Rent/Buy a course

[Dan Vesma]

So, I've approached someone who has a course that they don't really want. The turnover is poor, and it needs a lot of investment. That said, greens aside, the course is lovely - mature parkland and of good length. The clubhouse is huge, big enough to fun as a small hotel perhaps.

My question to The Sand Trap: Would you consider changing where you play if a local course had a makeover and relaunched itself?

[iacas]

46 minutes ago, Dan Vesma said:

My question to The Sand Trap: Would you consider changing where you play if a local course had a makeover and relaunched itself?

I don't think you'll find many people who wouldn't say "yes" to that.

The only group of people who might not are those who are fairly deeply entrenched in a club membership. Maybe it's expensive, maybe it's a family legacy type thing… that sort of thing.

[Dan Vesma]

loyalty is a tricky thing - my instinct was that we tend to play where we play at least in part because we like the people that run the club and that we play with in comps etc, so wouldn't be so fungible in our choices

[billchao]

1 hour ago, Dan Vesma said:

loyalty is a tricky thing - my instinct was that we tend to play where we play at least in part because we like the people that run the club and that we play with in comps etc, so wouldn't be so fungible in our choices

If you belong to a club, maybe. Even then, I know plenty of people who have changed clubs for one reason or another.

[scotth]

I agree with @iacas I think most serious golfers would want to check it out.  I don't know if I would change where I play all the time, but I would for sure play a round or two to see what changes had been made.

After that I might or might not make a change.   If I liked it I might make it part of my rotation of courses I play.  Even though I live on a course and am a member, fortunately the fees are such that I don't feel like I should only be playing that course because it is so expensive.  

 

 

Edited August 26, 2017 by scotth

[CarlSpackler]

7 hours ago, Dan Vesma said:

My question to The Sand Trap: Would you consider changing where you play if a local course had a makeover and relaunched itself?

I would. Factors that make me decide to play a course or not are proximity, conditions, and cost. 

[boogielicious]

15 hours ago, CarlSpackler said:

I would. Factors that make me decide to play a course or not are proximity, conditions, and cost. 

And being below where the snow flies!

[Patch]

I always play a new, or reconditioned course when ever possible. In fact, lately I have been spending quite a bit of time on a reconditioned course that I use to play 2 or 3 times a week, before the rework was done. It plays completely different than before. 

I don't expect it replace my home course, since I am only 10 minutes from teeing off at my current home course. The reconditioned one is 45-60 minutes away. 

 

Edited August 27, 2017 by Patch

[CarlSpackler]

11 hours ago, boogielicious said:

And being below where the snow flies!

Honestly, courses in Ohio are much better than down here. 

[mcanadiens]

For me, cost is the number one factor with a bullet. Hence I play munis 95% of the time.

Obviously, other people have other priorities. Knowing the demographic you are trying pull is the key.

 

 

[jkelley9]

I think it completely (but not exclusively) depends on the demographic. 

A course being reconditioned here in this part of NC probably wouldn't get it's investment back. Lots of courses. Not a lot of money here in the Triad, and there's several good country clubs that are pretty reasonable.

If anybody ups the price even by a few bucks, people start playing elsewhere, unfortunately. 

My course did a good bit of reconditioning these past 2 years and I was happy to pay a little up-tick in price. But a lot of people didn't want to. Whatever, it was less crowded for me this year, then! 

[Lihu]

On 8/26/2017 at 6:15 AM, Dan Vesma said:

So, I've approached someone who has a course that they don't really want. The turnover is poor, and it needs a lot of investment. That said, greens aside, the course is lovely - mature parkland and of good length. The clubhouse is huge, big enough to fun as a small hotel perhaps.

My question to The Sand Trap: Would you consider changing where you play if a local course had a makeover and relaunched itself?

We have many courses in Southern CA, much like in UK. So, I don't have any affinity to playing specific courses. The two I play a lot are very convenient (5 minutes from work or 5 minutes from my home), and I don't necessarily have any loyalty to them. Nor would I change if either of them decided to do a makeover because of that reason.

If I was a member of one of the Country Clubs in my area, then I might have some desire to keep it the same as when I joined. Then again, I like to try new things all the time, so it probably wouldn't be an issue for me?

[Dan Vesma]

2 hours ago, Lihu said:

We have many courses in Southern CA, much like in UK. So, I don't have any affinity to playing specific courses. The two I play a lot are very convenient (5 minutes from work or 5 minutes from my home), and I don't necessarily have any loyalty to them. Nor would I change if either of them decided to do a makeover because of that reason.

I'd not even factored convenience into my thinking Lihu, that is super helpful feedback

20 hours ago, mcanadiens said:

For me, cost is the number one factor with a bullet. Hence I play munis 95% of the time.

Obviously, other people have other priorities. Knowing the demographic you are trying pull is the key.

 

The place I'm thinking of is the cheapest place for miles. Its a faded gem of a course.

[WUTiger]

First of all, up-front funding:

* Can you get a good deal on the course, or is the owner the sentimental type that wont' sell easily?
* Can you get funding to refurbish the course? Would local government help out, given it would be public access?

As far as drawing golfers go, if you have a good product and treat them decently you can probably make a go. The trouble with many single-owner public courses in the US is that owners are harsh to the members and want to lord over them. This makes golfers want to go elsewhere.

[David in FL]

On 8/28/2017 at 4:30 PM, Dan Vesma said:

I'd not even factored convenience into my thinking Lihu, that is super helpful feedback

The place I'm thinking of is the cheapest place for miles. Its a faded gem of a course.

There's a reason it's for sale...

[RussUK]

@Dan Vesma a good example would be Gotts Park in Leeds. In the last few years Leeds City Council decided to close two of its courses, Gotts Park being one, as they were running at an unsustainable loss.

The memebrs decided to buy the course and keep it open as a public course and in that they have done a great job, however, running a mature parkland course must be a struggle for them as when i last played earlier this year it wasnt a pleasant experience with almost bare bunkers, poorly marked holes and even no course information so you knew which green you were playing to on certain holes.

Yes, its was £10 for 18 so you get what you pay for and like @David in FL says there must be a reason, and in Gotts Parks case it was the fact the course had been run into the ground prior to the sale so it was always going to be an uphill struggle. I hope the new owners can turn it round.

There is an old saying "You cant polish a turd" (however Mythbusters prooved you can so i'll have to think of another saying )

[MSchott]

I am open to any course that I find interesting to play. My local muni is a fine course, always in good condition, an easy walk and architecturally interesting. The latter is more important to me than most golfers. IMO the worst part of your description is "mature parkland". To me that means too many trees. I'd need to find it more interesting than other courses in my area in order to switch. That's a tall task and likely quite expensive to accomplish.

[Dan Vesma]

On 06/09/2017 at 3:18 AM, David in FL said:

There's a reason it's for sale...

In this instance, the reason for the sale relates to another asset, not the course itself, but yes, I think thats generally good advice