LIV Golf (Saudi PIF), "Mergers," and More

[DeadMan]

And we finally have the anti-trust lawsuit:

Phil Mickelson and 10 Other LIV Golfers File Antitrust Lawsuit Against PGA Tour

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Mickelson leads a group of LIV Golf players suing over their suspensions, with three also seeking a temporary restraining order that would allow them to play in the Tour’s FedEx Cup Playoffs

 

[imsys0042]

1 minute ago, DeadMan said:

And we finally have the anti-trust lawsuit:

Phil Mickelson and 10 Other LIV Golfers File Antitrust Lawsuit Against PGA Tour

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Mickelson leads a group of LIV Golf players suing over their suspensions, with three also seeking a temporary restraining order that would allow them to play in the Tour’s FedEx Cup Playoffs

 

Ya know....these guys want to take oodles of money and favor their new employers but continue to cash even more checks at a Tour they are detracting from by doing this.   And golly gee, I thought they wanted to spend more time with their families.

No golfer is bigger than the sport.   Yet Mickelson strikes me as someone who thinks he is.   

[imsys0042]

1 hour ago, Big Lex said:

 

Not Greg Norman. I think he really believes he is doing just that. 

Norman was a long running vendetta with the Tour over what eventually became the World Golf Championships and he's such an egomaniac that I don't think he's given up the grudge.   Norman is incredibly self serving and I doubt there is much in him to care about the overall health of the game of golf.

If there was, I suspect there would be something about giving back to communities that host LIV events, charity partnerships, wanting to contribute to the First Tee, etc.   Maybe something will come later, but their big argument of "grow the game of golf" seems to boil down to getting as many eyeballs on them, which is at the expense of the PGA Tour and the DP World Tour as everyone has to compete for said eyeballs.   And several high profile LIV players have trashed the Tour on the way out.  So that's hardly growing anything.

It is entirely within someone's right to try and start their own golf tour.   However it's also peoples' right to not like what they are doing, and how they are doing it.   And that is part of my take on all of this.   The PGA Tour spends a lot of money trying to make it's players happy.   In the process giving them wealth that sets them up for life and there are so many ways that the Tour helps players cash checks well past their prime.   I don't see Norman or the backers of the LIV Golf tour having that level of concern for their players.   

 

[Vinsk]

7 minutes ago, imsys0042 said:

The PGA Tour spends a lot of money trying to make it's players happy.   In the process giving them wealth that sets them up for life and there are so many ways that the

Not necessarily blaming the guys who’ve made it quite well, but I think it’s in part due to the inevitable loss of reality once they become wealthy. James Hahn showed his utter lack of reality to post ( whine) about the Tour schedule and how hard it is on him to which Scotty Scheffler’s caddie promptly schooled him. Fly around the world playing golf and make millions to do it. Shut up. Bring your family, you have the money. And you’ll be able to retire and spend all the time you want with your family carefree. 

[Shindig]

22 minutes ago, Vinsk said:

Not necessarily blaming the guys who’ve made it quite well, but I think it’s in part due to the inevitable loss of reality once they become wealthy. James Hahn showed his utter lack of reality to post ( whine) about the Tour schedule and how hard it is on him to which Scotty Scheffler’s caddie promptly schooled him. Fly around the world playing golf and make millions to do it. Shut up. Bring your family, you have the money. And you’ll be able to retire and spend all the time you want with your family carefree. 

The hardest part for me is how many players are saying, seriously, something Zach Johnson said in jest on Letterman a decade and a half ago.  "I need to take a vacation from all this golf."

[Friz]

45 minutes ago, Vinsk said:

Not necessarily blaming the guys who’ve made it quite well, but I think it’s in part due to the inevitable loss of reality once they become wealthy. James Hahn showed his utter lack of reality to post ( whine) about the Tour schedule and how hard it is on him to which Scotty Scheffler’s caddie promptly schooled him. Fly around the world playing golf and make millions to do it. Shut up. Bring your family, you have the money. And you’ll be able to retire and spend all the time you want with your family carefree. 

Good lord, I hadn't seen James Hahn's post....thats pretty cringe worthy.  Like, do they not tell the guys they're allowed to skip an event?  He's made over a million dollars this season alone in route to 113th in the FedEx Cup, and he's complaining about not seeing his family for a month.  And then he says this

 

[jbishop15]

46 minutes ago, Friz said:

Good lord, I hadn't seen James Hahn's post....thats pretty cringe worthy.  Like, do they not tell the guys they're allowed to skip an event?  He's made over a million dollars this season alone in route to 113th in the FedEx Cup, and he's complaining about not seeing his family for a month.  And then he says this

 

this is so f***ing funny to me. like, if you dont want to have to play all the time, play better golf at the events you do play at. I'm sorry you're tired of riding the gravy train for two million bucks a year, can-kicking your way to top 25 finishes and FedEx Bonuses with no wins. Get the f*** out of here. 

What a tough life, making all that money, travelling to the best golf courses, in the best cities. God, such a tragedy. 

 

 

Edited August 3, 2022 by jbishop15

[GolfLug]

Guess who is laying down his groundwork to defect to LIV.

[Moxley]

So, reflecting on the actual golf side of this, I watched most of the last day of last weekends tournament. Overall, I thought it was a much better experience than the first one , and it looks like the coverage is getting better (less putting (though still too much), a bit more tee to green for those in contention) to match. I actually found myself being reasonably taken in by the team contest side of things, as Majesticks were in contention and are a largely English team. I think that sort of synergy between the players in teams will be important, at least in the early days for anybody to care. The leaderboard for the players also felt a lot more like a higher level event than the first two, though the strength of the field is still objectively not too strong yet. Still a few things I'm not sure about (music, no cut), and one thing I really can't stand ( shotgun starts ). 

[iacas]

[turtleback]

2 hours ago, Shindig said:

The hardest part for me is how many players are saying, seriously, something Zach Johnson said in jest on Letterman a decade and a half ago.  "I need to take a vacation from all this golf."

The hardest part for me to respect are people with net worths in the tens of million saying they did this to support their families.

 

3 hours ago, imsys0042 said:

No golfer is bigger than the sport.   Yet Mickelson strikes me as someone who thinks he is.   

He and Norman both.

Edited August 3, 2022 by turtleback

[Vinsk]

2 hours ago, Moxley said:

So, reflecting on the actual golf side of this, I watched most of the last day of last weekends tournament. Overall, I thought it was a much better experience than the first one , and it looks like the coverage is getting better (less putting (though still too much), a bit more tee to green for those in contention) to match. I actually found myself being reasonably taken in by the team contest side of things, as Majesticks were in contention and are a largely English team. I think that sort of synergy between the players in teams will be important, at least in the early days for anybody to care. The leaderboard for the players also felt a lot more like a higher level event than the first two, though the strength of the field is still objectively not too strong yet. Still a few things I'm not sure about (music, no cut), and one thing I really can't stand ( shotgun starts ). 

Really? Gosh. Totally different for me. I mean, I love golf…but it’s golf. The announcers trying to act like they’re at an NCAA Final Four 75-75 with 3 seconds less is just annoying. Stenson hits a shot from 130yds within 6’ and Feherty acts like Tiger just holed out on 16 at Augusta. 

[Friz]

Phil Mickelson was suspended by PGA Tour in March for recruiting LIV players; currently serving 2-year ban | Golf News and Tour Information | Golf Digest

 

[phillyk]

9 hours ago, ChetlovesMer said:

I agree. 👍

I just meant that I didn't think he'd alienate folks on this forum by suggesting that LIV Golf was NOT about "growing the game". No matter what side of the political aisle you stand, I'm pretty sure everyone knows that LIV Golf was never about "Growing the game." 

Nope. My buddy eats every word of it. He thinks PGA Tour is about to fail and disappear, to be replaced by LIV. He thinks LIV is better at growing the game than the PGA Tour. He thinks Nike is the same as SA. I’ve given up with it. He is so obsessed with money, that he is blind to all else. 

[Shindig]

56 minutes ago, phillyk said:

Nope. My buddy eats every word of it. He thinks PGA Tour is about to fail and disappear, to be replaced by LIV. He thinks LIV is better at growing the game than the PGA Tour. He thinks Nike is the same as SA. I’ve given up with it. He is so obsessed with money, that he is blind to all else. 

That's ... wow.  I went from being a pretty big Nike fanboy to not being fond of them at all, but at whatever point I held the lowest opinion of Nike that I have held, I never thought they were anywhere as bad as SA.  

[DeadMan]

So I scanned the complaint pretty quickly. Some thoughts:

• The lawyers representing the players are some real heavy hitters. The complaint probably cost around a million dollars for them to draft. These lawyers are the best of the best.
• LIV itself has basically a slam dunk antitrust case against the PGA Tour. It’s not a plaintiff here, though. A lot of the complaint seems like it was written for LIV to be a plaintiff.
• I give the players around a 75% chance to succeed. I don’t know enough about antitrust law to handicap it better, but it seems like a pretty strong case for the players. 
• The PGA Tour is not going to be a good client. There are a lot of stupid things in here that they did. But, they’ve also hired good lawyers, even if they are not quite the same caliber as the players’. 

[Aguirre]

On 8/1/2022 at 9:44 PM, chriskzoo said:

Who is the largest sponsor of the LPGA Tour?

Saudi Aramco. 

 

That would be interesting to me if (a) we were talking about the LPGA tour, (b) they were the SOLE sponsor the LPGA Tour, and (c) I gave a shit about the LPGA tour. 

Triple fail.

[Vinsk]

1. We’re going to LIV Golf because the schedule gives us more time to pursue activities outside golf and be with our families more.

2. We’re suing the PGA TOUR because they won’t let us spend our time outside the LIV GOLF Tour playing golf on the PGA TOUR.