Dress Codes: Good or Bad for the Game?

[mcanadiens]

Dress codes are fine for the country clubbers, but it will never fly at the sort of munis that I play. Anyone that can fork over the greens fees can get in line for the first tee. We don't even have tee times. The city turns nobody away short of violations of basic public decency laws.

 

[jamo]

I just wish I could wear a plain t-shirt. I've got a lot of solid color t-shirts with no logos that would look fine. Alas.

[bear996]

I'm with @mcanadiens when it comes to country clubs vs municipal courses.  Around here it's similar.  People at municipal courses try to at least wear collared shirts.  I've only actually played our local 9 hole executive course but even there people typically wear collared shirts during the round.  As a newbie I'm still just trying to fit in, so figured my dress shorts and a polo suffice.  Still don't bother tucking it in though.  

[iacas]

7 hours ago, arab_joe said:

Do you have these studies to hand?

They're all over the place and easy to find. Go for it. They're a big part of the reason some schools have a dress code and why some other schools have a uniform.

Besides, TONS of places have dress codes, stated or unstated. Church is often cited; their dress code is almost always unstated, but well understood. Offices have dress codes. Schools. Restaurants. Even retail shops often have a "no shirt, no shoes, no service" dress code. Bowling alleys don't allow street shoes beyond a certain point. The list goes on and on and on and on.

7 hours ago, arab_joe said:

I am genuinely intrigued, as I have never seen such a correlation; some of the most unpleasant characters I have ever had the misfortune of being paired up with have been the best dressed, and vice versa.

For all you know, they'd have behaved worse had they dressed worse. Plus, I doubt you've got a truly random sampling, or an even sampling across the board. And… it's not about the exceptions, but the general. Exceptions exist for almost any rule.

7 hours ago, arab_joe said:

I'm also curious as to why a dress code is so significant to you?

Yeah, sorry, I don't know what you're talking about. Nothing I said implies that it's at all significant to me.

I made the case why it might be significant to a business. I just told the juniors participating in the Junior Elite program that they can't wear sweatpants, but the reasons there are largely practical: it's tougher to get good video for analysis when clothes are super baggy.

I don't care what others wear on the golf course, but I like to dress well (and as a PGA person, I'm often expected to), and I can see the business arguments for having a dress code.

4 hours ago, RJN12 said:

I’d rather see a more flexible attitude but some standards. It’s already an expensive sport to get into, and clothing adds a bunch to the threshold.

It can be as expensive as you want to make it, but you don't have to get name brand stuff, and you don't have to get 10 different outfits. Plus, there are almost always courses with more relaxed dress codes around.

[saevel25]

16 minutes ago, iacas said:

I don't care what others wear on the golf course, but I like to dress well (and as a PGA person, I'm often expected to), and I can see the business arguments for having a dress code.

Pretty much my opinion on it.

---

It isn't that big to ask a person to wear a collared shirt and not to wear blue jeans or cargo shorts. I don't get the people who make a big stink about it.

[DeadMan]

5 hours ago, RussUK said:

Dress code is good but it has to be consistent accross the board. There has to be a middle ground that all clubs can achieve and its not really that hard. I know many people who say its too expensive but thats just a cop out. You dont have to get golf specific, hight tech fabric clothing. Im a good example

Trousers: £8 from Asda

Shirt: £5 from Sports Direct

Socks £3.99 for a 7 pack at Primark

So £16.99 for a full "outfit" excluding shoes (go for the best in your budget). I've seen guys play in flip flops and thats just stupid and dangerous.

This is a good point. I can put together a full golf-appropriate outfit at Target for $30 pretty easily. You don't have to go full tour pro and wear a $125 polo. $15 golf polo and golf shorts at Target get the job done just fine.

[NM Golf]

I will say this, it was sure nice being at Pinehurst this past weekend because of the dress code, everyone looked nice dressed up just a bit. Perhaps I am old fashioned but its just pleasant to be in a place like that. I myself like to look nice, I always dress nicely on the golf course, even at the muni where I work I wouldn't be caught dead wearing cargos and a tee shirt. The one main reason is my golf shirts, shorts, and pants were designed for golf. They breath, they stretch appropriately, they are way more comfortable than cargo shorts and a tee shirt. And as Erik said there is literally no material known to man less suitable for an athletic endeavor than denim. 

Again, people can wear what they want. I personally don't understand why someone would want to dress like a slob on the golf course, but I support their right to do so at the appropriate venue. 

[mailman]

This is one of those can't win arguments 

There have been threads on this forum where people were taking the p1ss out of someone exactly because they dressed like a "professional" golfer YET here we have people now taking the p1ss out of anyone who dares to not dress tidily on a course 

Personally, I don't mind throwing on longs and a tidy shirt when playing in a competition. Conversely if I want to shoot out and play a few holes after work then I just wear what ever shorts Ive got on and a tee shirt and just go for it. doesn't hurt anyone AND we have enough issues with people not repairing divots even though we have a dress code  in force at my club!

Also, why do people have it in for jeans? I reckon these are fine as they are just as tidy as dress trousers these days.

So, where am I going with this? Well, IF I owned the course I am a member at Id do away with the dress code requirements. If people want to dress like professional golfers or a homeless man then so be it. As long as they actually respect the course, play the game in the spirit, have a good time and most importantly of all SPEND money over the bar then Im fine with that.

Regards

Mailman

[iacas]

2 minutes ago, mailman said:

YET here we have people now taking the p1ss out of anyone who dares to not dress tidily on a course 

I don't think that's a fair characterization.

2 minutes ago, mailman said:

Also, why do people have it in for jeans? I reckon these are fine as they are just as tidy as dress trousers these days.

I think that's two simple reasons:

• They're horrible for athletics, as literally the post above yours says.
• They're far, far closer to the "casual" end of the scale than the "formal" end of the scale.

2 minutes ago, mailman said:

So, where am I going with this? Well, IF I owned the course I am a member at Id do away with the dress code requirements. If people want to dress like professional golfers or a homeless man then so be it. As long as they actually respect the course, play the game in the spirit, have a good time and most importantly of all SPEND money over the bar then Im fine with that.

You might find that to be a bad business decision, as you may lose more play/members than you'd gain.

[bear996]

As far as it being expensive, I just put together an outfit on eBay for $30.46, including shipping.  It's a Reebok golf polo and Ben Hogan shorts.  You can find golf polo's for $9 a piece, so the whole expensive argument is kind of invalid. 

[Groucho Valentine]

Ive always been ambivalent about dress codes in golf. Their neither good or bad for the game. I usually adhere to whatever policy a tournament or course has, but I personally don't care if someone chooses to wear jeans or whatever else on the course. What does matter to me if they follow the common etiquette of the game, but i don't consider what someone wears apart of that. I find that people that get really hung up on dress codes are really just passive/aggressively expressing some exclusionary belief they have about golf in general. I was told i had to change or leave at a course I played a course in massachusetts years ago (i forget the name of the place) because my belt wasn't brown or black. This course also didn't allow "boldly printed polos" or "voit colors"...whatever the hell that meant.  Granted, it was a blueblood type of place that probably hated the way younger players dress now. It was a private course, but get real. Shit like that is a joke.

Somebody could be dressed like a mannequin from a j-crew store or something, but if he is is a complete douchebag, that is going to rub me wrong way more than somebody wearing a t-shirt and jeans but is pleasant to play with and has good etiquette. I've found the former to be way more commonplace than the latter. 

Edited October 30, 2017 by Groucho Valentine

[Fourputt]

3 hours ago, saevel25 said:

Pretty much my opinion on it.

---

It isn't that big to ask a person to wear a collared shirt and not to wear blue jeans or cargo shorts. I don't get the people who make a big stink about it.

And I don't get the big stink about those of us who prefer not to have to wear something special just to play golf.

18 hours ago, iacas said:

Why? There is almost no other fabric less suitable to an athletic endeavor than denim. It doesn't warm as well as others. It's not flexible/stretchy. It doesn't dry quickly, and actively absorbs water. It's heavy and thick (what little warmth it provides comes from that).

 

I wore jeans for work, for hiking, for fishing, for skiing (with a liberal coating of ScotchGuard), and I wear them for golf when I can in cooler weather.  I've practically lived in jeans for 60 years during the cooler seasons.  They don't have to be skin tight - in fact I've never owned a pair that were - and the Wranglers I have in the closet now even have a stretch waistband.  Relaxed fit is comfortable, warm enough for most cool weather activities, and tough enough to take most of what I throw at them.  I realize that I'm talking to a wall on this topic, but there it is.

And, as I've stated before, I do abide by dress codes when necessary.  I just prefer when possible to live my life where there are none.

Edited October 30, 2017 by Fourputt

[iacas]

3 minutes ago, Fourputt said:

And I don't get the big stink about those of us who prefer not to have to wear something special just to play golf.

Nobody's made a big stink. Or even, really, a little stink, from what I've read. In the recent renewal of this topic, anyway.

Denim is a horrible material for athletic endeavors (call it an opinion if you want…). If you want to wear it, go for it. Doesn't matter to me in the slightest.

[NJpatbee]

I may have stated this in a different thread but here it is:  My father was an avid golfer that caddied at a local exclusive club during the Depression.  Even though he only had a chance to play on Monday's (Caddie's day during course maintenance) with home made or discarded member clubs he learned to respect the game and its traditions.  When we went to the driving range he wore standard golf clothes and I had to at least be in clean shorts and short sleeved collared shirt (Unfortunately I did not get interested until age 40) .  No one made us, but dressing up just a little seemed a proper way to show some respect to the game and its history even at the driving range.  I still today wear proper golf attire even if I play at a small course that does not require it.

And please folks, proper attire today is a collared polo and a decent pair of slacks or shorts!  When I play golf I dress like a golfer and it does not have to be expensive at all.  It may seem old fashioned to you but going to the course dressed neatly is for me a nod to the game, to my father, and to all the past greats in the game.  And before you assume that I was born with a silver spoon in my mouth my father was a plumber, I was the first generation in my family to get a college education, and I ran around Woodstock in torn jeans and dirty tee shirt in 1969.  There is a time and place IMO, and when I play golf I want to look like a golfer. 

[mcanadiens]

Of course, the famous Mr. Bunny had this solution to a certain skirt-wearing Scotsman. ... 

[Golfingdad]

3 hours ago, mailman said:

So, where am I going with this? Well, IF I owned the course I am a member at Id do away with the dress code requirements. If people want to dress like professional golfers or a homeless man then so be it. As long as they actually respect the course, play the game in the spirit, have a good time and most importantly of all SPEND money over the bar then Im fine with that.

My home course does exactly this.  It's an "upscale" public course - one of those very popular around here "member for a day" places that styles itself as a CC or resort even though it's neither - in all aspects except one; the dress code.  They have none.  In fact, they have a sign on the front door specifically stating that the atmosphere is relaxed and there is no dress code.

Yet, I don't know that I've ever seen somebody dressed poorly.  I can't say, other than kids, which they also highly encourage and promote, that I've seen somebody not dressed like you'd see everybody dressed at your typical "collared shirt and khakis" type place.

The greens fees are what drive the clientele and dress, not the dress code, in my opinion.

[Buckeyebowman]

On 6/27/2012 at 11:43 AM, walk18 said:

Never understood that one anyway. Unless its a private club where you have a locker, where the heck else are you supposed to change shoes?? On the first tee?

Do that in the parking lot, like the rest of us!

On 10/29/2017 at 7:01 PM, iacas said:

Why? There is almost no other fabric less suitable to an athletic endeavor than denim. It doesn't warm as well as others. It's not flexible/stretchy. It doesn't dry quickly, and actively absorbs water. It's heavy and thick (what little warmth it provides comes from that).

I have to agree. Wearing denim on my first river rafting trip nearly drowned me! I was so dumb! Then, once I got into my late 40's I discovered that I could no longer wear denim. It was too hot and sweaty in the Summer, and too damned cold in the Winter! Plus, when it got difficult to squeeze my ass into a pair of 501's, that kind of pulled the plug!

13 hours ago, mcanadiens said:

Dress codes are fine for the country clubbers, but it will never fly at the sort of munis that I play. Anyone that can fork over the greens fees can get in line for the first tee. We don't even have tee times. The city turns nobody away short of violations of basic public decency laws.

 

Like I said earlier. I dress "good enough for who it's for!"

12 hours ago, iacas said:

They're all over the place and easy to find. Go for it. They're a big part of the reason some schools have a dress code and why some other schools have a uniform.

 

Great points in the entire post, but this reminded me of something particular. If you remember any of the telecast of the Tour Championship at Eastlake. There was an extensive human interest segment on the community at Eastlake. The school kids there all wear uniforms! And they are incredibly successful. To the point that this model is being copied all across the country. Of course it's more than just the uniforms, but that lays the foundation.

I've seen broadcasts of successful school programs on Gary Player's ranch in South Africa, which encompasses quite a few villages that he builds schools for, and these schools feature a rigorous curriculum, discipline, and uniforms!

10 hours ago, bear996 said:

As far as it being expensive, I just put together an outfit on eBay for $30.46, including shipping.  It's a Reebok golf polo and Ben Hogan shorts.  You can find golf polo's for $9 a piece, so the whole expensive argument is kind of invalid. 

True that! You just need to know how to shop! I found Ben Hogan moisture wicking golf shorts at WalMart for 9 bucks apiece on close out! They were really nice and I bought 4 pair! I've also found a lot of nice pieces at Kohl's. Also, I figured out early on that cotton undies with moisture wicking shorts would still give you a case of the "swamp ass"! So, you need moisture wicking undies. Under Armour's were $28/pair! I searched around, and at KMart I found Hanes moisture wicking in a bonus pack of 4 pair for 14 bucks!

It's kind of amazing the changes that happen as you get older. I never used to pay attention. Now I do. I can look at a circular and know whether the price is good or "meh". I bought a gallon of milk today for $1.29! And it wasn't about to go out of date!

Edited October 31, 2017 by Buckeyebowman

[arab_joe]

On 10/30/2017 at 3:01 AM, iacas said:

It's insignificant to you. To me, it's not.

16 hours ago, iacas said:

They're all over the place and easy to find. Go for it. They're a big part of the reason some schools have a dress code and why some other schools have a uniform.

Besides, TONS of places have dress codes, stated or unstated. Church is often cited; their dress code is almost always unstated, but well understood. Offices have dress codes. Schools. Restaurants. Even retail shops often have a "no shirt, no shoes, no service" dress code. Bowling alleys don't allow street shoes beyond a certain point. The list goes on and on and on and on.

Yeah, sorry, I don't know what you're talking about. Nothing I said implies that it's at all significant to me.

I apologise, I misinterpreted your above post as meaning dress codes were significant to you.  If you were referring to the business side of golf courses, that would certainly be something interesting to read into, i.e. whether profits, participation, prestige etc. are positively or negatively impacted by relaxing dress codes.  I've never seen anything to suggest that a relaxed dress code was detrimental to a golf club, but am more than happy to be educated/corrected.  Especially as, from my personal experience (me alone; I am not claiming to know the ins and outs of every golf course on the planet...), I have seen the opposite - in St Andrews, for example, all of the private golf clubhouses have had to make changes to increase accessibility (i.e. no need for a jacket, denims allowed, soft spikes allowed) as they were losing so much business to the Links Trust clubhouses that allowed every man and his dog to come in for a pint and a pie.

Respectfully, I do not buy that there are multiple studies that show that: (i) behaviour on golf courses is better at golf courses that have dress codes; and (ii) the improvement in behavioural standards at those golf courses is down to the fact that there is a dress code.  The studies that you allude to, i.e. those about school children, are not a fair comparison.  A child that is obligated to attend school is in a completely different situation to anyone choosing which golf course to play at.  Children are often encouraged to wear a uniform so that they are not a target for bullies, so that rich and poor are indistinguishable, to teach discipline etc. - I doubt any golf course with a dress code with the same aim.

The analogy with bowling is more apt, but importantly my understanding is that their shoe rule is for the protection of the flooring - beyond that you're free to wear jeans, or shorts, or any other item that may or may not improve your bowling action.  It is up to the bowler.  

Although I personally always wear over-priced Footjoy polo shirts and wouldn't dream of swinging a club in jeans, I respect other golfers enough to think they deserve the autonomy to wear what they please.  Many golf traditions have fallen away, I hope dress codes will be next...