LIV Golf Now Closed?

[snapfade]

Why wait till now to sue for logo copyright infringement? Who here had to Google Fallen Footwear?

[Elmer]

42 minutes ago, iacas said:

It’s difficult to find images and logos. I’ve never heard of Fallen Footwear.

 

8 minutes ago, snapfade said:

Why wait till now to sue for logo copyright infringement? Who here had to Google Fallen Footwear?

Does not matter if you had to google it, or you knew about it.
The company has been around and using the logo since 2003.
you would think that LIV and Mickelson would have had lawyers or someone look into it before using the logo.
Now they will need to settle. 
I know this is meaningless and insignificant for the SA slushfund, but could have been avoided. 

[nevets88]

What happens if this agreement falls apart? LIV goes on, PGAT runs out of money? Then what.

[mcanadiens]

36 minutes ago, Elmer said:

you would think that LIV and Mickelson would have had lawyers or someone look into it before using the logo.
Now they will need to settle. 

Sloppy work to be sure.

This is usually the kind of thing some mom & pop operation gets stomped on for. The big boys usually hire the specialists to make sure they are in the clear.

[Elmer]

35 minutes ago, nevets88 said:

What happens if this agreement falls apart? LIV goes on, PGAT runs out of money? Then what.

LIV will be well funded, yet still have a dull-boring product.
PGAT would have to adjust their purses based on cash flow and budget. 

 

1 minute ago, mcanadiens said:

Sloppy work to be sure.

This is usually the kind of thing some mom & pop operation gets stomped on for. The big boys usually hire the specialists to make sure they are in the clear.

Seems LIV is funded like they are the "big boys" but operate like bush league!

[iacas]

2 hours ago, snapfade said:

Why wait till now to sue for logo copyright infringement? Who here had to Google Fallen Footwear?

 Perhaps so they could argue that they're owed $.

1 hour ago, Elmer said:

Does not matter if you had to google it, or you knew about it.
The company has been around and using the logo since 2003.

What did I say that prompted this type of response? I'm curious because it's not like I said they were off the hook or something.

1 hour ago, Elmer said:

you would think that LIV and Mickelson would have had lawyers or someone look into it before using the logo.
Now they will need to settle. 

As I said, sometimes it's tough to find a logo. It's not as easily searchable as a word mark. And for all we know they searched extensively for "HF" logos… but didn't consider that it might be "FF".

So, I could see how they missed the FF company.

But, now that they know, they should cease using it, or license it, or whatever.

We've had to fight copyright or trademark infringement, too. It generally starts with a cease and desist.

[StuM]

36 minutes ago, iacas said:

2 hours ago, Elmer said:

Does not matter if you had to google it, or you knew about it.
The company has been around and using the logo since 2003.

What did I say that prompted this type of response? I'm curious because it's not like I said they were off the hook or something.

I think he was in reference to a comment from  @snapfade 

[turtleback]

3 hours ago, iacas said:

It’s difficult to find images and logos. I’ve never heard of Fallen Footwear.

That's because your expertise is teaching and coaching golf and running this board.  There are people whose job it is to vet logos and they missed it. It happens.* 

But then when the logo-holder told them they were infringing they tried to just blow them off.  It wouldn't surprise me if that ups the financial ante for infringement.

I confess to finding it excessively amusing that of all the LIV teams this happened to Phil's.

Someone asked why they waited a year to raise the issue.  I'd guess that they were unaware, previously.  Maybe most people have heard of LIV and have heard of Phil, but I doubt that anyone other than a very seriously devoted LIV fan would have a clue about what Phil's team's logo was.  People say they never heard of Fallen Footwear before, but I would ask them if they knew what Phil's team's logo was before this came up.

So I agree with you that they will have to change the logo or pay to license it.

*It's a little different, but the Washington NFL team picked a name that it turned out they couldn't trademark.  And I remember your experience with your trademark or logo being infringed.

 

Edited June 13, 2023 by turtleback

[StuM]

3 hours ago, Elmer said:

with all the money and resources which money bring with it, how did they not know?????

 

All I will say is these are very very similar and I would find it hard to belive that two unrelated people came up with such similar designs totally independent of each other.  But, if they did happen to come up with it purely by coincidence once served the cease & desisit order they should have stopped using it.

[iacas]

51 minutes ago, StuM said:

I think he was in reference to a comment from  @snapfade 

Probably. But that’s why I asked.

33 minutes ago, turtleback said:

That's because your expertise is teaching and coaching golf and running this board.  There are people whose job it is to vet logos and they missed it. It happens.* 

It does happen, yeah. But…

34 minutes ago, turtleback said:

But then when the logo-holder told them they were infringing they tried to just blow them off.  It wouldn't surprise me if that ups the financial ante for infringement.

Yes. That hurts them quite a bit.

[snapfade]

I think Fallen got inspired by Fear Factory (since 1989)

[billchao]

5 hours ago, turtleback said:

People say they never heard of Fallen Footwear before, but I would ask them if they knew what Phil's team's logo was before this came up.

I didn’t know of either of these things before this.

[Dr. Manhattan]

PGA Tour announced that Monahan is recovering from a medical situation. Hopefully he's OK, regardless of how this golf stuff is playing out. 

[Elmer]

On 6/13/2023 at 3:38 PM, iacas said:

What did I say that prompted this type of response? I'm curious because it's not like I said they were off the hook or something.

 

I was responding to Snapfade, and did not mean to be condescending.
But I have never liked the logic of "I didn't know about it, therefore should be an issue".
I see this on the golf course and in life "I did not know, so why should I be penalized".

Just because Fallen Footwear and Liv were unaware does not mean infringement of copyrighted material did not occur. 
Mickelson should consider this another gamble, take the loss and pay up!

 

[TourSpoon]

21 hours ago, snapfade said:

Why wait till now to sue for logo copyright infringement? Who here had to Google Fallen Footwear?

I am thinking that the skateboarding community probably doesn't watch LIV or follow Phil. It probably happened when Phil was highlighted at a recent major wearing the logo. 

 

21 hours ago, Elmer said:

I know this is meaningless and insignificant for the SA slushfund, but could have been avoided. 

Definitely avoidable. I am sure there are industry professionals that have the ability to search in a way more sophisticated than using google. 

[chspeed]

PGA Tour Commissioner Jay Monahan takes medical leave days after LIV Golf deal announcement

---

The PGA Tour didn't specify how long Monahan would be out, nor did it disclose the nature of his health issue.

Sorry - just saw someone had posted about this...

Edited June 14, 2023 by chspeed

[saevel25]

 I like Morikawa's take...

 

[chspeed]

6 minutes ago, saevel25 said:

 I like Morikawa's take...

 

Eh. Lots of people are sick of things they have to do as part of their jobs. Can't force them to answer the question, but as a fan I'd be annoyed if none of them talked about it.