Giving Advice in a Golf League

[Elmer]

I know the rules indicate that a player cannot receive advice from someone other than caddie.
Rule 10 goes on to provide specific information as to requesting and receiving advice. 

I play in a local weekly beer league, where we mostly play by the rules.
We do allow for lift and clean in the fairway and bunkers.
We also don't adhere to the loss of stroke and distance on a lost ball (instead you drop anywhere along the path of entry and take a 1 stroke penalty).
Both these changes were strongly suggested by the course super to combat slow play.

Anyway, I was playing my match the other day against a 20 year old kid,  who is new to the league. His father has been in the league for 20 years and played as part of our group. The entire round the father is basically giving the kid advice. "hit it soft, land it 10 yard short, let the ball roll down". He even provided breaks on putting, and coached him on the speed of putts.

Given that we are a laidback league I am hesitant to bring this up as a rule violation. I do not want to be that guy. And I understand as a father wanting your kids to do well.
But advice all round on nearly every stroke is just excessive.

Anyone have any ideas on how to handle this?
Or just ignore it next time we play?

 

[saevel25]

2 minutes ago, Elmer said:

Given that we are a laidback league I am hesitant to bring this up as a rule violation. I do not want to be that guy. And I understand as a father wanting your kids to do well.
But advice all round on nearly every stroke is just excessive.

Talk to the guy after the round. Do not bring up that it is against USGA rules. Honestly, if you are playing with all those non-conforming rules, just do not be that guy. 

Maybe word it like you understand that it's your kid and he is new to the league, but it is still a match and maybe keep advice to when you guys are not playing in the match. It isn't fair to our team that you are helping out your kid on every shot. 

 

[iacas]

9 minutes ago, Elmer said:

We also don't adhere to the loss of stroke and distance on a lost ball (instead you drop anywhere along the path of entry and take a 1 stroke penalty).

Why not just play the local rule for OB/lost balls?

[Vinsk]

I wouldn’t say anything at all. It wouldn’t bother me in the least bit. And honestly, how much is this advice really improving  his score? 

[Elmer]

52 minutes ago, Vinsk said:

I wouldn’t say anything at all. It wouldn’t bother me in the least bit. And honestly, how much is this advice really improving  his score? 

There is some particular course knowledge which is valuable. Couple holes will always lean right or left, so knowing where to land the ball can be beneficial. 

1 hour ago, iacas said:

Why not just play the local rule for OB/lost balls?

The rule was proposed by the course super many years back, for encourage pace of play. The league voted on it and adopted this rule. 
Since the release of the local rule for OB/lost balls, no one from out league has put the idea up for a vote during a league meeting. 
Or if they did, there was not a quorum or enough votes to advance.

[saevel25]

7 minutes ago, Elmer said:

There is some particular course knowledge which is valuable. Couple holes will always lean right or left, so knowing where to land the ball can be beneficial. 

Some potential really helpful information.

1. Blind tee shots
2. Unknown hazards
3. Break on the greens

 

[boogielicious]

Unless the kid is a ringer, I wouldn’t worry about it. I’d make a joke to the guy something like, “Is your son going to give you half his winnings for being his caddy?”

The only advice I ever gave a fellow league member was for my friend John, who was 70 at the time, to move up to the forward tees to start the season. He won the league that year.😀

[TourSpoon]

10 hours ago, Elmer said:

But advice all round on nearly every stroke is just excessive.

Anyone have any ideas on how to handle this?
Or just ignore it next time we play?

I would ask the dad to start reading your putts. "So Jim, what do you think this one is going to do?" 

Or leave it alone. 

[iacas]

8 hours ago, Elmer said:

The rule was proposed by the course super many years back, for encourage pace of play. The league voted on it and adopted this rule.

But… that's stupid. Just adopt the ACTUAL rule of golf that does the same thing.

You should put the rule up for adoption. It's almost the same thing, AND it's within the rules, not making something up.

[billchao]

7 hours ago, boogielicious said:

Unless the kid is a ringer, I wouldn’t worry about it. I’d make a joke to the guy something like, “Is your son going to give you half his winnings for being his caddy?”

The only advice I ever gave a fellow league member was for my friend John, who was 70 at the time, to move up to the forward tees to start the season. He won the league that year.😀

Did he give you half his winnings?

[pganapathy]

11 hours ago, saevel25 said:

Some potential really helpful information.

1. Blind tee shots
2. Unknown hazards
3. Break on the greens

 

You are entitled to ask for and receive information on the first two.  They come under "architecture" of the hole and also include distance to hazards and green.

It is only the third which can help the son.  Of course, as mentioned earlier, things like play it 10 yards short and run it on also qualifies as advice he can use.

[jsgolfer]

Seems like you're not actually exactly playing by the rules anyways, so does it really matter?  Is the kid winning every week?  

[iacas]

1 minute ago, jsgolfer said:

Seems like you're not actually exactly playing by the rules anyways

Willfully so, yeah.

[colin007]

It's a beer league, who cares?

[mcanadiens]

6 minutes ago, colin007 said:

It's a beer league, who cares?

I find your suggestion that rules shouldn't matter in beer league completely off base. They exist for our safety.

[mdl]

It's a recreational, "laid back", "local weekly beer" golf league with permanent winter rules. This feels like a total non-issue. IMO, friends/families who enjoy the competition and play by the league rules but have a relaxed attitude and enjoy helping each with advice or opinions are exactly the kind of people you want in the kind of league you describe. I'd join in helping the kid get better at course management and reading greens.

[Elmer]

8 minutes ago, mdl said:

It's a recreational, "laid back", "local weekly beer" golf league with permanent winter rules. This feels like a total non-issue. IMO, friends/families who enjoy the competition and play by the league rules but have a relaxed attitude and enjoy helping each with advice or opinions are exactly the kind of people you want in the kind of league you describe. I'd join in helping the kid get better at course management and reading greens.

agree with most everything you said.
except when my opponent hits a bad shot I feel bad. When they duff a bad and waste a great drive, I feel bad.
But if they line up a put wrong, I say nothing.
After all we are playing for bragging rights and a little bit of money, so I want them to do their best but not as well as I do.

Edited May 26, 2023 by Elmer

[mdl]

1 hour ago, Elmer said:

agree with most everything you said.
except when my opponent hits a bad shot I feel bad. When they duff a bad and waste a great drive, I feel bad.
But if they line up a put wrong, I say nothing.
After all we are playing for bragging rights and a little bit of money, so I want them to do their best but not as well as I do.

Ha. Fair enough. I often do the same when playing for like $5 a side with friends or the like. I just mean this sounds more like the dad is annoying and overbearing rather than something I'd even notice as breaking/stretching a rule I don't want broken in my league (unlike what I'd consider "real" cheating, like improving lies or worse). If I knew them fairly well I might have fun harassing them about how they're breaking the rules every time the dad gave advice  😆