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iacas

USGA Takes it On the Chin from Anonymous Whiny Tour Babies

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100% whining.  If any player actually thought the conditions were *that* unfair, they would actually sit out instead of just threatening to sit out.  There are quite literally thousands of people from qualifying who would love the chance to play on a course that is "too hard".  Probably would make for better TV as well, since the people would actually appreciate being there and the media could just focus on the actual golf.  Going back the last few years makes the complaints: too easy (Erin Hills), too hard (Shinnecock), too bumpy (Chambers Bay), rough too thick (Oakmont).  The Open last year was baked out garbage.  Balls rolling out hundreds of yards on concrete fairways and the course looking worse than even an average muni and nobody said a word.  If they are used to playing "certain conditions", then the complaining has to be equal.  Hopefully Pebble Beach is immune from any complaining, but I doubt it, since the players are already complaining and nobody has even seen the course yet.

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The anonymous players are way out of line. They are acting like pampered, spoiled brats who are throwing their toys out the pram because they are not in control of the tournament for once. If they don't like it then don't play. It's supposed to be your national championship; sacrosanct. Mickelson is the worst. Still unrepentant about his shameful antics last year. You can bet your bottom dollar he wouldn't be saying a word about all this had he managed to win the tournament.

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Tiger doesn't seem to care.  He wants high rough and tight fairways, reasoning that's what everyone expects coming in and everyone plays the same course.  

2 minutes ago, Sandy Divot said:

The USGA has had their moments, but it looks like they have done a good job with the set up at the Women's US Open.

I guess.  At least the scores aren't crazy low like many of their events.

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On 5/29/2019 at 11:39 AM, DaveP043 said:

I don't believe that its a matter of the USGA being unable to provided an accounting, but being unwilling to open their books for everyone to see.  That would open them up to even more criticism, everyone would have an opinion of where more or less money should be spent.  Separately, the PGA Tour is set up to do what is best for the PGA Tour players, so a huge percentage of their income from ticket sales and media fees goes back out as prize money.  The USGA gets income from memberships, and from the US Open, and uses it to fund amateur events, agronomy research, and a myriad of other tasks.  That they offer the highest purse of the year seems appropriate, but its always going to be a relatively small portion of their income for the tournament.  I have a hard time with players who are making millions of dollars complaining, threatening to boycott, because they're not getting a big enough piece of the pie.

Oh, and as a 4-time volunteer at the US Open, we had to pay to buy our uniforms.  The last time was 2014 at Pinehurst, we got 2 shirts and a hat, for a cost.  The cost was very reasonable, I think under $100.  The volunteers had an air-conditioned pavilion on the course, and were provided a meal ticket for each day worked.  Yes, we had to commit to a certain number of hours through the week, 20 hours over 4 days.  They use nearly 10,000 volunteers over the course of a week.

Good points. The USGA does a lot more than just run the US Men's Open! There are some interesting facts in John Feinstein's book The Open, about the first Open at Bethpage Black. The USGA spent millions getting that course back in shape. It had devolved into, basically, a glorified muni, but the bones were there. Plus, they had to extract a promise from the state of New York to maintain it in close to that condition after the Open was over. 

At that same time, The USGA broached the idea of opening the TV coverage of the Open to bid, they had always just re-upped with the same network. They figured they wouldn't get a bid from CBS, because CBS wouldn't want to jeopardize its Masters contract. So they went ahead, and when they opened the bids they were stunned! It was WAY more money than they were anticipating. Plus, the woman in charge of their merchandising was an absolute wizard. She had the largest tent on the grounds, and just raked in money hand over fist! Both of these were eye openers for the USGA. 

And this bitching is nothing new. I can remember, from way back in the day, pros whining that the USGA was trying to "embarrass" the best golfers on the planet! The chairman of the USGA, it might have been Joe Dey, was asked that question by a reporter. He said, something like, "Embarrass them? No. We're merely trying to identify them!" In other words, "Screw you, whiners!"

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I don’t put much,if any, stock in anonymous whining and complaints particularly from privileged millionaires who make a living playing a game. They DONT have to play the open. 

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I guarantee that if USGA officials had to putt on greens like Chambers Bay at their home clubs, they would want the super fired. If they had pin placements like Olympic or Shinnecock, they would want the super fired. If they couldn't hold a green with a wedge, they would want the super fired. The Tour guys complain about conditions, and they are whiners. I would bet there is not one person that hasn't complained about bad greens, and poor hole locations. And that argument about everyone having to play the same course just means the USGA has screwed it up for everybody. It doesn't make it right. I don't think the USGA is as bad as they are made out to be, but I think they have made some big mistakes, and the players  have some legitimate complaints.

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25 minutes ago, Sandy Divot said:

If they had pin placements like Olympic or Shinnecock, they would want the super fired. If they couldn't hold a green with a wedge, they would want the super fired.

There were 1-2 bad placements at a Shinnecock on one day.

And guys could hold greens with wedges… if they were in the fairway.

You, like the Tour whiners, are acting like these errors are far more common than they are.

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23 minutes ago, saevel25 said:

I do think that the USGA does push courses too hard. I also understand they want to make it the toughest test in golf. 

The only time I ever felt they pushed it too hard was ‘04. Outside of that, I think they’ve done a solid job making these courses tough but fair. CB was a bit messy, but it didn’t have to do with the difficulty of the course but rather the greens.

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59 minutes ago, Sandy Divot said:

I guarantee that if USGA officials had to putt on greens like Chambers Bay at their home clubs, they would want the super fired. If they had pin placements like Olympic or Shinnecock, they would want the super fired. If they couldn't hold a green with a wedge, they would want the super fired.

Maybe, but they aren't professional golfers!

 

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58 minutes ago, iacas said:

There were 1-2 bad placements at a Shinnecock on one day.

And guys could hold greens with wedges… if they were in the fairway.

You, like the Tour whiners, are acting like these errors are far more common than they are.

I think the problems are common enough that the players think it's an issue. I also said that I didn't think the USGA was as bad as they were made out to be. I've got to believe that the players are frustrated because they feel the USGA doesn't listen, or take seriously the concerns they do have. Mabye having Jason Gore as the USGA rep between the players and the USGA will help. 

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17 minutes ago, Sandy Divot said:

I think the problems are common enough that the players think it's an issue. 

I’m not sure they do - what if it’s just a vocal subset of players? Is the golf media going to publish quotes from 20 PGA players who think the USGA does a pretty decent job overall? No way.

All you see us the (anonymous) quotes from the whiniest of players.

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52 minutes ago, Hardspoon said:

I’m not sure they do - what if it’s just a vocal subset of players? Is the golf media going to publish quotes from 20 PGA players who think the USGA does a pretty decent job overall? No way.

All you see us the (anonymous) quotes from the whiniest of players.

The quotes are from major champions and former number 1's. That's why it's being made a big deal. And two of the guys are McIlroy and DJ who threatened a boycott, which I think is silly. And of course, you had Phil do his normal whining. Tiger was smart and took the high road and simply said he'd like to see them go back to the way it used to be with narrow fairways and high rough. Haven't seen Pebble's setup yet, but if Cantlay's whining is any indication, it looks like they may have taken Tiger's advice.

Edited by ChrisP

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19 hours ago, Buckeyebowman said:

There are some interesting facts in John Feinstein's book The Open, about the first Open at Bethpage Black.

It's called "Open". Just saying. :-) It's certainly worth reading.

Edited by leftybutnotPM

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I really enjoy the US Open and seeing the toughest test of golf. There is some validity to the complaint about the greens being over the line but not enough to justify the amount of saltiness from the players. It does suck when you putt down hill and it’s either make it or run it 20 yards off the green tho. 

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Koepka just won some major brownie points with me. Calls out the complainers out there.

Quote

On players complaining about USGA course setups: "Yeah, I mean, I guess the only reason they're complaining … I mean, everybody has got to play the same golf course. So it really doesn't make a difference. It doesn't make a difference … if you put it in the fairway and you hit every green, there's really no problem, is there?

"So obviously they're not doing what they're supposed to do. So they're not playing good enough. If they put it in the fairway, you shouldn't have to complain about the rough. You hit the greens and you hit it close, you shouldn't have to complain about the greens.

"I've just never been one to complain, make excuses. It doesn't matter. Nobody wants to hear anybody's excuse. I find it annoying even when I play with guys and they're dropping clubs or throwing them or complaining, like telling me how bad the golf course is or how bad this is. I don't want to hear it. I don't care. It doesn't matter to me. It's just something we've all got to deal with. If you play good enough, you shouldn't have a problem."

 

 

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