Making the natural fit the unnatural is the question.

[mvmac]

11 minutes ago, DaveP043 said:

And in those 18 pages, he never once discusses the "natural" position of either hand, or arm, or anything else.

Right.

There's not a lot of "natural" things going on with the golf swing so why would we have a "natural" arm/hand position? And we don't even know the context of what @collapse means by natural since he can't even define it.

3 minutes ago, collapse said:

My guess is he goes to low double or high single much more rapidly than currently seen.

Only if he's working on the correct pieces of his swing. It doesn't just "happen" because his grip is better.

[Patch]

My $0.02 worth on the grip is that there is no " one fits all" grip.  I am a good example of this. When folks first see my grip they might ask why my "Vs" point more towards my chin than the more accepted right collar bone/shoulder area. That's just my grip, and is unique to my own swing. My grip gets me to the top and back down again to my desired impact position. I found it by expierimenting with it. 

[collapse]

I never said BH used the term natural.I said he stressed the importance of the grip....me too.

3 minutes ago, Patch said:

My $0.02 worth on the grip is that there is no " one fits all" grip.  I am a good example of this. When folks first see my grip they might ask why my "Vs" point more towards my chin than the more accepted right collar bone/shoulder area. That's just my grip, and is unique to my own swing. My grip gets me to the top and back down again to my desired impact position. I found it by expierimenting with it. 

One issue ducked by the posters is-do tour pros grip the club in the lead hand first?....what do you say?

[boogielicious]

5 minutes ago, collapse said:

I never said BH used the term natural.I said he stressed the importance of the grip....me too.

 

1 hour ago, collapse said:

Boogie....Hogan's book devotes 19 pages of the most detailed work on the grip.The grip is the most important thing,every big name player says so.

 

55 minutes ago, collapse said:

My comment about Hogan's book and big name players is accurate.

Hogan wrote about how HE grips the club, not how WE should grip the club. Jack wrote about how HE grips the club and not how WE should grip the club. Tiger wrote about how HE grips the club and not how WE should grip the club. And guess what?? Wait for it? All three grip differently. And different from Arnold and Snead and Nelson and Player and Rory and Spieth and Day. All different.

You know why? Because they all have different hands and different bodies. But, you know what they all did the same?  You know the answer to that. There are 5 things they all did in common. Grip was not one of them.

[mvmac]

6 minutes ago, collapse said:

I never said BH used the term natural.I said he stressed the importance of the grip....me too.

Geez talk about moving the goalpost. I think the grip is important as well, reason why I started a detailed thread about it.

YOU are the one that started a thread about natural and un-natural positions as they relate to the grip and said it was the most important thing.

8 minutes ago, collapse said:

One issue ducked by the posters is-do tour pros grip the club in the lead hand first?....what do you say?

Not all of them. Sergio grips it with the right hand only then puts his left on.

 

[DrvFrShow]

1 hour ago, saevel25 said:

Then why does every PGA tour player grip the club differently. Who is right? Furyk with his double overlap? Zach Johnson with his strong grip? Rory with his neutral to weak grip? What about those who use the Vardan grip? What about those who use the interlocking grip? What about Moe with the grip more in his palms? 

Tiger Woods changed grips from Butch Harmon to Hank Haney and still played equally as well. 

All facts point that the grip is not significant. 

I'll go as far as saying that every tour player, and your better teaching professionals understand something about dynamic lie that we amateurs do not. Changing the grip will change the dynamic lie. So each one of these players will have clubs fitted so that they can deliver a 0.0 dynamic lie angle. One of the big differences between a pro, scratch and handicap golfer is that the handicap golfer is less likely to be able to be able to deliver the club head to that 0.0 +/- degree lie angle consistently in a variety of conditions on the course. 

So it's not so much having the "perfect grip" as it is being able to deliver that lie angle square to target on the desired flight path and do both consistently, thus making consistent solid contact with the ball and having the ball go close to target.

A grip done exactly as described in the books or taught by my instructor doesn't stop me from hitting a shot fat or thin. Those are other swing faults. FWIW I use a strong Vardon grip. I noticed the same thing about Garcia taking the grip right hand first, Also Lydia Ko does the same thing. I decided to copy them. It seems to help me get the club better lined up with target.

Edited December 18, 2015 by DrvFrShow

[Vinsk]

3 hours ago, collapse said:

You refuse the look at the originally posted photo,one which is commonly acknowledged as being the natural arm hang .

Natural to whom?

Iacas has stated what I believe is the cornerstone of why you are swatting sand fleas while the elephants are charging you: this entire "natural hands" nonsense is the least of your problems. You are focused way too much on small discrepancies of a golf swing and are trying to sprinkle 1/2tsp of sugar onto a giant pile of bs to mask the odor. Now come on @mythbuster/Collapse.....take off the straight jacket and get on board.

[Patch]

2 hours ago, collapse said:

I never said BH used the term natural.I said he stressed the importance of the grip....me too.

One issue ducked by the posters is-do tour pros grip the club in the lead hand first?....what do you say?

I dont know what tour pros do or dont do when it comes to gripping a club. Me, I grip with my lead hand first. 

[Pretzel]

3 hours ago, collapse said:

One issue ducked by the posters is-do tour pros grip the club in the lead hand first?....what do you say?

Well, the more important question is why does it matter which order they grip the club in? It's the final product, the grip, that needs to be fundamentally sound, not the order in which they grip the club with their hands.

[Ernest Jones]

I thought this was a thread about porn. I'm a little disappointed. 

[mcanadiens]

18 minutes ago, Ernest Jones said:

I thought this was a thread about porn. I'm a little disappointed. 

It must be getting a bit cold in La belle province. Which hand do you use first?

 

[Ernest Jones]

I establish my grip with right hand. Sometimes I'll add my left hand for control. 

[14ledo81]

58 minutes ago, Ernest Jones said:

I establish my grip with right hand. Sometimes I'll add my left hand for control. 

 

I think I need to get a longer grip.  My grip only allow for one-handed gripping.

[Ernest Jones]

10 minutes ago, 14ledo81 said:

 

I think I need to get a longer grip.  My grip only allow for one-handed gripping.

Sometimes I like to go with a long thumb. 

 

Lol. 

[Dave325]

And so then, which grip is the correct and more natural one... Overlapping, Interlocking or baseball? A rhetorical question, I know. So when can we see a video demonstration from the OP on this subject, @collapse?

[Vinsk]

@collapse/@mythbuster has no intention on posting any videos of what he's writing about. Fine. But there's no excuse to ignore the questions asked to him if he has any seriousness to this at all (which I don't believe he does.) When the jokes from other posters become much more entertaining than the OP, it's time to bail.

[Pretzel]

2 hours ago, Vinsk said:

@collapse/@mythbuster has no intention on posting any videos of what he's writing about. Fine. But there's no excuse to ignore the questions asked to him if he has any seriousness to this at all (which I don't believe he does.) When the jokes from other posters become much more entertaining than the OP, it's time to bail.

Nah, that's when you join in. 

@14ledo81, it doesn't sound to be like your issue is with has the grip itself. I think you should look into the possibility of reshafting as a solution to your problem. 

[14ledo81]

1 hour ago, Pretzel said:

Nah, that's when you join in. 

@14ledo81, it doesn't sound to be like your issue is with has the grip itself. I think you should look into the possibility of reshafting as a solution to your problem. 

That would probably do it.  New shaft is just not in the budget though.... :)