LIV Golf Now Closed?

[Big Lex]

I like all the changes the tour announced it is making. The only disagreement I have is with them not welcoming back LIV players. I think if you truly want the best players in the world in your top tier events, you have to welcome back those LIV players who are in that group. Otherwise you don't have _all_ the best players. Enticing these great players to abandon LIV and return to the PGA Tour also has the effect of driving the proverbial wooden stake into the heart of the beast. 

Even the Prodigal Son was welcomed home 🙂

 

[Dinglegolf]

57 minutes ago, Big Lex said:

I like all the changes the tour announced it is making. The only disagreement I have is with them not welcoming back LIV players. I think if you truly want the best players in the world in your top tier events, you have to welcome back those LIV players who are in that group. Otherwise you don't have _all_ the best players. Enticing these great players to abandon LIV and return to the PGA Tour also has the effect of driving the proverbial wooden stake into the heart of the beast. 

Even the Prodigal Son was welcomed home 🙂

 

 

But what if happens if these new "top tier" events fail to generate expected revenues?  

What about if these "top tier" events reduce viewership of the lower tier events and prize money goes down accordingly? 

They maybe shooting themselves in the foot.  

[Darkfrog]

2 hours ago, Big Lex said:

The only disagreement I have is with them not welcoming back LIV players. I think if you truly want the best players in the world in your top tier events, you have to welcome back those LIV players who are in that group.

I agree that having all the best players makes for a more compelling product. On the other hand, allowing LIV players back into the PGAT punishes the guys that didn't leave. If all the LIV players who grabbed $30, 40, 50, 100 million dollar payouts are just welcomed back for the sake of having the best players, I bet there would be some pissed off PGAT players wondering what the point of their loyalty was.

[iacas]

2 hours ago, Big Lex said:

The only disagreement I have is with them not welcoming back LIV players.

Yeah… no.

1 hour ago, Dinglegolf said:

What about if these "top tier" events reduce viewership of the lower tier events and prize money goes down accordingly?

They're non-existent (basically) already.

13 minutes ago, Darkfrog said:

I agree that having all the best players makes for a more compelling product. On the other hand, allowing LIV players back into the PGAT punishes the guys that didn't leave.

Yeah. And it's still a player's tour.

[StuM]

4 hours ago, iacas said:

6 hours ago, Big Lex said:

The only disagreement I have is with them not welcoming back LIV players.

Yeah… no.

What if you welcome them back and then schedule all the Elite events to conflict with the LIV Events.  Now you can say "We welcomed them back" ending any anti-trust challenges, but they would not be able to participate in the Elite events because they have contracts with LIV.  I do not think many would want to breach their contract with LIV and risk the consequences of that action.   This is more sarcasm then an actual idea, but what if? 😜

[iacas]

1 hour ago, StuM said:

What if you welcome them back and then schedule all the Elite events to conflict with the LIV Events.  Now you can say "We welcomed them back" ending any anti-trust challenges, but they would not be able to participate in the Elite events because they have contracts with LIV.  I do not think many would want to breach their contract with LIV and risk the consequences of that action.   This is more sarcasm then an actual idea, but what if? 😜

To what end? Now you're scheduling events against theirs, just to try to trap some people who willingly left your Tour? Why? That's just ten levels too far. It does nothing to really HELP the players who are still ON your Tour.

---

Also, this was a pretty good podcast that addresses A LOT from the PGA Tour player's side of things:

NLU Podcast, Episode 594: Keith Mitchell — No Laying Up - Golf Podcast

[Big Lex]

My thought about welcoming back LIV defectors was that it constitutes a real, post-war "reconstruction" of sorts...demonstrates goodwill...ensures the best of the best are all back in one place. 

But yeah, it sort of glosses over the whole "I took $200 million and F-you" thing. It would undermine the loyalty the non-defectors have shown to the tour. I can't see any tour player being ok with LIV'ers coming back. 

It's all really sad...if the Camerons actually jump, we would be losing 2 huge talents in the golf world. Hopefully the announced changes to the PGA Tour will cause some of these rumored soon-to-be defectors to reconsider. 

[turtleback]

6 hours ago, iacas said:

Yeah… no.

They're non-existent (basically) already.

Yeah. And it's still a player's tour.

I'd be in favor of letting LIV players back.  On the condition that they pay a fine to the PGAT in the amount of any sign on bonus they received from LIV plus 50% of their cumulative winnings in LIV events.

[iacas]

40 minutes ago, turtleback said:

I'd be in favor of letting LIV players back.  On the condition that they pay a fine to the PGAT in the amount of any sign on bonus they received from LIV plus 50% of their cumulative winnings in LIV events.

Ha ha.

Plus they have to pay LIV to get out of their contracts.

I assume you weren’t being serious but that ain’t happening.

[Vinsk]

I wonder if these changes have the ‘7 defectors’ to be announced after the FEC some second thoughts?

[Friz]

1 hour ago, Vinsk said:

I wonder if these changes have the ‘7 defectors’ to be announced after the FEC some second thoughts?

I bet they've already signed contracts, if they're putting such a definitive number out there, they need to be certain it won't go down.

 

As for letting guys back in, I personally don't want them back and neither should the Tour.  I would accept a one time offer to buy their way back in for 100% of all the money they have earned from LIV...good will goes both ways right?  The message that should be sent is that no one is above the rules, doesn't matter if you're second in the world or 200th, rules apply to everyone the same.

[dennyjones]

2 hours ago, turtleback said:

I'd be in favor of letting LIV players back.  On the condition that they pay a fine to the PGAT in the amount of any sign on bonus they received from LIV plus 50% of their cumulative winnings in LIV events.

The Saudis behead infidels for much less.

[Aguirre]

On 8/25/2022 at 7:39 AM, Dinglegolf said:

Hi there, new poster who was looking for some interesting insights into this topic.

I agree with the majority about the obvious intentions of LIV golf and do not have anything to add.  I am interested though about the dynamics/business end of the PGA Tour in a vacuum and the suggested changes being put forth.  

I personally only make an effort to watch the majors and the Ryder Cup while spending a lot of time on many other tournaments when surfing on a Sunday afternoon.  Personally, the WGC events and the Fedex Cup do nothing for me as a viewer as I am an old school "sports" enthusiast who appreciates uncompromised competition.  

I found the comment by Rory that "the top players do not get together enough" interesting as it is basically saying "the top players do have to get together as much given how much money we make".  I have no issue with players wanting more money and leveraging their star power to do so and do not care to see things as "growing the game" or not. 

I am interested on people's thoughts as to whether the proposed changes are really good for the PGA Tour business-wise. 

Cheers

I'm unlikely to tune in more to the new events. I still can't be bothered to care about the "playoffs" anymore than I am a good tournament like The Memorial. My sports calendar is full. Just because we have something closer to 20 premier events on tour on par with The Memorial does not mean my viewership is going up a tick. It's all convenience and time for me. My viewing may go up in July & August, because the sports calendar is dead. That's it. 

So I doubt these changes will make any significant difference. Of course, this also means that LIV won't do any better, either. It's the majors. Everything else is for scraps and is local.

[iacas]

The only one that really matters: Cam Smith. And he matters, but also… don't let the doorknob hit you in the ass on the way out.

[Bucki1968]

HV3 is leaving? Wow. I wonder if Michael Jordan is okay with that? I think I would have gotten his okay first. 😃 Oh...and as stated earlier, don't the door hit you in ass on the way out. 

[DeadMan]

I think Niemann matters a little bit, too. He's 23 and won twice on the PGA Tour. He doesn't fit the profile of the others moving to LIV. That said, he hasn't done anything notable in majors, and I doubt the average fan really cares that much about him.

But, for all the smoke about players moving over the past couple of weeks, to only get Niemann isn't great for LIV. Cam Smith is definitely a big get, but we've known he's moving since the British Open. But the other names? Meh. Cameron Tringale? Nobody cares. Marc Leishman? I liked him, but not a big loss. Anirban Lahiri? Meh.

[jmanbooyaa]

And the participation award league keeps moving forward. All about the money. There is no other explanation. Just be honest about it. 

[Shindig]

I will miss HV3.  I liked him.