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Indy1954

LPGA: The Good Ole Days? Have You Stopped Watching?

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14 hours ago, Mr22putt said:

I don't like Wie...big snob....if there was a needle mover on the LPGA..... it was Wie...Wie never really like engaging with the fans...she like some other pros know when the cameras are nearby.....BJ is a MARKETING GENIUS...conning everyone that Michelle would be the 'chosen one' in woman's golf....LMAO

I don't know... I remember seeing her at the John Deere in 2005 and 2006. I actually felt really badly for her. She just seemed like a 15 or 16 year old kid who was super talented but IN NO WAY prepared for the celebrity that she was thrust into. My wife and I would attend the John Deere every year back then. This was during the time when Tiger was the most recognized human on the planet, so golf was enjoying abnormal popularity. That translated to a lot of folks going to golf tournaments who knew nothing about the game. 

When we were at the John Deere it seemed like more than half the people there were just there to see Michelle Wie. Some of them knew nothing about golf. We were sitting next to an older woman who was convinced that not only was Michelle favored to win this tournament, but that she had already won several other men's events. Accord to this woman Michelle was "The best golfer in the world besides Tiger Woods." She was like 15 at the time.. maybe 16. Anyway, they were selling Michelle Wie calendars at the gift shop. I asked my wife "Who buys a calendar in July?" …  Tons of people. They bought them to get Michelle's autograph. Other people were there just to boo her. Some people actually thought that Michelle was not only taking a spot away from a male golfer who "Should be playing in the event." But also that "She's going to be allowed to play the forward tees." It was crazy. Of course the internet was huge back in 2005 but not everyone had it on their phone. This was still in the Blackberry Era. 

So half the people were booing her, half the people were cheering her like she was some kind of Amelia Earhart. But everything she did was scrutinized. On Friday she was just under the cut-line with 4 holes to go. I think she went like bogie, double-bogie, par, par and missed the cut by a stroke or two. Saturday and Sunday there was like half the crowd. But even then, people were wondering where she was. My wife and I had to tell like 3 or 4 people that she missed the cut. A couple of them looked at us like we just told them aliens had landed on the 18th green. 

I actually felt bad for her. She should have been in high school, earning a scholarship and kicking everyone's ass. In my opinion, it just messed her up. It took her a lot longer than it should have for her to learn how to close out a tournament. I think she would have won a lot more, a lot sooner if she would have been allowed to take a more "normal" path. She was way more talented than the majority of female players at the time. She should have been "the Chosen One", but she was rushed to the finish line without getting to take the journey… I say that but on the bright side I think Nike paid her like 20 million dollars a year back then... so, maybe I'm an idiot. 

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20 hours ago, ChetlovesMer said:

She had game, a great personality, charming smile, and was smart enough to learn English in like a matter of weeks. 

Move your Dr. Peppers to the side.  I just heard that Indy, while in his timeout, is learning the Korean language.

(I'm sorry, it was just too easy...)

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4 hours ago, ChetlovesMer said:

I don't know... I remember seeing her at the John Deere in 2005 and 2006. I actually felt really badly for her. She just seemed like a 15 or 16 year old kid who was super talented but IN NO WAY prepared for the celebrity that she was thrust into. My wife and I would attend the John Deere every year back then. This was during the time when Tiger was the most recognized human on the planet, so golf was enjoying abnormal popularity. That translated to a lot of folks going to golf tournaments who knew nothing about the game. 

When we were at the John Deere it seemed like more than half the people there were just there to see Michelle Wie. Some of them knew nothing about golf. We were sitting next to an older woman who was convinced that not only was Michelle favored to win this tournament, but that she had already won several other men's events. Accord to this woman Michelle was "The best golfer in the world besides Tiger Woods." She was like 15 at the time.. maybe 16. Anyway, they were selling Michelle Wie calendars at the gift shop. I asked my wife "Who buys a calendar in July?" …  Tons of people. They bought them to get Michelle's autograph. Other people were there just to boo her. Some people actually thought that Michelle was not only taking a spot away from a male golfer who "Should be playing in the event." But also that "She's going to be allowed to play the forward tees." It was crazy. Of course the internet was huge back in 2005 but not everyone had it on their phone. This was still in the Blackberry Era. 

So half the people were booing her, half the people were cheering her like she was some kind of Amelia Earhart. But everything she did was scrutinized. On Friday she was just under the cut-line with 4 holes to go. I think she went like bogie, double-bogie, par, par and missed the cut by a stroke or two. Saturday and Sunday there was like half the crowd. But even then, people were wondering where she was. My wife and I had to tell like 3 or 4 people that she missed the cut. A couple of them looked at us like we just told them aliens had landed on the 18th green. 

I actually felt bad for her. She should have been in high school, earning a scholarship and kicking everyone's ass. In my opinion, it just messed her up. It took her a lot longer than it should have for her to learn how to close out a tournament. I think she would have won a lot more, a lot sooner if she would have been allowed to take a more "normal" path. She was way more talented than the majority of female players at the time. She should have been "the Chosen One", but she was rushed to the finish line without getting to take the journey… I say that but on the bright side I think Nike paid her like 20 million dollars a year back then... so, maybe I'm an idiot. 

$20 million sponsorship from Nike.... Just imagine if Wie had turned down that sponsorship, gone to college, gotten an education and then had gone on to have a golf career with the amount of success like she did. That wouldn't have turned out so well. When offered a sponsorship like that you always take the money, even at that young an age. Always.

Michelle's problem was her parents interfering. In 2014 Michelle's body started showing signs of wear. She had nagging injuries. She started withdrawing from tournaments in 2015. Then in 2018 she had a season-ending hand injury. She's only 30 years old. She was once able to drive the ball over 300 yds. as a teen, but then her swing was retrained to that restrictive type that they were teaching at the time.

Lydia Ko was 15 when she turned pro. I believe she was #1 in the world in the CME Rankings the following year. 

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43 minutes ago, DrvFrShow said:

$20 million sponsorship from Nike.... Just imagine if Wie had turned down that sponsorship, gone to college, gotten an education and then had gone on to have a golf career with the amount of success like she did. That wouldn't have turned out so well. When offered a sponsorship like that you always take the money, even at that young an age. Always.

Michelle's problem was her parents interfering. In 2014 Michelle's body started showing signs of wear. She had nagging injuries. She started withdrawing from tournaments in 2015. Then in 2018 she had a season-ending hand injury. She's only 30 years old. She was once able to drive the ball over 300 yds. as a teen, but then her swing was retrained to that restrictive type that they were teaching at the time.

Lydia Ko was 15 when she turned pro. I believe she was #1 in the world in the CME Rankings the following year. 

Full disclosure... I made up the $20 million number. I don't actually remember how much Nike paid her. … It was a lot. If I recall at one time she was in the top 10 or 15 highest paid golfers in the world (Male or Female). And she had yet to win a tournament. 

Anyway, I agree with you. The endorsement deal was too good to pass up. 

It's interesting. There was a recent issue of Golf or Golf Digest with a feature on Michelle Wie. She talked about how many things she and her father (agent at the time) messed up. She said she was trying not to regret anything. It was the first time for both of them going through it all together. Looking back now of course she do things differently, but now she has the benefit of experience on her side. I give her credit for recognizing her mistakes and trying to put them behind her. 

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15 minutes ago, ChetlovesMer said:

Full disclosure... I made up the $20 million number. I don't actually remember how much Nike paid her. … It was a lot. If I recall at one time she was in the top 10 or 15 highest paid golfers in the world (Male or Female). And she had yet to win a tournament. 

Anyway, I agree with you. The endorsement deal was too good to pass up. 

It's interesting. There was a recent issue of Golf or Golf Digest with a feature on Michelle Wie. She talked about how many things she and her father (agent at the time) messed up. She said she was trying not to regret anything. It was the first time for both of them going through it all together. Looking back now of course she do things differently, but now she has the benefit of experience on her side. I give her credit for recognizing her mistakes and trying to put them behind her. 

IIRC the actual figure was $10 million.

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On 2/26/2020 at 3:34 PM, Indy1954 said:

And you knocking down my opinion is stupid.

I speak my mind that's my right as an American but many Lb's nowdays only believe people have freedom of speech if they agree with them. If they don't then they don't have Freedom of Speech.

I do believe there are people who have read this thread and agree with my point but they do not have the guts to openly agree for fear of all the hassle from others.

No, that's not it! I'm as conservative as anybody around here, and have had my differences with @iacas in the past when I went beyond the pale. Your interpretation of the 1st Amendment is completely out of bounds. 

I have watched the LPGA for years. I started out as a fan of Carol Mann! Then there was Pat Bradley, Dottie Mochrie (now Pepper), Beth Daniels, Julie Inkster, Nancy Lopez, Annika, Carrie, Paula, Laurena, Michelle, and on and on.

And I watched John Daly when he was in his prime, but no longer. Why do I want to watch him wiggling like a blob of Jello in his follow through? 

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3 hours ago, DrvFrShow said:

1)Michelle's problem was her parents interfering. 

2) Lydia Ko was 15 when she turned pro.

 

1) Agree...but it was BJ's interference...Bo was simply a puppet following BJ's lead...it was BJ who ruled the roost.

2) Lydia was 16 when she turned pro in Oct 2013.

 

2 hours ago, DrvFrShow said:

IIRC the actual figure was $10 million.

Yes....I believe both Sony and Nike offered Wie $10M contracts.

We don't know the details...but those might have been 3 or 5 year contracts that might have maxed out at $10M total for each reaching certain milestones/performance standards for each contract.

I can't imagine Sony and Nike paying Wie $10M each year for each contract.

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2 hours ago, Buckeyebowman said:

And I watched John Daly when he was in his prime, but no longer. Why do I want to watch him wiggling like a blob of Jello in his follow through?

Because its funny.

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12 hours ago, DrvFrShow said:

$20 million sponsorship from Nike.... Just imagine if Wie had turned down that sponsorship, gone to college, gotten an education and then had gone on to have a golf career with the amount of success like she did. That wouldn't have turned out so well. When offered a sponsorship like that you always take the money, even at that young an age. Always.

Michelle's problem was her parents interfering. In 2014 Michelle's body started showing signs of wear. She had nagging injuries. She started withdrawing from tournaments in 2015. Then in 2018 she had a season-ending hand injury. She's only 30 years old. She was once able to drive the ball over 300 yds. as a teen, but then her swing was retrained to that restrictive type that they were teaching at the time.

Lydia Ko was 15 when she turned pro. I believe she was #1 in the world in the CME Rankings the following year. 

She did get to go to Stanford and graduate. I thought that was the smartest thing she did because she will always have that degree. Golf is Hard ™️, as a friend of ours reminds us. Injuries, competition and time can all knock you off the top regardless of how good you are. Think of all the Worlds Number 1 the LPGA has had in the last 10 years. None have held on for long.

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3 hours ago, boogielicious said:

She did get to go to Stanford and graduate. I thought that was the smartest thing she did because she will always have that degree. 

Yes....good for her to want to attend Stanford and enjoy campus life and obtain something she wanted...a Stanford degree...but the degree has minimal value of any future career goals.

I suspect we'll never see the return of MW to competitive....new family ahead and her body is so damaged for high level golf.

We might see her in the odd charity or pro-am event and she may do a bit of TV work.

If anyone has seen MW at any LPGA events in the past decade...it looked like a grind for her...she didn't really appeared enthusiastic..add to that BJ's constant hovering over her to make sure she practices too......when she clearly wanted to leave the course and go do something else for the rest of the day.

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On 2/28/2020 at 11:40 PM, snapfade said:

Because its funny.

Come on, man! He jiggles more than Tim Herron in a tutu! 

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3 minutes ago, Buckeyebowman said:

Come on, man! He jiggles more than Tim Herron in a tutu! 

 

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On 2/28/2020 at 9:18 PM, Buckeyebowman said:

No, that's not it! I'm as conservative as anybody around here, and have had my differences with @iacas in the past when I went beyond the pale. Your interpretation of the 1st Amendment is completely out of bounds. 

I have watched the LPGA for years. I started out as a fan of Carol Mann! Then there was Pat Bradley, Dottie Mochrie (now Pepper), Beth Daniels, Julie Inkster, Nancy Lopez, Annika, Carrie, Paula, Laurena, Michelle, and on and on.

And I watched John Daly when he was in his prime, but no longer. Why do I want to watch him wiggling like a blob of Jello in his follow through? 

His interpretation, like most people's, is so out of bounds it's not even on the same golf course.

The 1st Amendment applies to Congress and the establishment of laws restricting speech.  It has nothing to do with bulletin board posts or the repercussions of what is said in daily life.

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On 3/2/2020 at 10:12 AM, 3jacker said:

His interpretation, like most people's, is so out of bounds it's not even on the same golf course.

The 1st Amendment applies to Congress and the establishment of laws restricting speech.  It has nothing to do with bulletin board posts or the repercussions of what is said in daily life.

EXACTLY! 

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On 3/2/2020 at 10:12 AM, 3jacker said:

His interpretation, like most people's, is so out of bounds it's not even on the same golf course.

The 1st Amendment applies to Congress and the establishment of laws restricting speech.  It has nothing to do with bulletin board posts or the repercussions of what is said in daily life.

Very true. I think many people deem losing their jobs, careers and maybe even being exiled from their current social environments as a breech in ‘freedom.’ It borderlines the rule/law to them.

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12 minutes ago, Vinsk said:

Very true. I think many people deem losing their jobs, careers and maybe even being exiled from their current social environments as a breech in ‘freedom.’ It borderlines the rule/law to them.

I'm sure that Scott Piercy is feeling a bit of that right now.  But as has been said, the Amendment limits what the government can do regarding free speech.  It doesn't say that individuals or non-governmental organizations cannot enforce their own limits, or react to what someone has said.

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10 minutes ago, DaveP043 said:

I'm sure that Scott Piercy is feeling a bit of that right now.  But as has been said, the Amendment limits what the government can do regarding free speech.  It doesn't say that individuals or non-governmental organizations cannot enforce their own limits, or react to what someone has said.

Yep. And I think that’s what so many people don’t get. 

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13 hours ago, Vinsk said:

Yep. And I think that’s what so many people don’t get. 

The beauty of your First Amendment is that it allows people like Piercy to show the world who they really are WITHOUT being punished or censured by the government. Any other sanction or loss of entitlement is about other companies and people not wanting to be associated with such ideas or folk who can't think for five seconds before posting/saying/ tweeting /retweeting. 

 

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