Respect (Or Lack Thereof) for Singles/Walkers

[imsys0042]

I've never had an issue playing multiple balls.  I used to live in NJ and courses are always full so it's hard to play as a single on a lot of courses.   In the rare times it would happen, no one had an issue with it.  A golfer who fixes divots and ball marks will cause less harm than someone who doesn't and is only playing one ball.  Here in Pittsburgh there are more opportunities and I've never had someone tell me not to do it.   Couple of times I've also gotten the "hit a few extra and relax" from the starter. 

[gregsandiego]

8 hours ago, saevel25 said:

I've done it before and never kept groups waiting. 

I know a handful of golf courses that will not let singles or doubles have tee times before noon on weekends. Besides that I've never seen a golf course deny a single golfer a tee time during the day. 

 

 

2 years ago I called 4 or 5 courses  looking for one that would let me go on as a DOUBLE.  Just give me any time I said that works for you, where I can be assured not to be teamed up with others. Only one would do it and that was a maybe.

So where I play anyway the behavior is different. You can walk in as a single but you can't tee off that way.

[Bucki1968]

I have found that if I am going to be a single the best time to play is to be the first guy out early in the morning. I can do this in the summer because I'm a teacher and off during summers. Living in Florida, if you can handle the heat, you can usually get out during the middle of the day and not run into too much traffic. 

[JonMA1]

1 hour ago, Hardspoon said:

The argument against it is that you are paying for one greens fee, but incurring wear-and-tear on the course that is equivalent to multiple rounds.

I'm not saying I agree, but that's a logical reason to have a problem with it. 

Ok @Hardspoonand @gregsandiego, that's a legitimate argument. If those singles are walking, fixing divots/ball marks and raking bunkers - even if they play multiple balls - any extra wear and tear is minimal, almost nil. But it's a valid point. If you asked the managers of the courses I play, they wouldn't care as long as I was considerate to others.

I guess the thread has drifted a bit off-topic. Maybe what it comes down to is that courses that are hurting for business welcome singles. With very busy courses, it makes sense to group them with others. As far as other golfers treating us differently, I don't understand the mentality. I've either never experienced it or was totally oblivious when it did occur.

[imsys0042]

56 minutes ago, JonMA1 said:

 

I guess the thread has drifted a bit off-topic. Maybe what it comes down to is that courses that are hurting for business welcome singles. With very busy courses, it makes sense to group them with others. As far as other golfers treating us differently, I don't understand the mentality. I've either never experienced it or was totally oblivious when it did occur.

The mentality on my current course is that people "pay a lot of money to not be bothered".  Several people have apparently told the pro shop that when people have complained about being held up with room in front.  The irony is that for the course we play is not overly expensive for as nice as it is. 

[Fourputt]

21 hours ago, gregsandiego said:

Seems obvious to me. How long does it take to hit two balls vs one? The "resource" is time on the course, which is what you are paying for.

Let's use a a thought experiment if that's not clear. How about the single hitting 4 balls? Would that make sense?  Or why not 5 or 6 ?

Hate is a strong word. I should say I exercise nothing but courtesy on the course - even if I disagree with the practice. I consider this an academic discussion. No need for name calling.

You are really full of yourself, aren't you?  You have experience in one tiny part of the world and you want to impose your minuscule knowledge of the golf industry on everyone else.  You need to step back and relax.

20 hours ago, drmevo said:

Check your logic.  That would make expected pace of play for 18 holes 2.4 hours.  I guess that course overbooks? 

Already answered, but 8 minute tee intervals does not mean 8 minutes to play each hole.

20 hours ago, Jeremie Boop said:

To be fair, he didn't say 8 minutes per hole, he said 8 minutes from the time you tee off to being on the green preferably. Which is pretty accurate as a 4 hour round is just over 13 minutes per hole which would include traveling from green to next tee.  So about 12 minutes on average to play a hole and just over a minute to get to the next. 

Actually the 8 minutes is play your tee shots and then hit your second shots and clear the landing area.  He is correct in one thing he's said, and that is that 8 minutes is too tight to work smoothly on a busy golf course - it leaves the player no room for error.

10 hours ago, gregsandiego said:

It sure seems like I have the minority opinion here. Me and the guys that seem to run golf courses that is.

Do they allow singles to play 2 balls?

Do they routinely allow singles to go off during the day?

 

As I answered before ,yes me and the guys that run golf courses.

Yes and yes.  I worked as a starter for 5 years on a typically busy course in the Denver metro area.  We staggered 8 and 9 minute intervals from open until 10:30 each day, then 9 minutes for the rest of the day.  But we also allowed singles to reserve tee times, although a single would usually be slotted with another shorthanded group if such was available near the time that he wanted to play.  Such pairing was not an option.  The only way a player could be guaranteed of being able to play alone was to pay all 4 green fees for his tee time.  I never saw anyone wanting solitude badly enough to do that.

When a player or players got on the course, the only requirement that the course had for them was that they keep pace with the group in front.  If they could do that while playing 2 balls, then go for it (to be honest, I rarely saw that even from a single during slow times).  If they hold up other players then they can expect to see the ranger, or I would talk to them as them made the turn.  That would apply regardless of the reason for them playing too slow.

[iacas]

13 hours ago, gregsandiego said:

It sure seems like I have the minority opinion here. Me and the guys that seem to run golf courses that is.

Do they allow singles to play 2 balls?

Do they routinely allow singles to go off during the day?

Yes, and yes.

And I asked the guys at the two courses at which I have standing, and they said "yes, and yes."

Will a course ALWAYS let you take a tee time for a single during their busy times? No. But you're not talking about that kind of common sense approach.

And a single can play two balls if they're just playing a practice round. What's it to you? Or anyone else if they're keeping pace, and taking care of the course?

[Hardspoon]

2 hours ago, Fourputt said:

But we also allowed singles to reserve tee times

In my experience, that's actually pretty rare.  I think most courses want to be sure that if a foursome tries to reserve a time, they have as many options open as possible.

What bothers me is courses that have a blanket policy to prohibit single tee times - there is a course near me that won't let you make a tee time even if there is a threesome booked.  That seems silly.

I actually dislike playing alone, so even as a single I'd try to get paired up, and would discourage the starter from sending me out without a group.

2 hours ago, Fourputt said:

When a player or players got on the course, the only requirement that the course had for them was that they keep pace with the group in front.  If they could do that while playing 2 balls, then go for it (to be honest, I rarely saw that even from a single during slow times).  If they hold up other players then they can expect to see the ranger, or I would talk to them as them made the turn.  That would apply regardless of the reason for them playing too slow.

That seems to be the policy as well on most courses I've played.  Keep pace, take care of the course, and they don't care.

[Shooting29]

since @gregsandiego has the argument that a single uses more course resources by hitting two balls I would argue his index of 30 causes him to use significantly more course resources than my 2.6

 

[No Mulligans]

5 hours ago, gregsandiego said:

2 years ago I called 4 or 5 courses  looking for one that would let me go on as a DOUBLE.  Just give me any time I said that works for you, where I can be assured not to be teamed up with others. Only one would do it and that was a maybe.

So where I play anyway the behavior is different. You can walk in as a single but you can't tee off that way.

Really early morning Tecolote, a lot of players go off as singles and the pace is usually fast, less than 2 hours.  (Unless you're unlucky and get behind a threesome or foursome.)

[Golfingdad]

8 minutes ago, Shooting29 said:

since @gregsandiego has the argument that a single uses more course resources by hitting two balls I would argue his index of 30 causes him to use significantly more course resources than my 2.6

 

I propose a new, tiered fee system, where the course charges you per usage.    $0.33 per stroke.  Add a nickel for every divot (a dime if you didn't fill it with sand) and a quarter for every ball mark created (subtract a nickel for every extra ball mark repaired).  Obviously you pay at the end. Genius.

The added bonus would be that if you didn't have an official handicap, you could calculate one from your credit card statement. :P

[Hardspoon]

8 minutes ago, Shooting29 said:

since @gregsandiego has the argument that a single uses more course resources by hitting two balls I would argue his index of 30 causes him to use significantly more course resources than my 2.6

Huh. Maybe you're just kidding around (in which case an emoticon goes a long way), but I think one of the unwritten rules on this site is to not insult people because of their playing ability.

[Shooting29]

Just now, Hardspoon said:

Huh. Maybe you're just kidding around (in which case an emoticon goes a long way), but I think one of the unwritten rules on this site is to not insult people because of their playing ability.

I don't use emoticons. The point wasn't to insult but to point out the ridiculousness of the argument using his own argument against him.

[imsys0042]

25 minutes ago, Golfingdad said:

I propose a new, tiered fee system, where the course charges you per usage.    $0.33 per stroke.  Add a nickel for every divot (a dime if you didn't fill it with sand) and a quarter for every ball mark created (subtract a nickel for every extra ball mark repaired).  Obviously you pay at the end. Genius.

The added bonus would be that if you didn't have an official handicap, you could calculate one from your credit card statement. :P

I'd enjoy that.   I'm good for fixing other ball marks and I rarely take a divot.  33 cents per shot would put me around $25 - $27 per round.  That's cheap!

[Patch]

44 minutes ago, Golfingdad said:

I propose a new, tiered fee system, where the course charges you per usage.    $0.33 per stroke.  Add a nickel for every divot (a dime if you didn't fill it with sand) and a quarter for every ball mark created (subtract a nickel for every extra ball mark repaired).  Obviously you pay at the end. Genius.

The added bonus would be that if you didn't have an official handicap, you could calculate one from your credit card statement. :P

Not a good idea for me as I  now only pay $0.25 a stroke  when I walk 18 holes. Somedays it's even lower. Other days  higher. 

[Golfingdad]

48 minutes ago, Hardspoon said:

Huh. Maybe you're just kidding around (in which case an emoticon goes a long way), but I think one of the unwritten rules on this site is to not insult people because of their playing ability.

 

45 minutes ago, Shooting29 said:

I don't use emoticons. The point wasn't to insult but to point out the ridiculousness of the argument using his own argument against him.

Yeah, I can't speak for @gregsandiego, but as a third party, this is how I read the post.  I don't think he was trying to insult.  However, I will agree with @Hardspoon by simply saying that the same argument can be made without the personalization.

Anyways, moving on ... 

[mcanadiens]

Reading some of this stuff, makes me realize that I don't have it too bad. Most of the players out on my courses are pretty considerate. Sometimes that means playing through, sometimes you join em and sometimes there's nowhere to go. The only exceptions are usually the true newbs, who generally don't know better.

My threesome got stuck behind newbs yesterday. It was the full deal. A foursome that couldn't hit the ball, couldn't find the ball and didn't know how the effectively use their carts. The other two left on the 15th to make dinner time. Same hole, I had a safe shot that landed 20 yards from the green, while they were putting out. They apologized as they let me through. The course was a really crummy choice for four rank beginners to try to learn on. I politely suggested they hit the par-3. That's where I spent a lot of time early on.

I've never had somebody cut in front of me on the tee box. That would definitely be a confrontation. 

[schuff]

The course I play lets a few singles tee off up to thirty minutes before the first tee time depending on sunrise.

Everyone in the clubhouse knows us and we all play single so we can knock out 18 in 2 hours and go to work. 

We generally start teeing off at 5:30am and wave the flag to signal the next guy. The first tee time is 6am.

So the other day I'm the last single out and am standing on the blue tee box. 4 seniors go straight to the senior tees on their carts at 5:45am just as the guy ahead of me reaches the green. They yell back "we have the first tee time." I explain we go before the first tee time so groups aren't hawked down by singles all morning and they get irate. 

While I'm explaining two of them have already teed off. So I go back to the blue tee box and tee off driving my ball right over their tee box while they are still on the tee box waiting for the last guy. 

I drive past them and don't say a word and finish out the 18. When I get back the head pro told me they were so upset that the first tee time didn't go first that they left.