General COVID-19 Topic

[DaveP043]

1 hour ago, JGus said:

My guess would be a very small amount, so i'm really curious on why this is different in your mind?

A few reasons, I suppose.  First, MRNA vaccine science has been around for a while, this isn't really a completely new vehicle.  Second, they HAVE done significant clinical trials.  Sure, I'd prefer to have a number of years of data, but as contagious as COVID is, that's not a luxury we can afford.  Again, the contagious nature of the disease makes it fairly likely that I'll be exposed at some point, with at least a non-negligible possibility that I'll be infected.  And with my age, there's at least a reasonable potential for a bad outcome.  Or that I'll pass the disease to someone else, who'll have a bad outcome.  So I weigh the potential for bad results from the vaccine against the potential for bad results from the disease.  Based on everything I know, my chances work out better if I take the vaccine when its available to me.

[geo63]

1 hour ago, JGus said:

So out of pure curiosity, for everyone who is so anxious to get the COVID shot(s), how many of you have volunteered for free clinical trials/studies in the past?  My guess would be a very small amount, so i'm really curious on why this is different in your mind?

This is not meant to be argumentative, just really curious how everyone views this, especially if you have not, or would not, sign up for other free clinical trials/studies.

And no, I am not in a hurry or plan to get these shots anytime soon.

How could you possibly think this is close to being the same thing?  

[JGus]

13 minutes ago, iacas said:

This isn't anything like a clinical trial.

When it's your time, get your shot.

We can agree to disagree on if this is a 'trial' or not, and again not making this argumentative, we all have our own opinions based on what we have read and/or heard.

There is not enough data proving these shots are safe and effective, just because they were approved under the Emergency Use Authorization doesn't mean we know everything we should know about the short and long term effects.

Again, I have no issues with anyone getting them, it's each individuals decision to make.

6 minutes ago, DaveP043 said:

A few reasons, I suppose.  First, MRNA vaccine science has been around for a while, this isn't really a completely new vehicle.  Second, they HAVE done significant clinical trials.  Sure, I'd prefer to have a number of years of data, but as contagious as COVID is, that's not a luxury we can afford.  Again, the contagious nature of the disease makes it fairly likely that I'll be exposed at some point, with at least a non-negligible possibility that I'll be infected.  And with my age, there's at least a reasonable potential for a bad outcome.  Or that I'll pass the disease to someone else, who'll have a bad outcome.  So I weigh the potential for bad results from the vaccine against the potential for bad results from the disease.  Based on everything I know, my chances work out better if I take the vaccine when its available to me.

Again, not arguing anyone's take on this, just curious on people's view.  And I think everyone should evaluate their decision like you have.-

3 minutes ago, geo63 said:

How could you possibly think this is close to being the same thing?  

Because I do, why do you think it isn't? Do you think the clinical trials leading up to the emergency use decision incorporated enough data that is required to get full FDA approval?  Again, not here to argue, just asking about how people view it.

[iacas]

14 minutes ago, JGus said:

We can agree to disagree on if this is a 'trial' or not, and again not making this argumentative, we all have our own opinions based on what we have read and/or heard.

No, we can't. Just like we can't "agree to disagree" that 2+2 = an elephant. It = 4.

14 minutes ago, JGus said:

Again, I have no issues with anyone getting them, it's each individuals decision to make.

Unfortunately people like you will be delaying the "return to normal" for all the people who understand and trust the science at play here. People making the same uninformed decision you're seemingly going to make will punish the rest of us. You'll be responsible for delaying how quickly we can do things more normally.

[Double Mocha Man]

22 minutes ago, JGus said:

We can agree to disagree on if this is a 'trial' or not, and again not making this argumentative, we all have our own opinions based on what we have read and/or heard.

There is not enough data proving these shots are safe and effective, just because they were approved under the Emergency Use Authorization doesn't mean we know everything we should know about the short and long term effects.

Again, I have no issues with anyone getting them, it's each individuals decision to make.

Again, not arguing anyone's take on this, just curious on people's view.  And I think everyone should evaluate their decision like you have.-

Because I do, why do you think it isn't? Do you think the clinical trials leading up to the emergency use decision incorporated enough data that is required to get full FDA approval?  Again, not here to argue, just asking about how people view it.

Well sheesh JGus... there were 6 months of clinical testing and now 13 million Americans vaccinated without any bad outcomes over the last 3 months (or in the clinical trials).  Perfect... no.  But as Dave said, acceptable in terms of protecting yourself.

In 6 months we all turn into pandemic inoculated zombies.  Hopefully after our best ever August round of golf.

[DaveP043]

Just now, Double Mocha Man said:

But as Dave said, acceptable in terms of protecting yourself.

And protecting those around us, as I mentioned briefly.  

[Double Mocha Man]

3 minutes ago, DaveP043 said:

And protecting those around us, as I mentioned briefly.  

Yes.

In real life many of us try out unproven swing techniques on a lark.  The pabulum we're accepting has undergone no clinical trials, but it sounds like it will work.  Even worse than dying from the Covid vaccines, our golf games go to hell.

Edited February 12, 2021 by Double Mocha Man

[JGus]

11 minutes ago, iacas said:

Unfortunately people like you will be delaying the "return to normal" for all the people who understand and trust the science at play here. People making the same uninformed decision you're seemingly going to make will punish the rest of us. You'll be responsible for delaying how quickly we can do things more normally.

That's a pretty bold statement, I don't really believe that is or will be the case.

1 minute ago, Double Mocha Man said:

13 million Americans vaccinated without any bad outcomes over the last 3 months (or in the clinical trials)

Ok, let's be real here, we all know that is not a true statement.

[Double Mocha Man]

1 minute ago, JGus said:

That's a pretty bold statement, I don't really believe that is or will be the case.

Ok, let's be real here, we all know that is not a true statement.

Okay, several people have had allergic reactions (because they didn't report they had allergic reactions to other vaccines) and one doctor in Miami died because the vaccine triggered a underlying blood disorder.  Out of 13 million I'll take my chances.  To relate it to golf, the odds of a bad outcome are like missing a putt from 1 inch.

[JGus]

3 minutes ago, Double Mocha Man said:

Okay, several people have had allergic reactions (because they didn't report they had allergic reactions to other vaccines) and one doctor in Miami died because the vaccine triggered a underlying blood disorder.  Out of 13 million I'll take my chances.  To relate it to golf, the odds of a bad outcome are like missing a putt from 1 inch.

I understand the odd's and the point about taking a chance, don't argue either one.  When my number is called maybe I will have a different opinion, but for now I'll continue to educate myself until that time comes.

[Double Mocha Man]

2 minutes ago, JGus said:

I understand the odd's and the point about taking a chance, don't argue either one.  When my number is called maybe I will have a different opinion, but for now I'll continue to educate myself until that time comes.

😁 Hopefully it isn't God (or whoever) calling your number.  But the local Health Department...

[ChetlovesMer]

17 minutes ago, Double Mocha Man said:

Okay, several people have had allergic reactions (because they didn't report they had allergic reactions to other vaccines) and one doctor in Miami died because the vaccine triggered a underlying blood disorder.  Out of 13 million I'll take my chances.  To relate it to golf, the odds of a bad outcome are like missing a putt from 1 inch.

I read a really interesting article the other day. Which I can't seem to find now to link it up. If I find it, I'll link it. 

Anyway, like 25 million Americans have been vaccinated so far. Of those like 190 have died. 

At first you're likely to think "Holy Shit! 190 have died!!!!" However, the article goes on to say that if you take into account the age and medical condition of the 25 million who have been vaccinated that more like 500 should have died by now. The 190 who've died all died from things other than being vaccinated. Well, there is that doctor in Miami, the jury is still out on him. Anyway, the point being You're much more likely to die from the virus than the vaccine. And it's not even close. 

So, just remember this 99.99% of everyone who has died in America had eaten potatoes at least once in their lifetimes. 

[saevel25]

What ticked me off is this doctor was fired for giving out vaccines to people who were not yet allowed to get them because the vaccines were going to expire. 

I mean, come on. How stupid is that. I can understand if these were new vaccines, but I think it commendable to not waste such a precious resource. 

[Double Mocha Man]

2 minutes ago, ChetlovesMer said:

I read a really interesting article the other day. Which I can't seem to find now to link it up. If I find it, I'll link it. 

Anyway, like 25 million Americans have been vaccinated so far. Of those like 190 have died. 

At first you're likely to think "Holy Shit! 190 have died!!!!" However, the article goes on to say that if you take into account the age and medical condition of the 25 million who have been vaccinated that more like 500 should have died by now. The 190 who've died all died from things other than being vaccinated. Well, there is that doctor in Miami, the jury is still out on him. Anyway, the point being You're much more likely to die from the virus than the vaccine. And it's not even close. 

So, just remember this 99.99% of everyone who has died in America had eaten potatoes at least once in their lifetimes. 

You're probably more likely to die on a golf course.  From a lightning strike.  From a cart accident.  From that contaminated Polish hot dog sandwich at the turn.

[ChetlovesMer]

Just now, Double Mocha Man said:

You're probably more likely to die on a golf course.  From a lightning strike.  From a cart accident.  From that contaminated Polish hot dog sandwich at the turn.

No way, MAN! That Polish Sausage Is Awesome! ..... 

[Vinsk]

50 minutes ago, JGus said:

That's a pretty bold statement, I don't really believe that is or will be the case.

What you believe and what science is showing us/ has shown us is quite different. What @iacas stated is true. 

Edited February 12, 2021 by Vinsk

[Slim_Pivot]

42 minutes ago, saevel25 said:

What ticked me off is this doctor was fired for giving out vaccines to people who were not yet allowed to get them because the vaccines were going to expire. 

I mean, come on. How stupid is that. I can understand if these were new vaccines, but I think it commendable to not waste such a precious resource. 

What state?

[saevel25]

11 minutes ago, Slim_Pivot said:

What state?

A doctor had 6 hours to use a vial of COVID-19 vaccine before it expired, so he gave the shots to 10 people. For that, he was fired.

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Ten doses of the Covid-19 vaccine would expire within hours, so a Houston doctor gave it to people with medical conditions, including his wife.

Texas