Are you spending 70% of your practice time on your short game like Michael Breed implies you should?

[Golfingdad]

Can you clarify what you mean here? You count your birdie putt as something other than a short game shot? I'm legitimately confused, not attempting to challenge you.

. He explained it in the previous sentences. When he's saying "short game" in this context he's talking about the shots required after you miss a green. Basically just chipping and pitching.

[rkim291968]

But that still doesn't mean much. You only have to hit the ball about 250 to be a scratch golfer. If you have a repeatable pattern, you can shoot some GREAT darn scores even if you're hitting hybrids from 160 (like, I could point out, many LPGA Tour players). Heck, I could make a case that the lower your swing speed, the more important the full swing stuff is because you really can't afford to be giving away shots with poor mis-hits or out-of-pattern misses.

This topic is dear to me.  I am a slightly built,short man with relatively short wing span.  As much and often as I tried to increase ball striking distance, my solid drive average never went beyond 220 yards.   I think I can get close to single digit HI with that average.   But to get my HI to a single digit and beyond,  I either have to be damn accurate like an LPGA player or must increase my average to at least 240.   I am not worrying about it now b/c I have other things to work on.   But soon, I hope, I need to figure out how to increase swing speed and distance.

[Aguirre]

How short and slight?  I'm 5'6", 41 years old, 145 lbs, and I haven't worked out for several years, but I can bang it out there 250.

[rkim291968]

How short and slight?  I'm 5'6", 41 years old, 145 lbs, and I haven't worked out for several years, but I can bang it out there 250.

5'4 and a half and 140 lbs, and in early 50s.  Besides being short, I have relatively shorter wing span than people at that height.

[Aguirre]

5'4 and a half and 140 lbs, and in early 50s.  Besides being short, I have relatively shorter wing span than people at that height.

Flexibility is big.  But a lot is technique, as has been said.  As a 17, you probably aren't maximizing the power you could get.  So simply improving your ball striking will lead to more distance.  Same applies to me, of course.

[AmazingWhacker]

Well . .I play par3 courses every chance I get . .sometimes once or twice a week.  I consider that practice.  It's the only short-game practice I get, too . .because all the courses I play at have "no chipping" signs all around the practice greens.

Maybe once a summer I might practice putting for like 20 minutes.  It's boring and I've always been a decent enough putter.

[boogielicious]

Just starting into LSW and while this concept seems counter-intuitive to everything I've ever been told, I'm a believer. Numbers can be fudged but the data provided in the book is really indisputable. Long game is where to spend your time, which coincidentally, is a concept I've always followed, although somewhat guiltily in the past. No more.

I chip maybe 20 or 30 balls during a typical range session and never putt. I practice putting before the round cuz here in TX, greens are so different course to course that it doesn't make sense to practice on the fuzzy driving range green. I also have a 7' putting strip in my house where I can groove my stroke but speed practice is done before a round.

I am with you on this @Gunther .  If I go to the range, I will practice pitch/chipping and the long game.  My putting stroke it good and doesn't need much work.  Before a round, it will test the green speed and do several 3-5 foot putts from all around one hole on a slope just to get in the groove.  Only on occasion do I do any practice putting.

I did a few of the drills from LSW last year just to try them out.  If folks struggle with putting, I recommend those drills.

[RH31]

My full swing is OK right now so almost all my practice is chipping/pitching.  That, and we can't hit drivers at our practice range.

I was practicing my pitching almost everyday for a few weeks. I got up and down around 50% my first few rounds and one round

got up and down 9 times. I've never pitched it that well.....ever.  I haven't made as much time lately to practice and was only hitting few

pitches and chips to warm up. The last two rounds my game around the greens has regressed. I've always been streaky around the greens so I'm probably an anomaly in the "how much time should be spent" discussion.

[David in FL]

My full swing is OK right now so almost all my practice is chipping/pitching.  That, and we can't hit drivers at our practice range.;-) I was practicing my pitching almost everyday for a few weeks. I got up and down around 50% my first few rounds and one round got up and down 9 times. I've never pitched it that well.....ever.  I haven't made as much time lately to practice and was only hitting few pitches and chips to warm up. The last two rounds my game around the greens has regressed. I've always been streaky around the greens so I'm probably an anomaly in the "how much time should be spent" discussion.

Unless you're the worlds worst putter, as a 10 hcp, you're not hitting more than 5 or 6 greens, even on a good day. Ask me how I know.... :8). That means that from an opportunity perspective, your full swing really isn't "OK right now". If you raise the bar on your own full swing expectations, you'll hit more greens and your scoring will improve dramatically. Much faster than spending that same amount of time trying to improve the necessary scrambling resulting from missing all those greens in the first place.

[RH31]

Unless you're the worlds worst putter, as a 10 hcp, you're not hitting more than 5 or 6 greens, even on a good day. Ask me how I know.... .

That means that from an opportunity perspective, your full swing really isn't "OK right now". If you raise the bar on your own full swing expectations, you'll hit more greens and your scoring will improve dramatically. Much faster than spending that same amount of time trying to improve the necessary scrambling resulting from missing all those greens in the first place.

"OK  right now" in a relative sense. I'm driving it in play (mostly) and about 230-250 yards. The rest of the bag is fairly solid and not curving too much.  I've hit 4, 4, 6 and 9 greens so far this year

and shot 83, 76, 84 and 78. The 76 I got it up and down 9 times and pitched it inside 10 feet all day. The 78 I left 4 pitch/chip shots 20 feet from the hole.

I would probably practice my long game more if our range wasn't limited to about 190 yards. Also, I can practice pitching at home.

My home course has tiny greens, so even exceptional ball strikers end up with 5-6 short game shots per round.

[JazzFatCat]

I practice about 50% on the short game, but for me it might be a case of practicing what I like to do rather than what would lower my scores. I find practicing the short game to be pretty Zen and a pretty fun way to spend an hour or two.

[RFKFREAK]

Flexibility is big.  But a lot is technique, as has been said.  As a 17, you probably aren't maximizing the power you could get.  So simply improving your ball striking will lead to more distance.  Same applies to me, of course.

Oh, yeah, flexibility is big but I think ball striking is most important.  I'm 6'2", weigh 233 pounds, and am not the most flexible person, yet Game Golf has my average drive at 218 ranging from a low of 129 to a high of 295.  So, I know I can get it out there, but my ball striking is so inconsistent that it brings down my average.

[Dave2512]

Seems Breed's short game opinion is based on the low GIR % we face as amateurs. As mentioned it's backwards thinking. Especially if he thinks getting into short iron range from the tee is a regular occurrence Which wouldn't matter anyway because a full swing shot is what it is.

[GolfLug]

I think it is possible that Breed is speaking to a fairly large golfing population that empties buckets of balls on the range as if the balls are ticking time bombs  that need to be distanced in a hurry before they explode. My guess is he would agree that the more mindful golfers would benefit from a much (much, much) higher % of long game.

[turtleback]

. He explained it in the previous sentences. When he's saying "short game" in this context he's talking about the shots required after you miss a green. Basically just chipping and pitching.

Yeah, that is basically it.  The putt after the rare GIR is, to me, an offensive shot- I have a chance to get  great score (birdie)and an excellent chance of getting a very good score (par).

The putt after a chip or pitch is a defensive shot, trying to avoid losing a stroke.  I think of the chip and the resulting putt together as the short game.  When I DO practice the short game I always like to do it at a place where I can hit a chip and then putt the ball out.

I'm not claiming this is any kind of universal truth or expect anyone else to think about it that way - it is just how I look at it and think about it.

Oh, yeah, flexibility is big but I think ball striking is most important.  I'm 6'2", weigh 233 pounds, and am not the most flexible person, yet Game Golf has my average drive at 218 ranging from a low of 129 to a high of 295.  So, I know I can get it out there, but my ball striking is so inconsistent that it brings down my average.

This is a little OT and better asked in the Game golf thread but a quick question.  Does Game Golf tell you your median drive (where half your drives are that distance or longer and half are that distance or shorter?)  Since the median reduces the effect of outliers (your 295 and your 129, for example) it gives you a better idea of your driving distance for course management purposes.  You certainly never play a hole anticipating a drive of 129, or 295, with your game.  But anticipating a drive in the 218 range might be just as misleading.   I think the median would give you a better picture of your drive expectation for planning purposes.  I think it will be the closest to your "typical" reasonably solid drive, which is what I think is what you should be thinking about as you plan how you will play the hole.  I kind of wish the PGA stats would give us both averages and medians.

Seems Breed's short game opinion is based on the low GIR % we face as amateurs. As mentioned it's backwards thinking. Especially if he thinks getting into short iron range from the tee is a regular occurrence Which wouldn't matter anyway because a full swing shot is what it is.

It is kind of like a football team that has trouble scoring in the red zone so they redouble their efforts to make their FG unit more efficient.  No, improve your red zone scoring.

[Shindig]

Yeah, that is basically it.  The putt after the rare GIR is, to me, an offensive shot- I have a chance to get  great score (birdie)and an excellent chance of getting a very good score (par). The putt after a chip or pitch is a defensive shot, trying to avoid losing a stroke.  I think of the chip and the resulting putt together as the short game.  When I DO practice the short game I always like to do it at a place where I can hit a chip and then putt the ball out. I'm not claiming this is any kind of universal truth or expect anyone else to think about it that way - it is just how I look at it and think about it.

I really like this, actually. I've mentally accounted for a long putt as similar to using the putter for a chip, viewing it more as an opportunity to get up and down than as avoiding a 3-putt. [quote name="turtleback" url="/t/81674/are-you-spending-70-of-your-practice-time-on-your-short-game-like-michael-breed-implies-you-should/90#post_1135794"] It is kind of like a football team that has trouble scoring in the red zone so they redouble their efforts to make their FG unit more efficient.  No, improve your red zone scoring. [/quote] Fantastic analogy.

[rkim291968]

I practice about 50% on the short game, but for me it might be a case of practicing what I like to do rather than what would lower my score.

I think this is an important point.   If one enjoys practicing short game more, that's better than no practice, or just going through the motion on practicing long game.

[Golfingdad]

I think this is an important point.   If one enjoys practicing short game more, that's better than no practice, or just going through the motion on practicing long game.

Oh absolutely.

When people come on here with valuable information, like @iacas and @mvmac are wont to do, it's under the assumption that the people taking in the information have the goal of becoming as good as they can.

That is not the case for everybody.  For a lot of people, they are happy where they are and just want to have fun.  For those people, if that's whats fun for them, then it's not wrong to practice your short game 70% of the time.  Hell, it's not wrong to practice your short game 100% of the time.

But if your goal is to become as good as you can be at golf and score as low as possible ... then it is wrong.