Is Joe LaCava Tiger's Best Choice of Caddie?

[NM Golf]

On 4/16/2018 at 7:26 AM, 3jacker said:

 Caddies are overrated.

Ummm no they're not. Not in the heat of things. A lot of these guys rely heavily on their caddies to do what they do.

Back on topic, I have no idea if LaCava is the best guy for Tiger. All I can see is he has caddied for some of the best players on Tour, and he has a wealth of knowledge from doing what he does for the past 30 years. Tiger is just never going to be the Tiger of old. He's in his 40s now and I can attest to the fact lots of things change, attitudes, priorities, hell your body starts to friggin hurt. Tiger is in the twilight of his PGA Tour career. He might win again a time or two, but that won't be because of what Joe LaCava did or didn't do.

Edited April 17, 2018 by NM Golf

[SmiterofPV1x]

I was on the fence (per the first post, that's the right thing IMO as well), but ultimately went with yes. Tiger is at the point in his career where he just needs someone to show up, keep up, and shut up. Again, only my opinion but I'm about the same age as Tiger. If anyone where to tell me to "hit this" or "hit that" when I was in Tigers shoes, I'd find someone the following week that showed up, kept up, and shut up. To think anyone knows more about his game or his mental state than him is just something I can't get behind. I've never been afraid to have an opposing opinion so this one is mine. 

I can see it both ways though, I just lean slightly more towards the view I have. At this point if Tiger isn't hungry, that's on him. If he doesn't win another major, that's on him. But the thought of anyone knowing his game better than he does just doesn't make much sense to me. 

Now if his caddie wasn't able to tell him the proper drop, that's a whole entire different conversation. That's the one thing that really gives me pause. Then again, that's as much or more on Tiger than his caddie. Especially if he doesn't encourage dialogue on how to navigate a course. I don't know the rule book inside and out, just like most golfers. But you can bet it to a 100% certainty that if I was on Tigers bag, I'd know every single rule and be able to recite them on command. 

[3jacker]

Any highly-respected, highly-sought caddie is likely thinking twice about working for him.

Caddies make money when players win.  Not when players make money, or get endorsements or interviews.  It's all about winning and getting the extra $$ to make it worthwhile.

Tiger hasn't proven he has much to offer in that regard for a while.  

In addition, he's weird, unloyal, and a dick.  He WILL treat his caddie poorly, then act friendly, then freeze him out of his life forever. It's just a matter of time.  Ask any swing coach or former caddie. 

It's tolerable when he's a cash machine. Not so much now.

[Vinsk]

33 minutes ago, 3jacker said:

.  Ask any swing coach or former caddie. 

Are you either of these? Or have you?

[Big C]

On ‎4‎/‎16‎/‎2018 at 3:01 AM, sofingaw said:

By the strictest, most basic interpretation of the question, no. 

Joey LaCava is almost certainly not the absolute best choice out of all possible caddies out there for Tiger. There are hundreds of very very good caddies of which, at least one would very likely be better than Mr. LaCava for Tiger in some way.

Good post and likely true. I'm sure there are some, if not many, caddies that possess the attributes that Tiger values and might be better than LaCava in terms of overall fit & performance. 

That said, my feeling is that yes, LaCava is the best fit for Tiger based on what he prioritizes and the information he has available to him at this time. 

On ‎4‎/‎14‎/‎2018 at 1:07 PM, iacas said:

Maybe that's what Tiger wants. Maybe he has lost some of his drive and passion and just wants to be a happier, less focused guy on the course. Maybe he doesn't want to have a guy getting in his face demanding something during his rounds.

This paragraph basically sums up my feelings on the matter. My suspicion is that Tiger knows there are probably a few guys out there who could push his limits a bit more, and possibly squeeze an extra stroke out of him here and there. But I also believe that for as much as he recognized Steve Williams' skills in that regard, there were a lot of things about Stevie that irked him and rubbed him the wrong way. 

I think Tiger is willing to accept a more pleasant overall experience with his caddie, even if it might not maximize his scoring potential.

 

[rehmwa]

I suspect LaCava is doing exactly what Tiger is asking him to.  (maybe not what he "needs" though)

Masters - There was a par 3 where Tiger was between clubs and he finally settled on one.  I thought that was a great moment for the caddie to, at a minimum to do something:

1 - just make a comment to Tiger that his final choice was a good one and help him mentally commit to that choice

2 - TELL him which club he thought best suited the shot at the moment

3 - be silent and say nothing and let Tiger vacillate

 

He ended up doing #3, Tiger didn't commit, and he hit it long - IMO #3 was the only wrong answer....

[1badbadger]

The way I see it, if Joe LaCava isn't what Tiger is looking for in a caddie, he wouldn't keep him on the bag for the last 7 years.  That's more than twice as long as Fluff was on the bag!

LaCava is a low-key guy who does his job "under the radar".  He's worked for the top players on Tour and doesn't bounce around very much.  That tells me he's doing something right.  20 years with Couples and the last 7 with Tiger?  That's pretty strong.  Add Ken Green, Davis Love, Justin Leonard, Mike Hulbert, John Cook, and Dustin Johnson to the resume and you have a major league caddie who has been in many big-time situations.  Tiger isn't the same player he was 10-15 years ago, so maybe a different type of caddie is just what is needed.

[iacas]

3 hours ago, 3jacker said:

Caddies make money when players win.  Not when players make money, or get endorsements or interviews.  It's all about winning and getting the extra $$ to make it worthwhile.

Tiger was paying LaCava to not caddie, and this year Tiger is 42nd and has earned $1.2M (not counting the HERO).

3 hours ago, 3jacker said:

In addition, he's weird, unloyal, and a dick.  He WILL treat his caddie poorly, then act friendly, then freeze him out of his life forever. It's just a matter of time.  Ask any swing coach or former caddie. 

I've know some former swing coaches. He's only ever really had three caddies, and only two are "former." By what they will say, you're largely incorrect.

34 minutes ago, 1badbadger said:

The way I see it, if Joe LaCava isn't what Tiger is looking for in a caddie, he wouldn't keep him on the bag for the last 7 years.  That's more than twice as long as Fluff was on the bag!

The question doesn't ask if LaCava is what Tiger wants.

[GolfLug]

I think Lacava might be ok for now. IMO TW's caddie should probably not be top 3 (or top 4,5..) on the priority list as a concern to be addressed at the moment anyway.    

Eventually as he gets further into 'hunt mode' a more decision making involved caddie might benefit him. I believe that a caddie does not necessarily contribute towards winning or losing as much as simply being part of the everyday support system. So it is probably more important that there is a 'personality' match. Yin to the yang type match. 

Tiger is obviously a unique mind but he is also a very rich man in his 40s (as opposed to a very rich man in his 20s and 30s..:-)) so a Stevie type demanding fella might come across as more of an annoyance than anything else at this stage of his life. Not much room for another alpha.  

I would suspect LaCava can probably carry a more informed conversation about March madness than Stevie could. 

Edited April 20, 2018 by GolfLug

[Valleygolfer]

3 hours ago, iacas said:

I've know some former swing coaches. He's only ever really had three caddies, and only two are "former." By what they will say, you're largely incorrect.

I like how @3jackerseems to know this stuff so well...

[The Hook Meister]

I voted yes, I think this what tiger thinks he needs right now..

[Patch]

For those who feel LaCava is not a good fit, who would you suggest is a better choice to carry Woody's bag?

[Valleygolfer]

5 hours ago, Patch said:

For those who feel LaCava is not a good fit, who would you suggest is a better choice to carry Woody's bag?

Well "patchy" I don't think any of us know caddies personally so this world be complete speculation on someone's personality. I can only think of maybe one caddie that I knew a little about which is why it is difficult to say if Lavaca in a poor fit.

[Moxley]

On 20/04/2018 at 7:13 PM, GolfLug said:

I think Lacava might be ok for now. IMO TW's caddie should probably not be top 3 (or top 4,5..) on the priority list as a concern to be addressed at the moment anyway.    

Eventually as he gets further into 'hunt mode' a more decision making involved caddie might benefit him. I believe that a caddie does not necessarily contribute towards winning or losing as much as simply being part of the everyday support system. So it is probably more important that there is a 'personality' match. Yin to the yang type match. 

Tiger is obviously a unique mind but he is also a very rich man in his 40s (as opposed to a very rich man in his 20s and 30s..:-)) so a Stevie type demanding fella might come across as more of an annoyance than anything else at this stage of his life. Not much room for another alpha.  

I would suspect LaCava can probably carry a more informed conversation about March madness than Stevie could. 

 

Yeah, I think so too, right now I think he just enjoy his golf - he's a long way from the top (and going by his new swing speed, he still has the potential to make it to a very high level again) , and it's probably more important that he perseveres and keeps on improving in the shorter term. 

When he gets back into the mix regularly, perhaps a change will be necessary. 

[3jacker]

On 4/20/2018 at 5:00 PM, Valleygolfer said:

I like how @3jackerseems to know this stuff so well...

Then why did they write such things and release it to the public?

[Valleygolfer]

1 hour ago, 3jacker said:

Then why did they write such things and release it to the public?

I guess if you believe all of these things, I have a bridge I would like to sell you....

[iacas]

2 hours ago, 3jacker said:

Then why did they write such things and release it to the public?

They didn’t all. And Haney’s Book says way more about Hank than Tiger.

[3jacker]

3 hours ago, Valleygolfer said:

I guess if you believe all of these things, I have a bridge I would like to sell you....

Why would they lie?
Why would TW lie?
Guess you can choose to believe which you want. TWs behavior certainly supports the contention.  It's not all made up, you know.