club face that is closed relative to that path.

 I think I'm not confusing that but maybe I am.  

[shortstop20]

10 minutes ago, lastings said:

nope.  untrue.  

There are lots of reasons for a hook.  but, mostly it has to do with face as it relates to path.  For, example if a person comes from 4 degrees inside with a straight face angle, The ball will start straight and hook.  you may believe that this was because you came too far from the inside.  but, if you have an inside-to-out swing you are intentionally playing a draw.  so, a straight face angle is wrong.   you need to have a slightly open face.   

and even worse is a pull hook.  a pull-hook comes from the outside-in with a face that is closed relative to the path.  

 

 

People who hook the ball alot have large face to path differentials, 4 degrees isn't causing a big hook unless you toe the ball. Having a person with a large differential(6+ degrees) open the face is just going to lead to misses turning into pushes and push fades. 

But I agree, if the person is swinging 4 degrees inside-out, just get the face 2 degrees left of the path(2 degrees right of target).

Edited May 2, 2017 by shortstop20

[iacas]

2 minutes ago, Antneye said:

I would think that the vast majority of bad hookers are people who are slightly over the top with a club face that is closed relative to that path.

I don't know about that.

[TN94z]

2 minutes ago, MRR said:

Pretty sure it's just the result of a consistent swing.

If he always swings so that the he is perfectly centered about an inch inside his left foot, then the path will be heading to the right for all his irons and woods, but coming back left for the driver when the ball is teed up and placed farther forward.

I read an article where he stated that it was just a much more consistent shot than his draw which often turned into snap hooks. I was just making a point with the question...it was somewhat rhetorical

[shortstop20]

3 minutes ago, Antneye said:

I would think that the vast majority of bad hookers are people who are slightly over the top with a club face that is closed relative to that path.

 I think I'm not confusing that but maybe I am.  

Common misconception among golfers. 

[lastings]

Just now, shortstop20 said:

Common misconception among golfers. 

Maybe I am wrong, and @iacas would obviously know more, but I would guess the vast majority of bad hookers would be people that have a slightly in-to-out swing and a closed club-face.  because, over the top with a face closed to the path is a pretty bad swing.  I would think most golfers, after a couple of snap hooks, would at least be able open the face and find a swing that slices back to the middle.  

but, people that use a strong grip might come from the inside and not even realize they are closing their clubface and, thus, hook that all to frequently rears it's ugly head.  

[Antneye]

8 minutes ago, lastings said:

Maybe I am wrong, and @iacas would obviously know more, but I would guess the vast majority of bad hookers would be people that have a slightly in-to-out swing and a closed club-face.  because, over the top with a face closed to the path is a pretty bad swing.  I would think most golfers, after a couple of snap hooks, would at least be able open the face and find a swing that slices back to the middle.  

but, people that use a strong grip might come from the inside and not even realize they are closing their clubface and, thus, hook that all to frequently rears it's ugly head.  

I probably over-stated it by saying that this would be the vast majority.  It is better to say that it would be a pretty bad hook.  I'm just happy to see that I applied the concept properly :)

[shortstop20]

34 minutes ago, lastings said:

Maybe I am wrong, and @iacas would obviously know more, but I would guess the vast majority of bad hookers would be people that have a slightly in-to-out swing and a closed club-face.  because, over the top with a face closed to the path is a pretty bad swing.  I would think most golfers, after a couple of snap hooks, would at least be able open the face and find a swing that slices back to the middle.  

but, people that use a strong grip might come from the inside and not even realize they are closing their clubface and, thus, hook that all to frequently rears it's ugly head.  

Most people's hooks start fairly straight and then hook. 

Just like most people's slices start fairly straight and then slice. 

[TN94z]

5 minutes ago, shortstop20 said:

Most people's hooks start fairly straight and then hook. 

Just like most people's slices start fairly straight and then slice. 

I pretty much agree. I would think most amateurs are either going to be OTT or more square with an opened or closed clubface. Most of the newer golfers and people just learning I have seen, do not swing inside out much at all. But that's just what I have seen from the people I have played around. Most of these golfers with a slice start left and slice.

Edited May 2, 2017 by TN94z

[Jack Watson]

One thing is bad over the top makes it physically more difficult to square face to path at impact.  Over to with face closed to path is goin way way left unplayable and the player would have put some serious twist in the shaft to get there.

The physics of the swingshape play a strong role in what the face will tend to do.

[billchao]

6 hours ago, lastings said:

and even worse is a pull hook.  a pull-hook comes from the outside-in with a face that is closed relative to the path.  

You can hit a pull-hook with an inside path. Face -1, path +5. Pull-hook.

6 hours ago, shortstop20 said:

People who hook the ball alot have large face to path differentials, 4 degrees isn't causing a big hook unless you toe the ball. Having a person with a large differential(6+ degrees) open the face is just going to lead to misses turning into pushes and push fades. 

Read more  

Agree with this, been there and done that. I probably know more about swinging too far out than most people here 

[shortstop20]

8 hours ago, lastings said:

 

and even worse is a pull hook.  a pull-hook comes from the outside-in with a face that is closed relative to the path.  

 

 

Missed this earlier. 

Think about just how hard it would be to hit a hook with an outside-in path. To hit a hook, the path has to be right of the clubface. If the path is left of target(outside-in), let's say just ONE degree, you'd have to have the clubface 6 degrees or more left of that to hit what I would call a "hook". The face would be pointing 7 degrees left, that's HUGE. That ball would start so far left it would be quite ridiculous. Like that's one of the shots that makes us golfers go, "What was that!". I've hit that shot that starts ridiculously far left and goes further left, not saying I haven't, but it's rare. Almost no golfer hits that shot very often. 

 

Edited May 3, 2017 by shortstop20

[oregongolfguy]

I will freely admit, i have been known from time to time to hit a monster pull hook that is so huge frankly its impressive in its own way lol.  Once on a par 5.  OB about 40yds from the middle of fairway left, then houses past that to the left.  I let loose a perfect center strike monster hook, right over the houses to somewhere in the neighborhood.  I had to have moved 100yds left from my aimpoint by the time it landed.  Flushed that sucker.  

  The joys of golf lol

[span3636]

I too recently learned that to hit a straight ball with an iron you must swing slightly left of the target line. This did not make sense to me at first, but it works.