Tiger Woods Master Catch-All Discussion

[iacas]

27 minutes ago, saevel25 said:

Maybe off-topic. Johnny Miller was talking about how far out he was aiming on the Saturday putt on 18. He said something like he's looking out 2 and half feet out. He was a bit off on that guess. 😉 

I remember that same thing live, and then again when I watched it tonight.

[Shindig]

On 8/15/2018 at 4:00 PM, nevets88 said:

The No Laying Up guys summarize his life in the past 10 years. What a crazy ride.

https://nolayingup.com/2018/08/14/episode-17-journey-tiger/

Oh wow, I got about halfway through this during an evening walk this evening.  I had to stop because I was laughing.  Great podcast, fun commentary, I should listen more often.  I think I have them on my feed but not on auto-download.  Are they generally good to listen to?

[mvmac]

"Tiger Woods is without question the most powerful and influential athlete of my time. Michael Jordan is not only 2nd, if it was a golf tournament, he'd be 15 strokes off the lead. " — Colin Cowherd

[saevel25]

8 hours ago, mvmac said:

"Tiger Woods is without question the most powerful and influential athlete of my time. Michael Jordan is not only 2nd, if it was a golf tournament, he'd be 15 strokes off the lead. " — Colin Cowherd

I might put Lebron over Michael in terms of influential athletes. Michael never had the sway that Lebron has over a team and over the NBA. I know Michael had his shoe branding. Lebron has definitely been more influential.

Yea, Tiger Woods is above them both.

[boogielicious]

11 hours ago, saevel25 said:

Maybe off-topic. Johnny Miller was talking about how far out he was aiming on the Saturday putt on 18. He said something like he's looking out 2 and half feet out. He was a bit off on that guess. 😉 

Many 'Amateur Engineers' like Johnny Miller, make these mistakes. 😛

[Dr. Manhattan]

1 hour ago, saevel25 said:

I might put Lebron over Michael in terms of influential athletes. Michael never had the sway that Lebron has over a team and over the NBA. I know Michael had his shoe branding. Lebron has definitely been more influential.

Yea, Tiger Woods is above them both.

 

Jordan still has his shoe branding. His shoes are far more popular than LeBron's.

As far as the NBA front offices are concerned, the Bulls wanted to trade Pippen for the draft rights on Tracy McGrady. Jordan shut it down. Pretty powerful considering this was a time period where the players had nowhere near the control they do now.

Jordan's Bulls salary in 1996-1997 was almost double the next highest guy in the entire NBA. Sure does suggest to me that he had the Bulls and the NBA by the balls. Imagine a guy making $80m compared to Steph Curry's $40m. 

[nevets88]

Someone asked me when I started playing golf. I paused, and just said, Tiger Woods. He got it, no further explanation needed.

[Missouri Swede]

55 minutes ago, boogielicious said:

Many 'Amateur Engineers' like Johnny Miller, make these mistakes. 😛

Shouldn't someone use something like a compass to help with these types of calculations?

[rehmwa]

59 minutes ago, boogielicious said:

Many 'Amateur Engineers' like Johnny Miller, make these mistakes. 😛

maybe the player (reference) is an exceptionally small midget

or they are using a special lens on the camera (super wide angle)

lots of excuses available, just use the imagination

[saevel25]

34 minutes ago, Dr. Manhattan said:

Jordan still has his shoe branding. His shoes are far more popular than LeBron's.

According to Forbes, you are wrong. If you want to go down the road of total sales over a career, then that it is no contest. Michael's shoes debuted in 1984. It's 34 years compared to 15 years for LeBron.

Quote

Bestselling NBA Signature Shoes In 2017 

1. LeBron James
2. Kyrie Irving
3. Kevin Durant
4. Stephen Curry
5. Michael Jordan

 

8 minutes ago, rehmwa said:

maybe the player (reference) is an exceptionally small midget

or they are using a special lens on the camera (super wide angle)

lots of excuses available, just use the imagination

If it was the same video feed that we had, then it's easy to see it's not 2.5 FT

[Missouri Swede]

2 minutes ago, saevel25 said:

If it was the same video feed that we had, then it's easy to see it's not 2.5 FT

LeBron James size feet.

[rehmwa]

12 minutes ago, saevel25 said:

If it was the same video feed that we had, then it's easy to see it's not 2.5 FT

Edited August 17, 2018 by rehmwa

[klineka]

40 minutes ago, Dr. Manhattan said:

 

Jordan still has his shoe branding. His shoes are far more popular than LeBron's.

As far as the NBA front offices are concerned, the Bulls wanted to trade Pippen for the draft rights on Tracy McGrady. Jordan shut it down. Pretty powerful considering this was a time period where the players had nowhere near the control they do now.

Jordan's Bulls salary in 1996-1997 was almost double the next highest guy in the entire NBA. Sure does suggest to me that he had the Bulls and the NBA by the balls. Imagine a guy making $80m compared to Steph Curry's $40m. 

There is FAR more to being an "influential athlete" than simply shoe branding, shutting down one trade, and a salary.

IMO, the most influential athlete is someone that moves the needle the most. If Michael Jordan or Lebron had never played in the NBA, the NBA still would have grown. If Tiger had never played golf, the sport would still have grown slightly, but not nearly as much as it has as a result of Tiger playing golf. 

I'm a huge Lebron fan, he grew up ~15 minutes from my childhood house, played against my high school's basketball team, met him in person, etc, but even I agree that Tiger has been more influential in his respective sport than Lebron or MJ have been.

Thousands (if not tens or hundreds of thousands) of people started playing golf because of Tiger. I'm not so sure the same can be said about MJ or Lebron.  

[saevel25]

32 minutes ago, klineka said:

Thousands (if not tens or hundreds of thousands) of people started playing golf because of Tiger. I'm not so sure the same can be said about MJ or Lebron.  

1. Golf is more approachable than basketball. Unless you have height and athleticism, you'll hit a ceiling.

2. Golf was primed for a huge growth spurt. The NBA has always had a generational player that keeps it interesting. There wasn't much growth potential there for LeBron.

[Dr. Manhattan]

2 hours ago, saevel25 said:

According to Forbes, you are wrong. If you want to go down the road of total sales over a career, then that it is no contest. Michael's shoes debuted in 1984. It's 34 years compared to 15 years for LeBron.

 

Are you referring to the article from April 2018? At the bottom of the article it says they are talking about only the single performance shoe that was released for current year. However, I am referring to Jordan Brand across the board including all the retro shoes they sell every day.  

According to that article, the retro shoe market is 3 times bigger than the performance basketball market. Jordan Brand has 65% of the retro market. 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kurtbadenhausen/2018/04/30/nikes-lebron-james-is-the-nbas-best-selling-shoe-salesman/#171ee5465313

Bestselling NBA Signature Shoes In 2017 

1. LeBron James
2. Kyrie Irving
3. Kevin Durant
4. Stephen Curry
5. Michael Jordan

Ranks reflect combined sales of all signature performance basketball shoes only and not retro versions. Source: NPD Group

"The performance basketball market, where shoes typically retail for at least $120, peaked at $1.3 billion in 2015 but fell 13.6% last year, says Powell. It is not just basketball struggling to move product, either. Performance categories are down across the board, without a single sport trending positively over the last three years. Powell says it is the first time in 40-plus years that every performance category has declined for multiple years."

"While the performance basketball market is off, the retro business continues to hold its own. Sales were flat last year thanks largely to the Jordan Brand, which launched in 1984 on the back of basketball legend Michael Jordan, who hung up his high tops for good in 2003. Retro is more than three times the size of performance basketball with sales at $3 billion last year. Jordan had a 65% share of retro basketball in 2017, according to NPD Group, followed by Nike (23%), Adidas (9.3%) and Puma (2.3%). Nike also has a substantial Jordan business in China, which is not measured here."

[klineka]

1 hour ago, Dr. Manhattan said:

 

Are you referring to the article from April 2018? At the bottom of the article it says they are talking about only the single performance shoe that was released for current year. However, I am referring to Jordan Brand across the board including all the retro shoes they sell every day.  

According to that article, the retro shoe market is 3 times bigger than the performance basketball market. Jordan Brand has 65% of the retro market. 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kurtbadenhausen/2018/04/30/nikes-lebron-james-is-the-nbas-best-selling-shoe-salesman/#171ee5465313

Bestselling NBA Signature Shoes In 2017 

1. LeBron James
2. Kyrie Irving
3. Kevin Durant
4. Stephen Curry
5. Michael Jordan

Ranks reflect combined sales of all signature performance basketball shoes only and not retro versions. Source: NPD Group

"The performance basketball market, where shoes typically retail for at least $120, peaked at $1.3 billion in 2015 but fell 13.6% last year, says Powell. It is not just basketball struggling to move product, either. Performance categories are down across the board, without a single sport trending positively over the last three years. Powell says it is the first time in 40-plus years that every performance category has declined for multiple years."

"While the performance basketball market is off, the retro business continues to hold its own. Sales were flat last year thanks largely to the Jordan Brand, which launched in 1984 on the back of basketball legend Michael Jordan, who hung up his high tops for good in 2003. Retro is more than three times the size of performance basketball with sales at $3 billion last year. Jordan had a 65% share of retro basketball in 2017, according to NPD Group, followed by Nike (23%), Adidas (9.3%) and Puma (2.3%). Nike also has a substantial Jordan business in China, which is not measured here."

What does any of that have to do with Tiger?

Tiger sells way less shoes than both Jordan and Lebron and has had a bigger influence on his sport than either of them ever will.

[saevel25]

49 minutes ago, klineka said:

What does any of that have to do with Tiger?

Tiger sells way less shoes than both Jordan and Lebron and has had a bigger influence on his sport than either of them ever will.

We kinda got off-track. Did you read anything before that post? It wasn't out of the blue.

[iacas]

8 minutes ago, saevel25 said:

We kinda got off-track. Did you read anything before that post? It wasn't out of the blue.

He didn’t say it was. Most of it was off topic though.