Changes to Handicap System for 2016 Released

[DrvFrShow]

5 hours ago, Braivo said:

Here's the thing, even when I am not playing alone I am usually playing with guys who don't really follow the rules of golf. They allow gimmes and mulligans, etc. I will play by the rules and keep my own score, they have no idea what I am posting.

So they will mark my score down per "their" rules and I keep my own score per the actual rules of golf. Then I go home and post my score to GHIN, they have no idea. I couldn't have them "verify" my score even if I wanted to. 

I don't see how this is any better than playing alone and posting my score. 

As far as enforcement, I know there is a spot in GHIN to enter playing partners, will it simply not allow a score to be posted if you don't have a partner included? 

I follow the rules meticulously. So I will no longer post scores played alone, I feel this will create a HI that is a poor reflection of my actual abilities as only 20-30% of my rounds are played with others. 

But what if your playing partners are not members, you know like about 90% of golfers out there? So if they're not members, you won't be able to post the score?

I guess I'll have to practice more and rely on my gross scores. I mean how often do we say "I shot a 68 Net?" Really? We know what we shot. 

[caniac6]

I get up very early, and walk a quick 9 alone. Probably 90% of my recorded rounds are by myself. I find it odd that a game that has rules enforcement based largely on the honesty and integrity of the participants, the USGA  is making the assumption that solo players are cheaters. 

We enter our scores on a comuter. How will this rule be enforced. How will this keep cheaters from entering inflated scores in the computer? I contacted the USGA, and they are going to refund my dues.

[Rulesman]

19 hours ago, Dormie1360 said:

Have you heard about major changes to both our systems in 2018, basically unifying the two?  I recently heard this but have yet to confirm.

According to CONGU, 2020 is the current target date. It would be impossible for England to rerate all 2000 courses for slope in less time. 

[Braivo]

3 minutes ago, DrvFrShow said:

But what if your playing partners are not members, you know like about 90% of golfers out there? So if they're not members, you won't be able to post the score?

I guess I'll have to practice more and rely on my gross scores. I mean how often do we say "I shot a 68 Net?" Really? We know what we shot. 

Looks like they are moving to limit who can enter official USGA events. I wonder if there were events that prompted this change. Maybe someone won a handicapped event and had played most of their rounds alone?

TBH this change might improve my game. Now when I play alone it will always be a practice round, so I will likely try different things, play two balls, etc. 

[Yukari]

Interesting now that you can no longer post a score when played alone:  http://www.golf.com/tour-and-news/usga-announces-changes-handicap-system-2016

Quote

The USGA announced Monday six major changes to the handicapping system, in tandem with the 2016 release of the Rules of Golf, effective Jan. 1, 2016.

Of note is the inadmissibility of posting solo scores for the purpose of determining a handicap. As of the new year, golfers will not be allowed to count rounds played alone toward their handicap. According to the USGA under Section 5-1: Acceptability of Scores, "this change underscores the importance of providing full and accurate information regarding a player’s potential scoring ability, and the ability of other players to form a reasonable basis for supporting or disputing a posted score."

How will they know?

[DrvFrShow]

2 minutes ago, Braivo said:

Looks like they are moving to limit who can enter official USGA events. I wonder if there were events that prompted this change. Maybe someone won a handicapped event and had played most of their rounds alone?

TBH this change might improve my game. Now when I play alone it will always be a practice round, so I will likely try different things, play two balls, etc. 

Exactly. When playing alone, the course will be my driving range with grass. I did this last August to get my head back in the game. I'd been playing terrible in July, so I went off the system and played practice rounds. There was no USGA official looking over my shoulder. If I hooked my drive into a rocky area, I'd toss the ball back to the fairway and hit from there. I didn't want to reinjure my shoulder hitting from rocks. So tough. I wasn't keeping score anyway. Try a different shot? GW safety shot or hooking a 5 iron. Multiple bunker shots for practice. Practice that putt you missed. Who cares as long as you're not holding up play?

The changes are not for us hackers. The changes are for the people who play in the state amateur championships and US Amateur qualifiers. The US Amateur and who compete internationally. That's who these changes are for. They really don't care about the average hacker because 90% of us don't carry an official handicap. 50% of golfers never break 100. We've seen these people on the courses. When I was a young girl, my next door neighbors were avid golfers and scored routinely about 103. It was a big deal for one of them to score 49 for 9 holes. The USGA only has statistics on those who carry handicaps and they have the average golfer with an 18 handicap? Come on.

[iacas]

39 minutes ago, Braivo said:

The two rounds I posted this year that were played with other golfers tracking their HI were in fact regulars at my home club that play every Saturday and Wednesday. 

Did you post the round you played with us at the outing?  Cuz that is like a 50% increase if you forgot to post that one…

30 minutes ago, Rulesman said:

According to CONGU, 2020 is the current target date. It would be impossible for England to rerate all 2000 courses for slope in less time. 

We have another whole thread on this:

[Braivo]

4 minutes ago, iacas said:

Did you post the round you played with us at the outing?  Cuz that is like a 50% increase if you forgot to post that one…

Ha! I did not as I was picking up on many holes after reaching zero points for our modified Stableford format. But yes, I could have declared and posted that one. 

Overall, this really begs the question, is it really worth it for an amateur recreational golfer such as myself to keep an official index? Maybe this is the intent of the USGA change. 

So far it has done nothing for me other than help me track my improvement. I could do this without the "official" part I suppose. 

[iacas]

5 minutes ago, Braivo said:

Ha! I did not as I was picking up on many holes after reaching zero points for our modified Stableford format. But yes, I could have declared and posted that one. 

You were supposed to have done so. You estimate the likely score you'd have made and post that. If it's ESC, it's ESC.

So (and please take this in the gentle way described), you're on here complaining about a change, while you didn't even follow the rules for handicapping before?

(At the end of the day, we're talking about a game we all play for a little fun and exercise, so who cares what you do, really? )

[billchao]

I'm not really sure why they created an unenforceable rule, but I don't think it will affect me at all. I usually get paired up with strangers on the course anyway, so someone can always "vouch" for my score, even if they're not really paying attention to me or counting my strokes.

I'm just going to continue to take my scorecard home and post my scores to GHIN on my computer (I do this even when I play my "home" course). Maybe I'm naive, but I don't see why I can't keep doing that. If people really take issue with it then I'll just save myself $40 every year.

[Braivo]

4 minutes ago, iacas said:

You were supposed to have done so. You estimate the likely score you'd have made and post that. If it's ESC, it's ESC.

So (and please take this in the gentle way described), you're on here complaining about a change, while you didn't even follow the rules for handicapping before?

(At the end of the day, we're talking about a game we all play for a little fun and exercise, so who cares what you do, really? )

First of all, I am not really complaining about the change at this point. It really doesn't change anything for me. I have accepted it and moved on. Meh. 

Secondly, you are correct. I started tracking an index this year and didn't fully understand the rules for doing so. Part of that is out of laziness and part because it doesn't really matter. Was I partially aware that I should have posted that round? Sure. Was I motivated to grab a scorecard, keep my own score, including ESC, and then post it? No, not really. 

Perhaps this makes the same point the USGA is making with this change. To move back to a more rigid HI system with more controls and peer review is probably best for maintaining the integrity of their sanctioned events. Keeps lazy weekend golfers such as myself from going anywhere near them, that is wise on their part. 

[DrvFrShow]

I feel the same way @billchao does. If they're going to enforce it via something like requiring that at least one member of your foursome be a GHIN member, I may save myself the $40. 

@Braivo If you have a system like Game Golf, that will keep track of your stats and help you track improvement. Unless you are playing in a league where they require GHIN, or are entering tournaments where they require an official handicap, you might want to save the money and get something like Game Golf or Arrcos Golf that will track your statistics and probably be more useful to you in the long run at least until you break into the single digits.

So do you plan to play in a league? or Men's Club? 

Golf stores in the area have a "club" you can join and get access to GHIN. So will they be the ones to attest the scores? Will Dick's attest the scores? You enter the scores via your cell phone app. 

 

[mcanadiens]

Hmm. Well I thought I'd pick back up with handicap in the spring. Now it seems like more of a hassle. I guess it's either 1) Play more men's assoc. events (or try to make friends), 2) Ignore the rule or 3) Forget the damn HI all together. 

Full disclosure, I didn't bother copying my round from Eagle Creek either, but it probably would have helped my number if I had. 

 

 

[Grumpter]

1 hour ago, iacas said:

Okay, so they're moving toward the second.

I'm curious, for those of you super opposed to this, what % of the rounds played by those with handicaps in the U.S. you think are played solo.

Cuz it's probably a very small number, generally speaking.

I wouldn't want to venture a guess as my sample size is not large enough to come to an educated guess. Generally speaking what percentage of sandbaggers do you think come from those that play a large number of solo rounds? Cuz it's probably very small, generally speaking. I would guess the very large majority of players do more to hurt their handicap (not count strokes) when playing solo. The only clear sandbagger I know plays with other players a large majority of the time... but there is that small sample size again. All we can do is guess.

[mvmac]

1 hour ago, iacas said:

Cuz it's probably a very small number, generally speaking.

That would be my take as well.

[Fourputt]

2 hours ago, iacas said:

Okay, so they're moving toward the second.

I'm curious, for those of you super opposed to this, what % of the rounds played by those with handicaps in the U.S. you think are played solo.

Cuz it's probably a very small number, generally speaking.

Yeah.  Most players who carry an official handicap do so because they want to regularly play competitively with others.  if that's the case then this is not a factor.  If you only play a few competitions and the rest of the time alone, then I guess you'll have suffer the consequences of a slowly changing handicap.  This rule is aimed at the great bulk of players who play most rounds with others, and who play a good proportion of those rounds in some sort of competition, even if it's only for an after round beer.  

I'm about the only person I know who feels the need to maintain an official handicap, yet I haven't played a competition round in 4 years now.  I just do it out of habit, and just in case I need it without warning.  

[Asheville]

8 hours ago, Fourputt said:

Stat tracking has little or nothing to do with handicap anyway.  I don't see a reason for connecting them in any official way.  You can still track your stats from every round as you always have.

Why?  You post qualifying rounds and don't post those which don't qualify.  The spreads or averages shouldn't be significantly different.

Nothing complicated about it.  If you play alone, don't post.  If you play with others, post.  Pretty simple.

It adds a level of peer review, however small that may be at times.  Even most cheaters don't want to be caught out when cheating (even by other cheaters), so they might not do the same things when others are within viewing distance of their play.  It's certainly no guarantee, but then what is?  The only solution that might be more effective would be to limit official handicap tracking to club members when playing with other club members, and that would eliminate most public course players.

Keep in mind that this is only slightly different from what the handicap system required about 20 years ago.  In the early 90's and before, you had to have every returned scorecard signed and attested to by someone you played with.  Playing alone was not an option for handicap purposes, because all cards posted for handicap were reviewed and entered by your organization's handicap committee.  If I showed up at the course as a single and got paired with strangers, I had to ask one of those strangers to sign my card after the round so I could return it.  Even that wasn't really a big deal.  The new policy is certainly more lax than that.

Stop bringing sanity to the table! Reason is poison, don't you know? 

[boogielicious]

17 hours ago, iacas said:

Okay, so they're moving toward the second.

I'm curious, for those of you super opposed to this, what % of the rounds played by those with handicaps in the U.S. you think are played solo.

Cuz it's probably a very small number, generally speaking.

I think I've played one round this year solo. Usually my solo rounds are late in the year, after the HC is closed anyway. The courses usually are too busy otherwise and I get paired.