LIV Golf (Saudi PIF), "Mergers," and More

[boogielicious]

25 minutes ago, Dinglegolf said:

To play Devil's advocate here, is there something to be said that LIV golf has exposed a weakness in the business model of the PGA Tour given their immediate introduction of the limited field events?  I.e. was the PGA Tour not listening to their player demands and was prompted into action by necessity?

 

 

Possibly, but the PGA Tour has always had some limited field events and team competitions. None of what LIV does is new except throwing enormous amounts of money at players to join. LIV has not reinvented golf. They play by the same rules and still hit the same little ball around 18 holes. 

[hunterdog]

20 minutes ago, Dinglegolf said:

To play Devil's advocate here, is there something to be said that LIV golf has exposed a weakness in the business model of the PGA Tour given their immediate introduction of the limited field events?  I.e. was the PGA Tour not listening to their player demands and was prompted into action by necessity?

 

 

You might be correct. To keep the top players, the PGAT has reorganized its league with a number of elevated events. I’m not sure how many qualify for these events. But the PGAT has a feeder process to qualify. Let’s say it’s the top 75 players: a player like Tom Kim, by playing well, can pretty rapidly qualify; while a player, like Rickie Fowler, can drop out of the list of exempted players. That would be a merit based system, unlike LIV which has an arbitrary selection process and some players, by contract, won’t be dropped. The lower ranked PGAT players, meanwhile, have plenty events to play, earn a very good paycheck, and work their way up the ladder. Not perfect but the new PGAT system will likely give televised golf consumers a better product overall and maintain a merit based system. 
Note: the issue identified by John Rahm needs to be addressed. Maybe by a couple of events ((Scottish Open) co-sanctioned by the DP World Tour become elevated events?

[Dinglegolf]

21 minutes ago, boogielicious said:

Possibly, but the PGA Tour has always had some limited field events and team competitions. None of what LIV does is new except throwing enormous amounts of money at players to join. LIV has not reinvented golf. They play by the same rules and still hit the same little ball around 18 holes. 

More in the sense that, rightly or wrongly, they pushed the envelope for the PGA Tour to explore more limited field events to appease the Top 50 players that they perhaps would not have moved on.  

I am more interested in the evolvement of the PGA Tour in a vacuum.  As a viewer, the current limited field events hold no more interest for me than any of the regular tour events, I may watch some of it if I am channel surfing, so I am thinking it is a risk to introduce these events and the financial investment that goes with them, if they are not going to move the viewership needle. 

[boogielicious]

5 hours ago, Dinglegolf said:

More in the sense that, rightly or wrongly, they pushed the envelope for the PGA Tour to explore more limited field events to appease the Top 50 players that they perhaps would not have moved on.  

I am more interested in the evolvement of the PGA Tour in a vacuum.  As a viewer, the current limited field events hold no more interest for me than any of the regular tour events, I may watch some of it if I am channel surfing, so I am thinking it is a risk to introduce these events and the financial investment that goes with them, if they are not going to move the viewership needle. 

Good points. I think maybe we should give the PGA Tour the feedback. There must be a way to contact them about what we would like to see.

 

[Bucki1968]

Will the Saudis and Donald Trump Save Golf—or Wreck It? | The New Yorker

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High-level defections! Tiger Woods and Jared Kushner! Lawsuits and blacklists! Is the new LIV league a way to reward players, or the vanity project of a despot, or something else?

Great article. I know more now than I did know. Not sure if that's good or bad?

[Elmer]

2 hours ago, Bucki1968 said:

Will the Saudis and Donald Trump Save Golf—or Wreck It? | The New Yorker

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High-level defections! Tiger Woods and Jared Kushner! Lawsuits and blacklists! Is the new LIV league a way to reward players, or the vanity project of a despot, or something else?

Great article. I know more now than I did know. Not sure if that's good or bad?

Like you said "great article", not sure it made me think any better of LIV.
Lots of good points in the article:

The LIV tour looks much more relaxed - "For the players, it looked like a weekend outing among buddies."

However as the PGA indicated -“Our strategy is we always want the best. liv doesn’t rise to that level.” 

"The first reaction of his defeated opponents was to burst out in laughter. Everyone was rich, happy, and having fun"
I feel like LIV could be compared to any high paid star athlete playing on a bad team. they are just going through the motions, knowing they are getting paid anyway. 

I also dont get tying your league to such a politically polarizing individual who comes with the property.  Just look at the owner arranging for a microphone and addressing the crowd. Once again made it about himself and not the actual golf.
Keep feeding that ego and it will be on the first tee taking the spotlight from the game and the golfers
Then again these are some of the only courses that cant get PGA play, so guess the owner needs a consolation prize.

"Young women began tossing Budweisers into the crowd, prompting scuffles."

 

[iacas]

On 10/20/2022 at 7:03 AM, Dinglegolf said:

More in the sense that, rightly or wrongly, they pushed the envelope for the PGA Tour to explore more limited field events to appease the Top 50 players that they perhaps would not have moved on.  

I am more interested in the evolvement of the PGA Tour in a vacuum.  As a viewer, the current limited field events hold no more interest for me than any of the regular tour events, I may watch some of it if I am channel surfing, so I am thinking it is a risk to introduce these events and the financial investment that goes with them, if they are not going to move the viewership needle. 

I’m not sure what limited field events you’re talking about. They are elevating some events but they aren’t limited fields.

[70sSanO]

While it was the Champions Tour, this is probably more typical of the interest in "non-major" golf.  Neither LIV nor the PGA can change it.  A 20 year old Tiger could/did, but there are no names big enough anymore.

https://www.golfdigest.com/story/justin-thomas-tiger-woods-phone-call-fred-couples

John

[Vinsk]

14 minutes ago, 70sSanO said:

While it was the Champions Tour, this is probably more typical of the interest in "non-major" golf.  Neither LIV nor the PGA can change it.  A 20 year old Tiger could/did, but there are no names big enough anymore.

https://www.golfdigest.com/story/justin-thomas-tiger-woods-phone-call-fred-couples

John

 I don’t think there’s ever been  an expectation to be as popular as the NFL.

[iacas]

Hank Haney, man, seriously. Just shut up.

Hank Haney sues the PGA Tour, says it carried "vendetta" against him for tell-all Tiger Woods book | Golf News and Tour Information | Golf Digest

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Golf instructor Hank Haney has filed a lawsuit against the PGA Tour, alleging the tour has harbored a "vendetta" against him.

Like, we get it. You hate the PGA Tour. But stop proving that you're the idiot so many know you to be.

[chspeed]

52 minutes ago, iacas said:

Hank Haney, man, seriously. Just shut up.

Hank Haney sues the PGA Tour, says it carried "vendetta" against him for tell-all Tiger Woods book | Golf News and Tour Information | Golf Digest

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Golf instructor Hank Haney has filed a lawsuit against the PGA Tour, alleging the tour has harbored a "vendetta" against him.

Like, we get it. You hate the PGA Tour. But stop proving that you're the idiot so many know you to be.

I think that's from 2019. Was just looking for cheap publicity is my guess.

[iacas]

1 minute ago, chspeed said:

I think that's from 2019. Was just looking for cheap publicity is my guess.

Yes, it was. The date is on the article.

It speaks to why Haney might be such a LIV Fool.

[dennyjones]

Posted today at mirro.co.uk

"Yeah, it was a good match," Smith said. "I think Phil maybe had some gamesmanship in there a little bit. He seemed to take forever today. I think we were three or four holes behind, so that was a bit painful. But other than that, it was good."

[Bucki1968]

I was playing golf this past Sunday morning with some guys, and we had a couple after the round and were watching the DP tour on golf channel and pre-game NFL stuff.  Not one mention of LIV golf finals. One guy at a table near us mentioned the playoffs but obviously there was no way to watch it on the televisions in the grill. I'm not sure many golf fans really give a shit about LIV golf anymore (as seen by the viewer numbers). I know I don't. I did watch a little on Saturday and kinda liked the team format, but it wouldn't cause me to plan a day around it.

[iacas]

[GolfLug]

Buh baa Sharkie... Back to preening in front of the mirror.

[Darkfrog]

I have heard the rumors about Greg getting fired on golf podcasts for awhile now. I've also heard the podcasters theorize that if Greg gets fired, he will claim that it was all part of the plan from the beginning to bring him in as a disruptor, and then switch to a more of a conciliator front man.

I wonder if LIV had a competent CEO at the get go, how differently things would have gone.

Edited November 11, 2022 by Darkfrog

[GolfLug]

I am curious if Mark King or whoever has an actual high priced death wish. Not that Norman would be jumping for joy but who would want to touch this?